Pauro wrote:Chao!
I'm confused about written proper names. Some are spelled just as in English (eg. Iceland) and some look more like Vietnamese (Ai-xơ-len). Which spelling is official? Or which is put on your maps? Could you explain this?
Pauro wrote:Chao!
I'm confused about written proper names. Some are spelled just as in English (eg. Iceland) and some look more like Vietnamese (Ai-xơ-len). Which spelling is official? Or which is put on your maps? Could you explain this?
Pauro wrote:You mean then, it's actually my choice to write English or hyphenated names?
Pauro wrote:I've never seen the word Rumany but Lỗ Ma Ni and Ru-ma-ni. I guess the second one was invented by uneducated folks, but the first one would be also from Chinese??
Pauro wrote:Thanks for an exhaustive reply.
You mean then, it's actually my choice to write English or hyphenated names? I assume the hyphenated way is considered to be more official as your capital is in the north?
Pauro wrote:I've never seen the word Rumany but Lỗ Ma Ni and Ru-ma-ni.
abcdefg wrote:The French filtered way, well I don't think it deserves much attention now since French's been sharply losing its influence here.
Pauro wrote:hyphenated names look original and different from any other languages, so you can instantly tell it's 'pure' Vietnamese
Pauro wrote:There are languages that eagerly fight with internationalism, like French does.
Draven wrote:Look at Esperanto - it's just ridiculous. Vaŝingtono? Romo? Londono? Nov-Jorko???? Io knowo allo nounso endo witho o'o ino Esperanto, buto that'so justo stupido.
draven wrote:The hyphen method mangles foreign names so badly that if you use it to teach kids they won't be able to recognize international names later on in their life.
draven wrote:The advantage of using Roman script is that you can incorporate international proper names into your language without blinking. It's foolishness not to see that.
Draven wrote:The French and their language have a historical foundation and justified pride to do so.
abcdefg wrote:Huh, are you expecting kids to remember names like Vladimir Ilyich Ulyanov, Ilya Nikolaevich Ulyanov without the Vietnamized sound-representing thing? Just pay attention to the complicated spellings. I remember seeing them in books for primary school children; at that age do you think they can remember such long 'weird' things, let alone writing and reading them properly?
abcdefg wrote:Don't worry about if they could recognize the original written form. When they know how it's pronounced, they'll know that's the word.
abcdefg wrote:But in Vietnamese, every syllable is represented as a separate word. This makes 'international proper names' look very strange, hard to remember and hard to use to the Average Joe. The purpose of language is to make people understand you; now if you can't even make them know what you're saying about, what's the point of employing foreign words?
abcdefg wrote:I'm saying that everything exists for a reason. The reason for using hyphen method is that it helps a lot more people, who for many reasons don't have a proper education, not become completely dumb. When the knowledge mean standard of Vietnamese people increases to a certain point, that 'barbaric' method will silently disappear. Actually it's gradually fading now, as there are more and more things received as 'common knowledge'.
abcdefg wrote:Draven wrote:The French and their language have a historical foundation and justified pride to do so.
Like you're saying a newborn baby less deserve to live than an adult, because he's newborn and weak.
You're underestimating children. Their young minds are no excuse for you not to teach them properly. And please take a second look - those Romanized Russian names are not that hard. You know what's hard? Teaching them in original Cyrillic alphabet.
Foreign names are NOT Vietnamese.
You're suggesting that we should come up with a device like the hyphen method to ease their pain, but you don't consider the fact that the pain is beneficial.
Draven wrote:I'm saying that a young child should take what adults, through their experience in life, have to offer
abcdefg wrote:I feel strongly that we're wasting our time here.
Psi-Lord wrote:Brasil over Bra-xin (and the, I assume, exotic Chinese-based Ba Tây) then?
Draven wrote:Psi-Lord wrote:Brasil over Bra-xin (and the, I assume, exotic Chinese-based Ba Tây) then?
So there you see the problem with that transliteration - the phonemes are not even right! "Bra-xin" suggests that the S in the original word must be read as /s/, while it's in fact /z/. Whoever came up with Bra-xin wasn't even aware of the fact that intervocalic single S's in Romance languages stand for /z/.
abcdefg wrote:Then try the Northern Bra-din
Draven wrote:abcdefg wrote:Then try the Northern Bra-din
You forgot that it could be written Bra-gin and all things would be clear.
Or better yet, Bra-zin. It's not like Vietnamese can't write or type Z.
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