Holiday music

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awrui
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Re: Holiday music

Postby awrui » 2019-12-01, 1:55

Johanna wrote:
Linguaphile wrote:(smi-sme) Juovlasálbma
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jF63SNACRZk

They use that melody for a Christmas hymn in North Sami :shock:

In Swedish, Härlig är jorden is commonly sung at funerals, and even when not, it has nothing to do with Christmas.


They use that melody for a funeral hymn in Swedish :shock:

It's a christmas song in Norway. It'd be weird to use it at a funeral.

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Naava
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Re: Holiday music

Postby Naava » 2019-12-01, 10:08

awrui wrote:
Johanna wrote:
Linguaphile wrote:(smi-sme) Juovlasálbma
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jF63SNACRZk

They use that melody for a Christmas hymn in North Sami :shock:

In Swedish, Härlig är jorden is commonly sung at funerals, and even when not, it has nothing to do with Christmas.


They use that melody for a funeral hymn in Swedish :shock:

It's a christmas song in Norway. It'd be weird to use it at a funeral.

It's a Christmas song in Finland, too. Looks like Sweden is the odd one out! :D

Linguaphile
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Re: Holiday music

Postby Linguaphile » 2019-12-01, 17:21

Naava wrote:
awrui wrote:
Johanna wrote:
Linguaphile wrote:(smi-sme) Juovlasálbma
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jF63SNACRZk

They use that melody for a Christmas hymn in North Sami :shock:

In Swedish, Härlig är jorden is commonly sung at funerals, and even when not, it has nothing to do with Christmas.


They use that melody for a funeral hymn in Swedish :shock:

It's a christmas song in Norway. It'd be weird to use it at a funeral.

It's a Christmas song in Finland, too. Looks like Sweden is the odd one out! :D


That's pretty funny. Sweden, I think you're not just outnumbered here, but also surrounded. Saami in the north, Norway to the west and Finland to the east all use it for Christmas. Estonia and Denmark use it as a Christmas song too.
(According to Wikipedia, Denmark uses it for both Christmas and funerals: synges ikke kun til jul, men også til mange begravelser "sung not only for Christmas, but also for many funerals.")

(fi) Toivioretkellä
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ddCiwOaz_zM

(fi) Maa on niin kaunis
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAO-WbFPReM

(et) Maa on nii kaunis
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DT3lI6aFr0c

(da) Dejlig er jorden
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DNWah7ueyc8

Linguaphile
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Re: Holiday music

Postby Linguaphile » 2019-12-01, 17:26

Southern Saami

(smi-sma) Jåvlemoere (Christmas Tree)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=akRBj7FzrLg

(smi-sma) Lahkoe jåvlh (Merry Christmas)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eLHibYrDhQg

(smi-sma) Buerie jïjjie laavlome jåvle-aajjan (Christmas Evening Song)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r8rw1XroPhU&t=1s

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Naava
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Re: Holiday music

Postby Naava » 2019-12-01, 17:49

One of my favourite Christmas songs, Himlen i min famn, in Swedish, Finnish, and English:

(sv) Himlen i min famn
https://youtu.be/SE-bDIYlDXo

(fi) Taivas sylissäni
https://youtu.be/iCB3EPkzWco

(en) Heaven in my arms
https://youtu.be/CG5oZxR9E1Q

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Johanna
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Re: Holiday music

Postby Johanna » 2019-12-01, 18:52

Linguaphile wrote:
Naava wrote:
awrui wrote:
Johanna wrote:
Linguaphile wrote:(smi-sme) Juovlasálbma
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jF63SNACRZk

They use that melody for a Christmas hymn in North Sami :shock:

In Swedish, Härlig är jorden is commonly sung at funerals, and even when not, it has nothing to do with Christmas.


They use that melody for a funeral hymn in Swedish :shock:

It's a christmas song in Norway. It'd be weird to use it at a funeral.

It's a Christmas song in Finland, too. Looks like Sweden is the odd one out! :D


That's pretty funny. Sweden, I think you're not just outnumbered here, but also surrounded. Saami in the north, Norway to the west and Finland to the east all use it for Christmas. Estonia and Denmark use it as a Christmas song too.
(According to Wikipedia, Denmark uses it for both Christmas and funerals: synges ikke kun til jul, men også til mange begravelser "sung not only for Christmas, but also for many funerals.")

I think Denmark was the first country to adopt it as a hymn officially, so let's just blame that country for the discrepancy :twisted:

in Swedish, the lyrics are sort of hopeful, but also fit very well with Christian funerals, in that Heaven is a nice place and all. Mostly it's really about pilgrims...

Härlig är jorden,
härlig är Guds himmel,
skön är själarnas pilgrimsgång.
Genom de fagra
riken på jorden
gå vi till paradis med sång.

"Wonderful is the Earth,
wonderful is God's heaven,
beautiful is the souls' pligrimage.
Through the fair
kingdoms on Earth
we go/walk to Paradise singing."
Swedish (sv) native; English (en) good; Norwegian (no) read fluently, understand well, speak badly; Danish (dk) read fluently, understand badly, can't speak; Faroese (fo) read some, understand a bit, speak a few sentences; German (de) French (fr) Spanish (es) forgetting; heritage language, want to understand and speak but can't.

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Naava
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Re: Holiday music

Postby Naava » 2019-12-01, 19:16

Johanna wrote:in Swedish, the lyrics are sort of hopeful, but also fit very well with Christian funerals, in that Heaven is a nice place and all. Mostly it's really about pilgrims...

Härlig är jorden,
härlig är Guds himmel,
skön är själarnas pilgrimsgång.
Genom de fagra
riken på jorden
gå vi till paradis med sång.

"Wonderful is the Earth,
wonderful is God's heaven,
beautiful is the souls' pligrimage.
Through the fair
kingdoms on Earth
we go/walk to Paradise singing."

That's almost identical to the Finnish lyrics:

The Earth is so beautiful
The God's sky/heaven is bright
Lovely/wonderful is the souls' pilgrimage
Through the world
We wander singing
Travelling towards heaven

Time flies
The years go by
Generations fall into oblivion
The heavenly chord
Of the souls' song
Remains forever bright

First the angels
Sang to the shepherds
From soul to soul it echoes:
Glory to the Lord,
Peace on Earth,
For Jesus brought us mercy.

----
I can see why that could be used in funerals, but I guess it's the last verse that makes it Christmassy. :) And since all of our Christmas songs are about someone being dead or dying or miserable anyway, one funeral hymn fits in just fine. Ok just kidding, but it's true though! I don't know why we have so many sorrowful Christmas songs.

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Re: Holiday music

Postby Linguaphile » 2019-12-01, 19:49

Johanna wrote:in Swedish, the lyrics are sort of hopeful, but also fit very well with Christian funerals, in that Heaven is a nice place and all. Mostly it's really about pilgrims...

Härlig är jorden,
härlig är Guds himmel,
skön är själarnas pilgrimsgång.
Genom de fagra
riken på jorden
gå vi till paradis med sång.

"Wonderful is the Earth,
wonderful is God's heaven,
beautiful is the souls' pilgrimage.
Through the fair
kingdoms on Earth
we go/walk to Paradise singing."


From Schönster Herr Jesu to Eeuwen geleden: The strange voyage of a Silesian melody through Denmark and Sweden to the Netherlands
From the article:
The Swedish translation stays close to the Danish version, the only change being that the final
three lines have been altered. In Sweden the song rapidly acquired a huge popularity, not only
as a Christmas song, but - rather surprisingly- as a funeral hymn (in which case the third
stanza is occasionally dropped). According to a poll conducted in 1997, Härlig är jorden is no
less than ‘den allra vanligaste psalmen vid begravingsgudstjänster i Svenska kyrkan’ (the
most popular song for funerals in the Church of Sweden); in a study suitably called Gå vi till
paradis med sång (2002) the theologist Anna J. Evertsson explains this particular popularity
on the basis of the song’s hopeful content and consoling words.


Naava wrote:I can see why that could be used in funerals, but I guess it's the last verse that makes it Christmassy. :)

From the article: "as a funeral hymn (in which case the third stanza is occasionally dropped)" :ohwell:

Third stanza in Swedish:
Änglar den sjöngo
Först för markens herdar.
Skönt från själ till själ det ljöd:
Människa, gläd dig,
Frälsarn är kommen,
Frid över jorden Herren bjöd.

Angels first sang to shepherds on earth;
beautiful was the sound they made:
'Man, be joyful, the redeemer has come;
the Lord has sent peace on earth.'
Translation source. But "skönt från själ till själ det ljöd" is more like "beautifully from soul to soul it resounded" isn't it? Or like Naava's translation from Finnish "from soul to soul it echoes." :hmm: In any case "Be joyful, the Savior has come, the Load has called for peace on earth" sounds quite Christmassy to me, regardless of how it is translated.

More from the article quoted above:
After being discovered and published in 1842 by Hoffmann von Fallersleben and Ernst
Richter, the Silesian song of praise Schönster Herr Jesu was adapted in 1850 during the First
Schleswig War by the Danish poet Bernhard Ingemann as a pilgrims’ hymn, Dejlig er jorden,
a song that was to become very popular in Scandinavian countries, above all in Sweden under
the title of Härlig är jorden, both a cheerful Christmas song and a consoling funeral hymn.
Probably on the base of the third stanza of the Swedish translation of the Danish song, another
radical adaptation was published in 1915 by the Dutch author of childrens’ books Catharina
van Hille-Gaerthé, this time as the pastoral Christmas song Eeuwen geleden, in which a desire
for peace was expressed that in 1915 may have been as urgent as it had been to Ingemann in
1850, as it still is to all of us in the year 2008. In the process, some odd misunderstandings
occurred. In 1850 Ingemann was very much inspired by the idea of adapting an old German
crusaders’ hymn, whereas in 1915 Van Hille-Gaerthé was convinced she was dealing with a
medieval Swedish Christmas tune. Motivated by these misunderstandings both authors wrote
moving lyrics that until the present day are sung to the beautiful Silesian melody by millions
of people throughout Scandinavia and the Netherlands.


Dutch version:
(nl) Eeuwen geleden
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d3g2JvzvfRw

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Re: Holiday music

Postby xBlackHeartx » 2019-12-02, 3:43

Isn't it common for religious songs to be played at both funerals and Christmas time? Then again, religion isn't really much a part of American Christmas anymore. Americans honestly find it strange how non-Christians often see it as a Christian holiday. In America, Christmas is really nothing more than a celebration of capitalism in the modern age, even if everyone knows it started as a religious holiday. Also, its the closest thing to a religious holiday America has (churches often put on crucifixion plays around Christmas, though this is mainly an effort to remind people of what the holiday is actually supposed to be about). As for others, American Halloween has become completely divorced from religion, while Easter is just about Easter egg hunts. Its connection to Christianity is almost a trivia thing now... And yes, there's Saint Patrick's Day, but few Americans have any idea who Saint Patrick was. Its just a day to wear green and tease those who don't. Its hard to see it a major holiday to be honest, even if 'saint' is in the name. And yes, there's also Saint Valentines day, but again, no one knows who Saint Valentine was. On top of this, its common for people to just call it Valentines day (at least Saint Patrick's Day always keeps the 'saint' part, aka you never hear it called Patrick's Day).

Linguaphile
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Re: Holiday music

Postby Linguaphile » 2019-12-02, 5:03

xBlackHeartx wrote:Isn't it common for religious songs to be played at both funerals and Christmas time?

In my experience, the prominent ones are usually different religious songs though. Certain music makes me think of Christmas, certain music makes me think of funerals. I wouldn't want to mix them.

xBlackHeartx wrote:Americans honestly find it strange how non-Christians often see it as a Christian holiday.

I'm not really sure how to respond to this statement except to say that it hasn't been true in my experience. Also, many Americans are non-Christians (which is one reason I find this statement especially hard to respond to). Suffice it to say, most Americans I know consider Christmas a Christian holiday, whether or not they are Christian themselves and whether or not they celebrate the religious and/or secular aspects of Christmas.

xBlackHeartx wrote:churches often put on crucifixion plays around Christmas

Nativity plays.

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Re: Holiday music

Postby xBlackHeartx » 2019-12-02, 5:11

Linguaphile wrote:
xBlackHeartx wrote:Isn't it common for religious songs to be played at both funerals and Christmas time?

In my experience, the prominent ones are usually different religious songs though. Certain music makes me think of Christmas, certain music makes me think of funerals. I wouldn't want to mix them.

xBlackHeartx wrote:Americans honestly find it strange how non-Christians often see it as a Christian holiday.

I'm not really sure how to respond to this statement except to say that it hasn't been true in my experience. Also, many Americans are non-Christians (which is one reason I find this statement especially hard to respond to). Suffice it to say, most Americans I know consider Christmas a Christian holiday, whether or not they are Christian themselves and whether or not they celebrate the religious and/or secular aspects of Christmas.

xBlackHeartx wrote:churches often put on crucifixion plays around Christmas

Nativity plays.


The plays I've seen tend to focus more on his death than birth. Yeah, Christmas is supposed to be a celebration his birth, but of course his death is normally considered the most important part of his life. I've sometimes seen plays that start with someone narrating the story of his birth, but then moves on to his death afterwards.

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Johanna
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Re: Holiday music

Postby Johanna » 2019-12-02, 6:57

Church of Sweden puts on Nativity plays at Christmas and Crucifixion ones at Easter. Or rather, Betrayal ones at Easter, no one wants to act out actual actual torture and death...

In any case, different holidays, different things celebrated. And when it comes to Christmas, most of it is Pagan or just plain old traditional anyway, including its Swedish name (Jul).

Linguaphile wrote:From Schönster Herr Jesu to Eeuwen geleden: The strange voyage of a Silesian melody through Denmark and Sweden to the Netherlands
Naava wrote:I can see why that could be used in funerals, but I guess it's the last verse that makes it Christmassy. :)

From the article: "as a funeral hymn (in which case the third stanza is occasionally dropped)

We sang all three at my paternal grandfather's funeral, so...
Swedish (sv) native; English (en) good; Norwegian (no) read fluently, understand well, speak badly; Danish (dk) read fluently, understand badly, can't speak; Faroese (fo) read some, understand a bit, speak a few sentences; German (de) French (fr) Spanish (es) forgetting; heritage language, want to understand and speak but can't.

Linguaphile
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Re: Holiday music

Postby Linguaphile » 2019-12-02, 14:17

Christmas song in Mixteco

(mix) Navidad
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yK3XMNyj8FE

awrui
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Re: Holiday music

Postby awrui » 2019-12-02, 16:03

Linguaphile wrote:
xBlackHeartx wrote:Americans honestly find it strange how non-Christians often see it as a Christian holiday.

I'm not really sure how to respond to this statement except to say that it hasn't been true in my experience. Also, many Americans are non-Christians (which is one reason I find this statement especially hard to respond to).


Wait- isn't that country founded by religious colonists and now run by hardcore evangelical old men? In a country where you have so many christian extremists and catholic immigrants I find it hard to believe that it is not known as a religious holiday...

But I find *murican christmas weird generally. What's up with that fat old house invader, stockings and red-deer looking reindeer??? Also that colour coding of red-white-green. Actually, some shops here have started selling items labled as "christmas red".

xBlackHeartx
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Re: Holiday music

Postby xBlackHeartx » 2019-12-02, 18:12

awrui wrote:
Linguaphile wrote:
xBlackHeartx wrote:Americans honestly find it strange how non-Christians often see it as a Christian holiday.

I'm not really sure how to respond to this statement except to say that it hasn't been true in my experience. Also, many Americans are non-Christians (which is one reason I find this statement especially hard to respond to).


Wait- isn't that country founded by religious colonists and now run by hardcore evangelical old men? In a country where you have so many christian extremists and catholic immigrants I find it hard to believe that it is not known as a religious holiday...

But I find *murican christmas weird generally. What's up with that fat old house invader, stockings and red-deer looking reindeer??? Also that colour coding of red-white-green. Actually, some shops here have started selling items labled as "christmas red".


The people who founded the country were religious, yes, though that was normal at the time. Most of the people who colonized America came to escape persecution from Catholics. This is why the nation has 'freedom of religion'; they wanted the nation to be a place where you could be any religion you wanted. Of course, in practice this just meant any non-Catholic christian. Its often debated today whether or not the founding fathers meant 'freedom of religion' as we see it now, or just 'be any denomination you want'. Also, catholics are considered a minority group here, so they're not exactly common, even if they do exist.

As for who rules the country, yes, we have an evangelical party who currently rules the country. Well, depends on what you count as 'evangelical'. In reality, they're all just corrupt businessmen whose policies are dictated by who gives them the biggest bribes. Also, most of their supporters are either nationalistic or (now-a-days) racist. Yeah, they tend to be Christian, but that's just because its tradition, and they hate the idea of the country changing, regardless of whether its for better or worse.

As for 'nativity' plays in America, I find it surprising Swedes don't actually depict the crucifixion. Of course, here that part just involves some guy, pretending to be Jesus, lying on a cross on the floor, and screaming while another guy (often dressed as a roman soldier) hits the floor with a hammer a few times right next to him. I don't think I've ever seen a play where they actually tied someone to a cross though. I think after that part they just jump ahead to where his tomb is discovered empty. Also, come to think of it, I've never seen a play where they depicted what happened after his resurrection. Essentially, the crucifixion part is the main event. Of course, you have to keep in mind that Americans are kinda desensitized towards violence (as I'm sure everyone can see in the media we put out).

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Re: Holiday music

Postby Linguaphile » 2019-12-03, 2:56

Back to the topic of this thread - music!
This time I'll post some songs in Hmong, first some Christmas songs and then New Year songs.

Christmas songs:

(hmn) Tswv Yexus Yog Kev Vaam Tshab
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ij6FYkPT3gA

(hmn) Hmo Muaj Hmoo Zoo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XXq1vbKCoUk

(hmn) Ncu Txug Christmas
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s6nGBdl89s8

(hmn) Christmas Tsis Muaj Koj
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hh0z2cB6ij4

Linguaphile
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Re: Holiday music

Postby Linguaphile » 2019-12-03, 2:59

Hmong songs for the New Year celebration
For most Hmong-speakers, New Year is the most important celebration of the year.

(hmn) Xyoo Tshiab Rov Los Txog
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DShsp3su27U

(hmn) Txais Tos Xyoo Tshiab
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cENE3Jm4BaQ

(hmn) Noj Peb Caug
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W1BQDuYCuzc

(hmn) Hmoob Lub Xyoo Tshiab
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=glhme3m2GqE

(hmn) Xyoo Tshiab Tus Ntxim Siab
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1NXi_fw9Kfo

(hmn) Pov Pob (Hmong and English)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mzjLBE2SZEY

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Re: Holiday music

Postby Linguaphile » 2019-12-03, 3:43

Music in Spanish used for various Mexican celebrations/commemorations:

(es-MX) Las Posadas (song sung during the Posadas, a Christmas re-creation of Mary and Joseph's search for a place to spend the night, in which the singers go from door to door singing these words to ask for lodging, where they are turned away at the first few houses, and finally let in at the last one where the last verses are sung)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1TjL2fg1EIA

(es-MX) Dale, dale, dale (song sung while hitting a piñata to break it and let the candy out, at birthdays, Posadas, Christmas, etc; this video has an English version in the second half, which isn't especially traditional, but will give non-Spanish speakers an idea of what the song is about)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alChHBw2_oc

(es-MX) Las Mañanitas (Mexican birthday song traditionally sung early in the morning outside the window of the person having the birthday, theoretically to awaken them; the video is a famous version from a movie, and the song itself doesn't start until 40 seconds in)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fsa06uRlaMw

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Re: Holiday music

Postby Linguaphile » 2019-12-04, 6:00

Two very well-known Christmas songs in English, that also contain other languages. (These songs are a reason why many monolingual English-speakers know how to say "Merry Christmas" in Spanish or Hawaiian.)

(en-US) & (es-PR) Feliz Navidad (José Feliciano)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qK7P53Z7wBY

(en-US) & (haw) Mele Kalikimaka (Bing Crosby)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hEvGKUXW0iI

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Re: Holiday music

Postby Naava » 2019-12-05, 16:29

Linguaphile wrote:(smi-sms) Puäđas Rosttov
(fi) Tulkoon Joulu
(smi-sme) Juovllat leat dál

Same song, but Kirill Sultanshin has translated a part of it into Russian:

(fi)&(ru)
https://youtu.be/1AYFpl0M-ww


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