Georgian language course...

D39 · Postby **D39** » 2007-08-21, 9:37

Though I saw that almost nobody enters this language forum for a load of time, I've decided to post a ''demo'' lesson... just in case this section here will revive (by a miracle) itself.

So... 1st of all... we'll have to settle a transcription system, due to the hardness of using and encoding of the standard georgian characters. I've thought that we can use the BGN (adopted by the United States Board on Geographic Names), as it's quite easy to be read and imposes no problems as there aren't any diacritics used.

And... to commence:

Here you have the romanization used.

Lesson:

Text:

A: Gamarjoba! - Hello (sg./inf.)! (lit. it comes from the adjective ''mardjve'' - curageous ---> ''gamarjveba'' - victory, which used with the Instrumental Case gives ''gamarjvebit'' - with the victory)
B: Gagimarjos! - Hello to you (sg./inf.)! (lit. and with you [may] the victory [be])
A: Rogora khar? - How are you (sg./inf.)?
B: Gmadlobt, k'argad! - Thank you (pl./for.), good/well!
B: Shen rogora khar? - And you? (lit. you how are?)
A: Mets ara mishavs! - I'm also good. (lit. I-also nothing to me)
A: Is rogor aris? - How is s/he?
B: Tsudad aris. - S/he is bad.
A: Tkven rogor khart? - How are you (pl./for.)?
B: Chven dzalian k'argad vart. - We are very good.
B: Tkven rogora khart? - And you (pl./for.)?
A: Me avad var. - I'm sick.
A: Isini rogor arian? - How are they?
B: Isini k'argad arian. - They are good.

Grammar:

1.The personal pronouns:

Singular:
me - I
shen - you
is - s/he, it

Plural:
chven - we
tkven - you
isini - they

2.Declension of the personal pronouns:

1st person:
Singular:
Nominative (Sakhelobiti) me
Narrative (Motkhrobiti) me
Dative (Mitsemiti) me
Genitive (Natesaobiti) chemi

Plural:
N. chven
Na. chven
D. chven
G. chveni

2nd person:
Singular:
N. shen
Na. shen
D. shen
G. sheni

Plural:
N. tkven
Na. tkven
D. tkven
G. tkveni

3rd person:
Singular:
N. is
Na. man
D. mas
G. misi

Plural:
N. isini
Na. mat
D. mat
G. mati

3.Conjugation of verb ''aris'' - to be, in the Present:
me v-ar*
shen kh-ar
is ar-is

chven v-ar-t
tkven kh-ar-t
isini ar-i-an

*The bolded letters represent the personal marks of the personal pronouns used in the conjugation. They help us know which person does the action without the verb to be accompanied by any of the personal pronouns.

The marks usualy are:

1st person:
Singular: v-root
Plural: v-root-t

2nd person:
Singular: kh/--root
Plural: kh/--root-t

3rd person:
Singular: root-s/a/o/-
Plural: root-es/en/an/nen/n

Note 1: In the Present tense, the form of ''aris'' at the 3rd person singular can be contracted to the form ''-a'' (added at the end of the word it determines):

adamiani aris - it's a man - adamiania
kalaki aris - it's a city - kalakia

Note 2: Also, the personal pronouns can be removed from the conjugation, as all persons have different marks (Eg. v-[t] for the 1st person...), so:

''Shen rogora khar?'' can be simply ''Rogora khar?''

For the 1st lesson I haven't yet prepared any exercises, but as we'll go through and learn the vocabulary there will gonna be some 2 - 4 exercises.

In hope that my no pro and little course makes any breakthrough, I'll continue posting new lessons regularily. See ya!

E}{pugnator · Postby **E}{pugnator** » 2007-08-23, 0:15

That's from the Georgian Intensive Course, which is in Russian, right?

Why not post the Georgian alphabet instead of Romanization?

gift · Postby **gift** » 2007-08-23, 5:58

could you offer an intro into the georgian alphabet?

Preno · Postby **Preno** » 2007-08-23, 12:54

Well, let me be the dissenting voice and say that I find it a refreshing change not to have to learn the alphabet before starting with the interesting stuff, i.e. the language itself. I think for an introduction to the language, a transcription is more than enough and makes it much easier to learn (at least for me).

D39 · Postby **D39** » 2007-08-23, 15:16

E}{pugnator wrote:That's from the Georgian Intensive Course, which is in Russian, right?

Don't remeber really... It's a course I took last year, for wich I still have the notebooks.

E}{pugnator wrote:Why not post the Georgian alphabet instead of Romanization?

Well... I gave the answer at the begining of the course:

we'll have to settle a transcription system, due to the hardness of using and encoding of the standard georgian characters. I've thought that we can use the BGN (adopted by the United States Board on Geographic Names), as it's quite easy to be read and imposes no problems as there aren't any diacritics used.

gift wrote:could you offer an intro into the georgian alphabet?

I could... but it's better that u tell me what u want to know abt it... 'cuz I can blabber a whole lot on this. OK?

Preno wrote:Well, let me be the dissenting voice and say that I find it a refreshing change not to have to learn the alphabet before starting with the interesting stuff, i.e. the language itself. I think for an introduction to the language, a transcription is more than enough and makes it much easier to learn (at least for me).

That's what I thought so... what we're doing here it's learning the language itself... not writing it... at least not for now... 'cuz I know when some enthusiastic ''disciples'' want to learn a language like this they almost allways get stuck with the alphabet and quit learning... Dontcha think so?

So... it's better learn some stuff 1st... and after that we'll have plenty of time to learn the alphabet, k?

And to finish... Shall I continue the lessons? :roll:

nicofr · Postby **nicofr** » 2007-08-23, 15:51

D39 wrote:And to finish... Shall I continue the lessons?

please yes

nettchelobek1 · Postby **nettchelobek1** » 2007-08-23, 16:49

And to finish... Shall I continue the lessons?

da, vă rog!

D39 · Postby **D39** » 2007-08-24, 8:42

OK, people! I'm so glad to see that u're really interested in this stuff. So... let's commence lesson 2.

Meore gak'vetili (the 2nd lesson):

T'ekst'i (text):

A: Gaitsanit, es chemi kmaria. - To introduce you, this is my husband. (lit. know him, this_here is my husband).
B: Siamovnebit! - My pleasure! (lit. pleasure-with; the t is from the Instrumental Case 'with').
B: Gaitsanit, es chemi tsolia. - To introduce you, this is my wife.
A: Dzalian sasiamovnoa tkveni gatsnoba. - It is very nice to know/meet you.
B: Is vazhi sheni shvilia? - This boy/lad is your son? (lit. He boy is your son).
A: Diakh, chemi shvilia, gaitsanit! - Yes, it's my son, to introduce you!
B: Vin aris es gogona? - Who is this girl?
A: Es gogona chemi kalishvilia, Nino. - This girl is my daughter, Nino.
A: Shen itsnob Ninos? - Do you know Nino?
B: Diakh, me vitsnob Ninos. - Yes, I know Nino.
B: Gaitsanit, es chemi dzmaa! - To introduce you, this is my brother!
A: Me mas vitsnob. - I know him.
B: Sheidzleba tkveni gatsnoba? - Is it possible to get to know you? (lit. Possible you I-you-know).
A: Tu sheidzleba gamatsanit tkveni megobari? - If you don't mind, may you introduce me your friend? (lit. if possible...)
B: Siamovnebit! - My pleasure!

Gramat'ik'a (grammar):

1.The possesive pronouns:

In their Nominative form they are formed by adding ''i'' to the Nominative form of the personal pronoun (except 1st person sg. and 3rd person sg./pl.):

shen-you (sg.) --> sheni-your...

Declension of the possesive pronouns (sg.):

N. chem-i shvil-i - my son:
Chemi shvili didia - My son is big.
Na. chem-ma shvil-ma - my son:
Chema shvilma k'argi iq'o - My son was good.
D. chem-s shvil-s - my son:
Vutser tserils chems shvils - I'm writing a letter to my son.
G. chem-i<s>s</s> shvil-is - my son's:
Es chemi shvilis avt'omobilia - This is my son's automobile.

Note: It is possible that the possesive pronouns stay after the nouns: deda (mother), mama (father), bidza (uncle), babua (grandfather), mamida (father's sister), deida (mother's sister), natlia (godfather, godmother). In this case the two words are written as one:

<s>chemi</s> mama - my father --> mamachemi

2.The pronoun ''is'' - s/he, it; that:

When used with a verb this pronoun is read as ''s/he, it'':

is aris - s/he, it is

But when used without a verb, in the company of a npun it's a demonstrative pronoun denoting somebody/thing far from the speaker, that:

is kali - that woman.

3.Particles ''vin'' ans ''ra'':

vin means who - it's used with (human) beings:

Vin aris es k'atsi? - Who is this man? / Es chemi shvilia. - This is my son.

ra means what - it's used with all of the other nouns:

Ra es?* - What's this? / Es kalakia. - This is a city. (remmember the ending ''a'' for the 3rd pers. of ''aris'')

*In the case of using these particle, the verb ''aris'' can me ommited.

The verb ''to know'':

As you probably have seen, there are quite a lot of forms of ''to know'' used in this lesson's text (e.g. gaitsanit, gatsnoba, itsnob...). This is due to the fact that in georgian there are multiple uses of this verb depending on the circumstances:

gaitsanit - to introduce (lit. to [get to] know[n] to/with somebody)
gatsnoba - acquaintance, to acquaint with, to familiarize with
gamatsanit - introduce (imperative) me to somebody

Today we'll take care of the conjugation of the form ''vitsnoba'' - ''I know him'':

Singular:
me v-itsnob mas - I know him/her/it
shen itsnob mas - you know him
is itsnob-s mas - s/he, it knows him

Plural:
chven v-itsnob-t mas - we know him
tkven itsnob-t mas - you know him
isini itsnob-en mas - they know him

Leksik'oni (vocabulary):

visi - whose
sad - where
p'uri - bread
puli - money
ts'q'ali - water
sakhli - house
k'ari - door
panjara - window
tsa - sky
mze - sun
mtavre - moon
varsk'vlavi - star

Varjishebi (exercises):

1.Translate into georgian:

Who is this? - This is my son.
Where is he? - He is in the house. (in is a particle ''shi'' added at the end of the determined word - if the word ends in ''i'', the ''i'' falls; georgian makes no difference between a and the).
What is that? - That is the sun.
Whose automobile is that? - That automobile is mine. (this could be a bit hard, but hope u can handle it)
What is that? - That is bread.
I know your uncle.
He knows my son.

2.Make 5 simple sentences using the verb ''to know''.

E.g. Vitsnob sheni tsoli. - I know your wife.

3.Fill in the correct form:

Me ... tkveni deda.
Isini ... chemi mama.
Tkven ... mati gogona.
Shen ... misi tsoli.
Is ... sheni bidza.

Good luck!

nettchelobek1 · Postby **nettchelobek1** » 2007-08-27, 4:01

Well, here is my attempt.

Varjishebi

Vin aris es? – Es chemi shvilia.
Sad aris es? – Es aris sakhlshi.
Ra es? – Es mzea.
Visi avt’omobilia? – Is avt’omobilia chveni.
Ra es? – Es p’uria.
Me vitsnob bidzasheni.
Is itsnobs chemi shvili.

5 examples with the verb “to know”
-Vitsnobt misi natlia.
-Shen istnob chemi deda?
-Itsnoben chven?
-Vitsnobt is adamiani.
-Itsnobs chemi sakhli?

3.Fill in the correct form:

Me vitsnob tkveni deda.
Isini itsnoben chemi mama.
Tkven itsnobt mati gogona.
Shen itsnob misi tsoli.
Is itsnobs sheni bidza.

D39 · Postby **D39** » 2007-08-27, 7:26

nettchelobek1 wrote:Sad aris es? – Es aris sakhlshi.

Here u could have also said ''Es sakhlshia.''

Ra es? – Es mzea.

Ra is? - What is that?

Visi avt’omobilia? – Is avt’omobilia chveni.

Visi is avt'omobilia? - Is chemi avt'omobilia

Ra es? – Es p’uria.

again ''is'' - that

Me vitsnob bidzasheni.
Is itsnobs chemi shvili.

5 examples with the verb “to know”
-Vitsnobt misi natlia.
-Shen istnob chemi deda? dedachemi
-Itsnoben chven? - not quite... here u have entered the most sensible feature of the georgian grammar, the pluripersonalism. So to say ''Do they know us?'' u say ''Mitsnoben chven?''. We'll talk abt that a bit further.
-Vitsnobt is adamiani.
-Itsnobs chemi sakhli? - the sentence's form is correct, but u have to use another verb for that: Itsis chemi sakhli?.

3.Fill in the correct form:

Me vitsnob tkveni deda.
Isini itsnoben chemi mama.
Tkven itsnobt mati gogona.
Shen itsnob misi tsoli.
Is itsnobs sheni bidza.

What can I say... Great job for the 1st lessons! Hope u'll keep on! And congrats for breaking the ice!

Preno · Postby **Preno** » 2007-08-27, 16:02

I'm part way through lesson #2, been a bit busy these days. Two comments so far:

- it would be better if you also included a vocabulary for the words included in the text. It would be much easier to learn this way.

- are you sure about the genitive cases of pronouns ending in -i? Wiki says it's -s.

D39 · Postby **D39** » 2007-08-27, 16:21

Preno wrote:I'm part way through lesson #2, been a bit busy these days. Two comments so far:

- it would be better if you also included a vocabulary for the words included in the text. It would be much easier to learn this way.

Well... OK... but I thought it's a loss of time since u have them explained in the translation.

- are you sure about the genitive cases of pronouns ending in -i?

I'm abt 200% sure... I think that there it's already declensed... Dunno...

Wiki says it's -s.

Preno · Postby **Preno** » 2007-08-27, 18:35

D39 wrote:Well... OK... but I thought it's a loss of time since u have them explained in the translation.

I believe it's much easier to learn if there is an explicit list of all the words in the lesson. At least for me it is. Of course, if I'm the only one who thinks it would be helpful, no problem.

- are you sure about the genitive cases of pronouns ending in -i?

I'm abt 200% sure... I think that there it's already declensed... Dunno...

I don't understand what you mean by "there it's already declensed" - of course it is, it is in the genitive!

This page also says it's "chven(s)", "tkven(s)" etc.

zhiguli · Postby **zhiguli** » 2007-08-27, 21:49

well i'm glad that someone has taken an interest in reviving this forum, but i have a few comments.

i have this book and it's a masterpiece of chaos. if you're going to copy from it at least try to re-organize it in a more coherent way. of course to be able to do this is not a simple matter of shuffling things around, it has to be done in a deliberate way.

second, i don't really understand what "difficulties" there could possibly be in using georgian script. use transcription if you must, but why not include the georgian script alongside it?

and i can't help notice all the mistakes, and that the dative case got all but ignored, when it's the whole point of this lesson.

D39 wrote:Ra is? - What is that?

you can't drop the verb "to be" here
ra aris is? is ra aris? is raa?

D39 wrote:Visi is avt'omobilia? - Is chemi avt'omobilia

is visi avtomobilia?

D39 wrote:5 examples with the verb “to know”
-Vitsnobt misi natlia.
-Shen istnob chemi deda? dedachemi

vitsnob mis natlias, dedachems,

D39 wrote:not quite... here u have entered the most sensible feature of the georgian grammar, the pluripersonalism. So to say ''Do they know us?'' u say ''Mitsnoben chven?''. We'll talk abt that a bit further.

not fair introducing trick questions like this. anyway it should be "gvitsnoben"

D39 wrote:-Vitsnobt is adamiani.

im adamians.

demonstrative pronouns also decline in dative: chems, chvens, am (es) im (is) and so on...

D39 wrote:Note: It is possible that the possesive pronouns stay after the nouns: deda (mother), mama (father), bidza (uncle), babua (grandfather), mamida (father's sister), deida (mother's sister), natlia (godfather, godmother). In this case the two words are written as one:

<s>chemi</s> mama - my father --> mamachemi

it's only possible with the names of certain relatives. and why didn't you correct this in part 3?

D39 wrote:Varjishebi (exercises):

i'm pretty sure it should be "savarjishoebi", at least this is what i've seen in georgian books (and elsewhere, like in this japanese lesson for georgian speakers). but don't take my word for it...

omer984 · Postby **omer984** » 2007-08-31, 14:35

hi I am really interested in georgian language. I have been learning it for about 6 months.
I will definitely follow the course.

D39 · Postby **D39** » 2007-12-25, 14:56

Gilotsavt Kristes dabadebis dghes!

helen che · Postby **helen che** » 2008-02-29, 19:53

:)) wrote:
D39 wrote:OK, people! I'm so glad to see that u're really interested in this stuff. So... let's commence lesson 2.

Meore gak'vetili (the 2nd lesson):

T'ekst'i (text):

A: Gaitsanit, es chemi kmaria. - To introduce you, this is my husband. (lit. know him, this_here is my husband).
B: Siamovnebit! - My pleasure! (lit. pleasure-with; the t is from the Instrumental Case 'with').
B: Gaitsanit, es chemi tsolia. - To introduce you, this is my wife.
A: Dzalian sasiamovnoa tkveni gatsnoba. - It is very nice to know/meet you.
B: Is vazhi sheni shvilia? - This boy/lad is your son? (lit. He boy is your son).
A: Diakh, chemi shvilia, gaitsanit! - Yes, it's my son, to introduce you!
B: Vin aris es gogona? - Who is this girl?
A: Es gogona chemi kalishvilia, Nino. - This girl is my daughter, Nino.
A: Shen itsnob Ninos? - Do you know Nino?
B: Diakh, me vitsnob Ninos. - Yes, I know Nino.
B: Gaitsanit, es chemi dzmaa! - To introduce you, this is my brother!
A: Me mas vitsnob. - I know him.
B: Sheidzleba tkveni gatsnoba? - Is it possible to get to know you? (lit. Possible you I-you-know).
A: Tu sheidzleba gamatsanit tkveni megobari? - If you don't mind, may you introduce me your friend? (lit. if possible...)
B: Siamovnebit! - My pleasure!

Gramat'ik'a (grammar):

1.The possesive pronouns:

In their Nominative form they are formed by adding ''i'' to the Nominative form of the personal pronoun (except 1st person sg. and 3rd person sg./pl.):

shen-you (sg.) --> sheni-your...

Declension of the possesive pronouns (sg.):

N. chem-i shvil-i - my son:
Chemi shvili didia - My son is big.
Na. chem-ma shvil-ma - my son:
Chema shvilma k'argi iq'o - My son was good.
D. chem-s shvil-s - my son:
Vutser tserils chems shvils - I'm writing a letter to my son.
G. chem-i<s>s</s> shvil-is - my son's:
Es chemi shvilis avt'omobilia - This is my son's automobile.

Note: It is possible that the possesive pronouns stay after the nouns: deda (mother), mama (father), bidza (uncle), babua (grandfather), mamida (father's sister), deida (mother's sister), natlia (godfather, godmother). In this case the two words are written as one:

<s>chemi</s> mama - my father --> mamachemi

2.The pronoun ''is'' - s/he, it; that:

When used with a verb this pronoun is read as ''s/he, it'':

is aris - s/he, it is

But when used without a verb, in the company of a npun it's a demonstrative pronoun denoting somebody/thing far from the speaker, that:

is kali - that woman.

3.Particles ''vin'' ans ''ra'':

vin means who - it's used with (human) beings:

Vin aris es k'atsi? - Who is this man? / Es chemi shvilia. - This is my son.

ra means what - it's used with all of the other nouns:

Ra es?* - What's this? / Es kalakia. - This is a city. (remmember the ending ''a'' for the 3rd pers. of ''aris'')

*In the case of using these particle, the verb ''aris'' can me ommited.

The verb ''to know'':

As you probably have seen, there are quite a lot of forms of ''to know'' used in this lesson's text (e.g. gaitsanit, gatsnoba, itsnob...). This is due to the fact that in georgian there are multiple uses of this verb depending on the circumstances:

gaitsanit - to introduce (lit. to [get to] know[n] to/with somebody)
gatsnoba - acquaintance, to acquaint with, to familiarize with
gamatsanit - introduce (imperative) me to somebody

Today we'll take care of the conjugation of the form ''vitsnoba'' - ''I know him'':

Singular:
me v-itsnob mas - I know him/her/it
shen itsnob mas - you know him
is itsnob-s mas - s/he, it knows him

Plural:
chven v-itsnob-t mas - we know him
tkven itsnob-t mas - you know him
isini itsnob-en mas - they know him

Leksik'oni (vocabulary):

visi - whose
sad - where
p'uri - bread
puli - money
ts'q'ali - water
sakhli - house
k'ari - door
panjara - window
tsa - sky
mze - sun
mtavre - moon
varsk'vlavi - star

Varjishebi (exercises):

1.Translate into georgian:

Who is this? - This is my son.
Where is he? - He is in the house. (in is a particle ''shi'' added at the end of the determined word - if the word ends in ''i'', the ''i'' falls; georgian makes no difference between a and the).
What is that? - That is the sun.
Whose automobile is that? - That automobile is mine. (this could be a bit hard, but hope u can handle it)
What is that? - That is bread.
I know your uncle.
He knows my son.

2.Make 5 simple sentences using the verb ''to know''.

3.Fill in the correct form:

Me ... tkveni deda.
Isini ... chemi mama.
Tkven ... mati gogona.
Shen ... misi tsoli.
Is ... sheni bidza.

Good luck!

you have some mistakes there... moon is mtvare
shen - you
me - me
tkven - you (more then one)
is - him, her...

me vitsnob shens tsols - I know your wife

is (he/she) itsnobs (knows) mas (him/her)

hi im helen from Georgia. let me correct some sent. my son was good-chemi chvili kárgi i'qo.
Isini ... chemi mama isnt right. isini=they if u want to say he is my father =is aris chemi mama
hven v-itsnob-t mas - we know him
chven vitsnobt mas=we know him

helen che · Postby **helen che** » 2008-03-01, 9:45

D39 wrote:
nettchelobek1 wrote:Sad aris es? – Es aris sakhlshi.

Here u could have also said ''Es sakhlshia.''

Ra es? – Es mzea.

Ra is? - What is that?

Visi avt’omobilia? – Is avt’omobilia chveni.

Visi is avt'omobilia? - Is chemi avt'omobilia

Ra es? – Es p’uria.

again ''is'' - that

Me vitsnob bidzasheni.
Is itsnobs chemi shvili.

5 examples with the verb “to know”
-Vitsnobt misi natlia.
-Shen istnob chemi deda? dedachemi
-Itsnoben chven? - not quite... here u have entered the most sensible feature of the georgian grammar, the pluripersonalism. So to say ''Do they know us?'' u say ''Mitsnoben chven?''. We'll talk abt that a bit further.
-Vitsnobt is adamiani.
-Itsnobs chemi sakhli? - the sentence's form is correct, but u have to use another verb for that: Itsis chemi sakhli?.

3.Fill in the correct form:

Me vitsnob tkveni deda.
Isini itsnoben chemi mama.
Tkven itsnobt mati gogona.
Shen itsnob misi tsoli.
Is itsnobs sheni bidza.

What can I say... Great job for the 1st lessons! Hope u'll keep on! And congrats for breaking the ice!

Ra es? – Es mzea.
es ra aris? or ra aris es?

Me vitsnob bidzasheni.incorrect=me vitsnob bidzashens

Vitsnobt misi natlia.inc.=vitsnobt mis natlias

Is itsnobs chemi shvili. incorrect=is itsnobs chems shvils

do u know my mother? =itsnobt dedachems?
do u know that man/?= itsnobt im adamians?
Me vitsnob tkveni deda. -me vitsnob tkven dedas, or dedatkvens
Isini itsnoben chemi mama. -isini itsnoben mamachems
Tkven itsnobt mati gogona. -tkven itsnobt mat gogonas
Shen itsnob misi tsoli. - shen itsnob mis tsols
Is itsnobs sheni bidza.[-isini itsnoben bidzashens, or shens bidzas

Zorba · Postby **Zorba** » 2008-03-01, 10:30

გმადლობთ!

Thank you for making those corrections, Helen.

They'll be useful for any learners.

helen che · Postby **helen che** » 2008-03-01, 11:50

Zorba wrote:გმადლობთ!

Thank you for making those corrections, Helen. They'll be useful for any learners.

You are welcome

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