Old English Discussion

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NogueiraTrue
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Re: Old English Discussion

Postby NogueiraTrue » 2013-02-12, 2:03

I've found this book today, it may be very useful to people who want to learn Old English

http://www.e-reading-lib.org/bookreader ... nglish.pdf

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księżycowy
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Re: Old English Discussion

Postby księżycowy » 2013-02-12, 14:09

Interesting book. Thanks.

I think I'll start thumbing through A Guide to Old English at my leisure. Lately I've been dying to dive into some Old English texts, so that's what I shall do! :D

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Re: Old English Discussion

Postby krustenkaese » 2013-02-21, 15:24

Something I find problematic with the book NogueiraTrue linked is that it doesn't seem to mark the different pronunciations of c and g (i.e., sċ, ċ, ġ, ċġ). I'm using this book myself (bought a paper copy). Whilst it is more academic and a bit tedious at times, these ċs and ġs really do help pronunciation.

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Re: Old English Discussion

Postby JackFrost » 2013-02-21, 17:46

Mostly because the marks only serve to help learners to understand the phonological nature of Old English. After you're well familiar with the language, they're not used (it's a modern convention, not an original Anglo-Saxon one).
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krustenkaese
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Re: Old English Discussion

Postby krustenkaese » 2013-02-21, 18:44

JackFrost wrote:Mostly because the marks only serve to help learners to understand the phonological nature of Old English. After you're well familiar with the language, they're not used (it's a modern convention, not an original Anglo-Saxon one).


That is true. Just today in IRC, I kind of got that they seem to be redundant. However, I find it's a good thing for beginners... not that teaching someone what a front vowel is is that difficult either, though.

That being said, I'd love a surge of Ænglisc(/ċ ;) ) on the boards! It sure is more motivating to learn a language when you have opportunities to use it actively, rather than mere reading of old texts.

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sa wulfs
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Re: Old English Discussion

Postby sa wulfs » 2013-02-22, 0:40

I think palatal c/g, and vowel length, should only be noted in dictionaries and in the few first lessons of a grammar for beginners. They're artificial, and you're better off learning to read without that crutch in case you ever have to deal with an unstandardized text (or, god forbid, a manuscript).

Also, it's not always clear whether a c/g should be palatalized or not in a particular word or context, and different scholars have different opinions.
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Re: Old English Discussion

Postby spuntotheratboy » 2014-05-21, 8:59

So, I'm looking at "Samson" in Sweet's Primer, and here's a sentence that I'm having trouble with - that is, I know what it means, but as with an Ikea bookshelf, I seem to have parts left over when I've finished putting it together.

Him cōm þā gangende tō Godes ęngel, and cwæþ þæt hīe scolden habban sunu him ġemǣnne;

...there's more, but I'm pretty sure that's grammatically self-sufficient, and it's really only the first part I'm asking about.

What I don't get is what gangende tō is doing there. The sentence seems to work OK without it: "Then God's angel came to them..." with "to" expressed in the dative him. I haven't quite sussed the way movement is implied by case, movement towards vs movement at a place, so maybe that's where my problem is.

Either gangende is expressive of the angel's movement, and is the preposition pointing at him at the beginning of the sentence - but that seems like it's stretching the word order a bit - or is a prefix, and gangende tō is part of tō-gān (like a modern German separable verb) which should imply separation in some way, and which I can't seem to fit in semantically.

Thanks for your help. This is the sort of thing that makes me wish I had a teacher!
Ben

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sa wulfs
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Re: Old English Discussion

Postby sa wulfs » 2014-05-21, 11:13

I'd say your first theory is correct. The way I understand that sentence, him is indeed governed by to, and to him is just the normal complement of cuman when it means motion towards a person. Gangende is kinda redundant, but it can be interpreted as "walking". That particular word order, with the separation of the preposition and the word it governs, is not particularly uncommon in OE literature, especially with verbs of motion.

So, Him com þa gangende to Godes engel = Godes engel com to him gangende, in a more transparent (for modern ears) word order.
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Re: Old English Discussion

Postby spuntotheratboy » 2014-05-27, 21:36

Thanks, Hroðbeorht I really appreciate your taking the time to reply. What you say makes sense. As an NE speaker I find word order is the thing most likely to lead me astray - I just can't trust my instincts!

Thanks again.
Ben

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Re: Old English Discussion

Postby Babelfish » 2014-11-08, 18:05

... I give up. I love etymology, and while about 70% of English words actually originate from Latin AFAIK (many via Old French), still many come from Old English words - with much cooler spelling and those awesome þ, ð and æ :<3: Not to mention they were originally written with runes!

Tolkien also used runes, and scattered words like Mearas and Eorlingas made me suspect Old English crept into his writings, which is apparently confirmed by a quick Google search.

I've installed an Icelandic keyboard in order to be able to type þ, ð and æ easily, and looked for some online courses. Let the journey begin!
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Re: Old English Discussion

Postby Tumbleweed » 2016-03-24, 14:45

Eala,

I've been wanting to learn old English for months have finally recently started. I'm currenrtly learning the numbers and it says that 120 is 'hundtwelftig' i.e. 'one hundred and twelvety'. My question is this, after 120 is it hundðritig, hundfeowertig etc. or hundðreotienetig, hundfeowertienetig etc.?
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Re: Old English Discussion

Postby linguoboy » 2016-03-24, 15:41

According to this chart, the formula for 130 on is hund and X, i.e. hund and þrītig, hund and fēowertig, etc. I'll check this against my print grammars when I get home.
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Re: Old English Discussion

Postby Michael » 2018-02-10, 13:10

Hwæt! Æfter þǣre endenīehstan wīdmǣrsunge ārunnon nēah twā gēar. Ēalā! swā miclu ān hrēow, þæt swā fēawa leornien þæt wrastoste Ænglisc geþēode. Wolde mån gehycgan, þæt sculen māran Ængliscleorneras bēon, ac hiera andefn ofstent lȳtel. Ic dēme, þæt feorwitgeornas ne sīen…
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