internet vocabulary

[geoff]

朋友们好！

How about starting a little collection of internet-related words/phrases in Chinese? Many dictionaries, especially older ones, don't feature this yet.

For example:
* internet
* website
* homepage
* to surf
* to click a link
* to do an internet search
* to read/send email
* forum
* to post on a forum
* to blog
* to log on
* to chat
...

好主意吗。

geoff

[勺园之鬼]

That might be a good idea... I can share some knowledge about this subject. Now I think about it, this is right these words are not in my dictionaries. You can probably find some of them on online dictionaries though?

* internet = 因特网、互联网. short: 网 but with other words only (verbs, etc)
to go on the Internet, to browse the Internet, to be connected to the Internet = 上网
* website = 网站
* homepage = 网页
in terms of Internet, 站 usually refers to a site, and 页 to a single page
* to surf = 上网, see above
* to click a link = 点击 (like what is written on links, click here to download: 点击下载)
now I think about it:
to download = 下载
to upload = 上载
a file = 文件
software = 软件
hardware = 硬件
(but these last 2 must be on dictionaries, I believe)
* to do an internet search = to do a search, general term = 搜索
* to read/send email
to check one's mails = 查邮件 (check one's mails)、查邮箱 (check one's mailbox)
to send mail = 发邮件 (发 is used in some cases, including electronic mails. for post mails, 寄 would be correct)
* forum = 论坛 (the terms "讨论区、讨论会" are sometimes found but they're not really 'proper')
* to post on a forum = 在论坛上发帖子 (在论坛上 = on a forum, 发 = post, 帖子 = messages)
* to blog = blog doesn't really exist as a verb... the word for the noun is 博客 (that's a loanword)
* to log on = 登录
to log off = 登出
to register = 注册
user/username (as in forms) = 用户、用户名 (both can be used as usernames, the latter meaning 'the name of the user' if such a difference can be made)
password = 密码
* to chat = 聊天
chat(room) = 聊天室
...

Sorry I am too lazy to add the pinyin...

好主意吗。

This 吗 here doesn't fit with your remark... If you want really to write down the sound "ma5" you would say in such a case, you have to write 嘛, else it is a spelling mistakes (but even many Chinese often do this mistake too, so don't worry ). Using "吧" in this sentence would probably be better...

Now there is a question I want to ask you: is this for your own use, or to translate parts and bits of the website?

[geoff]

勺园之鬼, 谢谢你！

You can probably find some of them on online dictionaries though?

Probably. I tend to use cedict, which sometimes seems to give several versions, where I am not sure which is more common, or things are just missing.

好主意吗。

This 吗 here doesn't fit with your remark... If you want really to write down the sound "ma5" you would say in such a case, you have to write 嘛, else it is a spelling mistakes (but even many Chinese often do this mistake too, so don't worry ). Using "吧" in this sentence would probably be better...

Now there is a question I want to ask you: is this for your own use, or to translate parts and bits of the website?

I will be wanting to use it personally, but I thought it will also be interesting for people wanting to learn chinese, and I'll make a wiki page out of it eventually.

About my question, I later thought of rephrasing it as:
好主意，是吗？
My longer alternative would have been
这是不是好主意？
Would those have been any better?

geoff

[勺园之鬼]

I tend to use cedict, which sometimes seems to give several versions, where I am not sure which is more common, or things are just missing.

Yes, cedict is good. And there are other correct dictionaries to be found online, like the one by 金山/Kingsoft or [url=http://dict.cn/"]Dict.cn[/url]. Not to mention Wenlin, a software (available for Windows and Mac OS) many Unilangers seem to use...

好主意吗。

This 吗 here doesn't fit with your remark... If you want really to write down the sound "ma5" you would say in such a case, you have to write 嘛, else it is a spelling mistakes (but even many Chinese often do this mistake too, so don't worry ). Using "吧" in this sentence would probably be better...

Now there is a question I want to ask you: is this for your own use, or to translate parts and bits of the website?

I will be wanting to use it personally, but I thought it will also be interesting for people wanting to learn chinese, and I'll make a wiki page out of it eventually.

About my question, I later thought of rephrasing it as:
好主意，是吗？
My longer alternative would have been
这是不是好主意？
Would those have been any better?

geoff

Hmm, perhaps I was too picky - the point was not to make you worry so much about it as it's not this important.
In this sentence "好主意，是吗？" I would also use the other 嘛 if I was to write it, or better: 吧. They all fit in this sentence, but the meaning varies a little. When you use "吗", that is a real question, you expect an answer. Whenever you use "嘛" or more specifically "吧", you are merely expecting/waiting for approbation.
No need to lose more time on this as it's not really relevant... I shouldn't have insisted on it on the first place.

Tell me if you need help with other types of vocabulary you can't find in dictionaries (believe, after you reach some level, there is a lot you can't find in dictionaries, no matter how good they may be).

[geoff]

And there are other correct dictionaries to be found online, like the one by 金山/Kingsoft or [url=http://dict.cn/"]Dict.cn[/url]. Not to mention Wenlin, a software (available for Windows and Mac OS) many Unilangers seem to use...

Not the linux users.

Hmm, perhaps I was too picky - the point was not to make you worry so much about it as it's not this important.
In this sentence "好主意，是吗？" I would also use the other 嘛 if I was to write it, or better: 吧.

But the matter interested me. 吧 I know, but not 嘛.

Here is the wiki page:
[wiki]Chinese internet expressions[/wiki]

geoff

[Psi-Lord]

Not sure if this is totally relevant, but I thought it'd be interesting to share the little my grammar book says about those.

吧 - marker of a rhetorical question or a suggestion:

昨天的音乐会不错吧？
他是你弟弟吧？
吃饭吧！

嘛 - marker of persuasion or to emphasize the obvious:

你跟我一块儿去嘛！
是星期天嘛！办公室当然没人。

It also lists 咯 as a marker of obviousness:

下雨咯。

But that would be going off topic.

[geoff]

Psi-Lord: wouldn't you like to start a wiki page on Chinese particles?

Speaking of which, there doesn't seem to be a Chinese expression for "Wiki", does there? At least here I didn't spot anything obvious: http://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wiki

geoff

[Psi-Lord]

Psi-Lord: wouldn't you like to start a wiki page on Chinese particles?

I'd love to, but the only info I've got on that is my grammar book, and the author never really goes into more details than a simple description and a couple of examples. I might try and rephrase the explanations, so it wouldn't be a full copy, but I wouldn't be able to come up with different examples myself.

Speaking of which, there doesn't seem to be a Chinese expression for "Wiki", does there? At least here I didn't spot anything obvious: http://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wiki

Maybe just using the first two characters of 维基百科? Or have I misunderstood what you meant, geoff?

[geoff]

I'd love to, but the only info I've got on that is my grammar book, and the author never really goes into more details than a simple description and a couple of examples. I might try and rephrase the explanations, so it wouldn't be a full copy, but I wouldn't be able to come up with different examples myself.

Well, we can always asks natives (or fluent speakers) to provide examples to certain topics, but what natives usually can't do very well is explain the grammar.

Speaking of which, there doesn't seem to be a Chinese expression for "Wiki", does there?

Maybe just using the first two characters of 维基百科? Or have I misunderstood what you meant, geoff?

维基百科 seems to be a half-phonological name for "Wikipedia", but that doesn't mean that 维基 stands for the wiki "idea/technology". Maybe it will catch on, but there are other wikis than Wikipedia.

geoff

[Psi-Lord]

Well, we can always asks natives (or fluent speakers) to provide examples to certain topics, but what natives usually can't do very well is explain the grammar.

Here's a basic list I've just written, then:

[wiki]Sentence final particles[/wiki]

Anyone may feel free to rewrite the text, though—I'm not terribly happy with it myself.

[勺园之鬼]

Hehe, wow, I missed quite a lot...

And there are other correct dictionaries to be found online, like the one by 金山/Kingsoft or [url=http://dict.cn/"]Dict.cn[/url]. Not to mention Wenlin, a software (available for Windows and Mac OS) many Unilangers seem to use...

Not the linux users.

You cannot use Wenlin on Linux indeed, but the dictionaries I mentioned are online dictionaries... So they work on Linux as well.

About the Wiki, it seems I cannot edit it because of some problems I don't really understand.

Not sure if this is totally relevant, but I thought it'd be interesting to share the little my grammar book says about those.

吧 - marker of a rhetorical question or a suggestion:

昨天的音乐会不错吧？
他是你弟弟吧？
吃饭吧！

嘛 - marker of persuasion or to emphasize the obvious:

你跟我一块儿去嘛！
是星期天嘛！办公室当然没人。

It also lists 咯 as a marker of obviousness:

下雨咯。

But that would be going off topic.

Yes, these are very interesting to know. They are very colloquial and to be used in speech mostly. Does your grammar have anything about 呗? I would say out of its use that this is also a marker of obviousness, but the one you can use after proving something in a sentence. Let me think of an example (improvisation)...

—你这个菜做得不好！ (You don't cook this dish well!)
—那你下次自己做呗！ (Then next time do it yourself!)

—我今天忙得很，没有时间和她见面。 (Today I'm very busy, I haven't time to see her)
—你赶快给她打个电话呗！ (Quick give her a phone call!)

(Sorry for the translations in unnatural broken English )

Speaking of which, there doesn't seem to be a Chinese expression for "Wiki", does there? At least here I didn't spot anything obvious: http://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wiki

Yes, there is, as Psi-Lord said it, it's 维基. In "维基百科", the translation of Wikipedia, "维基" is a phonetic transcription if "Wiki", and "百科" means "the hundred sciences", this is short for "百科全书" which means Encyclopaedia. The transcription for Wiki is much more phonetic than it can be semantic, so don't worry about using it for the Wiki here. This is how Chinese would (and do) translate it.

Well, we can always asks natives (or fluent speakers) to provide examples to certain topics, but what natives usually can't do very well is explain the grammar.

I'm far from being a native, but I learnt most of the Chinese I know when speaking it and reading it, not from grammar books. Afterwards I checked a few grammar books, but I'm afraid I would be pretty bad at explaining the grammar as well...

[勺园之鬼]

Here's a basic list I've just written, then:

[wiki]Sentence final particles[/wiki]

Anyone may feel free to rewrite the text, though—I'm not terribly happy with it myself.

I can load the Wiki but I don't know what is wrong with it, and how come it messes up so much when I try to login. Anyway:

啦 — used to indicate doubt, impatience or annoyance

This is right, but 啦 is also perceived to be and mostly used as if it was "了 + 啊".

I am not sure to which extent these particles are dialectal or parts of the standard, but I have to say I heard some only in given areas, and others much more often in some areas than in others...

[Psi-Lord]

啦 — used to indicate doubt, impatience or annoyance

This is right, but 啦 is also perceived to be and mostly used as if it was "了 + 啊".

I am not sure to which extent these particles are dialectal or parts of the standard, but I have to say I heard some only in given areas, and others much more often in some areas than in others...

Just in case you wonder, these are the examples the author gives:

好啦！好啦！我都动啦！
已经九点啦。他当然下班了！

I guess I can 'get' the feeling of 了 + 啊, though.

[勺园之鬼]

Just in case you wonder, these are the examples the author gives:

好啦！好啦！我都动啦！
已经九点啦。他当然下班了！

I guess I can 'get' the feeling of 了 + 啊, though.

Exactly! Especially in the sentence "已经九点啦。", it is obvious that "啦" can be replaced with "了" (and even has to, grammatically speaking, as "已经九点" by itself sounds wrong).