LGBTQA+ issues

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ceid donn
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Re: LGBTQA+ issues

Postby ceid donn » 2018-10-12, 15:06

A few days ago Anthony Oliveira (@meakoopa) was jokingly complaining about having to assume all UK celebrity were transphobic unless proven otherwise. This crap going on over in the UK with TERFs and targeted harassment of trans women is more than I can deal with in full detail with everything else I need to expend my emotional and psychological energy on, so I have to resign to passing judgement from afar. Suffice to say: I am immensely grateful for all the people in the UK who are standing up this and seriously, everyone, just leave trans women alone. Like, who voluntarily signs up to be a woman in this nightmare misogynist hell-world for anything short of it being their authentic self??? Just leave them alone and deal with your own problems, which, if you are transphobic, I am certain are legion.

But now the biggest trashbag in the Scottish pro-indy movement, Wings Over Scotland (he has a real name, which I forget and can't bother to look up because fuck this guy, seriously) has decided to get in on the UK TERF action. Wings is also vehemently anti-Gaelic, misogynist and ableist as well as transphobic. But even though he is quite the committed misogynist, his transphobic side wants to cash in on UK's "let's all be nonsensically terrified of some of society's most marginalized people" trend by pretending to care about (cis) women for a few seconds.

I stress again that Wings is a misogynist fuck who I assure you has never once given a single, sincere thought about the well-being of women who have survived sexual assault, let alone about women who experience sexual assault while incarcerated. Also, nevermind that you do not need to physically have a penis to commit sexual assault, and that cis women can and do commit sexual assault too. But while it is easy to dismiss what he says based on simple facts and reality, propaganda like this aims at people's irrational fears and impressionability by planting the seeds of vague doubt, suspicions and fear that resist countering by reason and facts because the sucker who's bought into it just "feels" it is the "truth." Wings is good at that--it's really the only things he does well besides being a pathetic, reactionary bigot, which is why he's a bigger problem for Scotland's pro-indy movement than many people want to admit, sadly.

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Re: LGBTQA+ issues

Postby linguoboy » 2018-10-12, 21:47

So this is fun: just got someone posting to the board I moderate saying that he doesn't listen to music by "LGBQTI+ or related freaks". He was almost immediately called out on this and replaced it with something whiny about people being offended for no reasons, then revised it again to say that his favourite music is "Mostly synthpop or anything with synthesized instruments"

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Re: LGBTQA+ issues

Postby Osias » 2018-10-13, 1:37

What board?
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Re: LGBTQA+ issues

Postby vijayjohn » 2018-11-12, 18:36

One of my co-workers is gay, and I usually have lunch with him and a group of other co-workers who are mostly women and almost all Japanese. I never told him about my own sexuality, partly because I think it's a little complicated (it's certainly not quite as simple as "I'm gay ergo I only like men"), partly because I don't talk much in general during lunchtime (because I'm busy alternating between eating and trying to see how much Japanese I can understand while two or three conversations are going on simultaneously), and partly because it's never come up in conversation. Unfortunately, it seems that one result of this situation is that some of them at least (including the gay guy) think of me as being very innocent whereas they think of themselves as more perverse ("innocent" and "perverse" are their own words here as far as I can remember). :?

One time during lunch, probably not more than two or three weeks ago, the gay guy was showing a few ladies parts of two episodes I think from the Daddyhunt series, which I guess are basically gay romantic comedy/drama and of course has things like shirtless men in bed together. He wouldn't let me see it, though, which is especially ironic given that I was probably watching hardcore gay porn the night before. :P I don't really know how to respond to that, so I just laughed.

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Re: LGBTQA+ issues

Postby linguoboy » 2018-11-12, 20:43

vijayjohn wrote:One time during lunch, probably not more than two or three weeks ago, the gay guy was showing a few ladies parts of two episodes I think from the Daddyhunt series, which I guess are basically gay romantic comedy/drama

I thought Daddyhunt was a video game.
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Re: LGBTQA+ issues

Postby mōdgethanc » 2018-11-14, 22:50

linguoboy wrote:So this is fun: just got someone posting to the board I moderate saying that he doesn't listen to music by "LGBQTI+ or related freaks". He was almost immediately called out on this and replaced it with something whiny about people being offended for no reasons, then revised it again to say that his favourite music is "Mostly synthpop or anything with synthesized instruments"
I wonder what he thinks of electronic music pioneer Wendy Carlos.

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Re: LGBTQA+ issues

Postby vijayjohn » 2018-11-14, 22:52

mōdgethanc wrote:I wonder what he thinks of electronic music pioneer Wendy Carlos.

Awkwardly enough, his musical tastes seem very similar to mine, so he probably doesn't.

EDIT: Wait, he said he was into synthpop. :hmm: Okay, I'm just confused. Never mind.

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Re: LGBTQA+ issues

Postby mōdgethanc » 2018-11-14, 23:35

vijayjohn wrote:Awkwardly enough, his musical tastes seem very similar to mine, so he probably doesn't.

EDIT: Wait, he said he was into synthpop. :hmm: Okay, I'm just confused. Never mind.
I was quoting linguoboy who was talking about someone on the internet who is a bigot and appears to not be aware that synthpop and electronic music has always been LGBT-friendly.

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Re: LGBTQA+ issues

Postby Johanna » 2018-11-19, 15:44

linguoboy wrote:So this is fun: just got someone posting to the board I moderate saying that he doesn't listen to music by "LGBQTI+ or related freaks". He was almost immediately called out on this and replaced it with something whiny about people being offended for no reasons, then revised it again to say that his favourite music is "Mostly synthpop or anything with synthesized instruments".

I went to school with someone like that. Had no trouble singing along to Pet Shop Boys or Queen when they were on the radio... Not Elton John either, but only when they didn't know it was him, so anything from the 90's was out.

To be fair, I don't think they knew anything about Pet Shop Boys apart from their songs, not even Neil Tennant's name.
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Re: LGBTQA+ issues

Postby linguoboy » 2018-11-19, 16:43

Johanna wrote:To be fair, I don't think they knew anything about Pet Shop Boys apart from their songs, not even Neil Tennant's name.

I recall that they were quite cross with Jimmy Somerville for outing them back in the day, which I suspect means most of their fans had no idea they were gay and they preferred it that way.
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Re: LGBTQA+ issues

Postby Johanna » 2018-11-19, 17:44

linguoboy wrote:
Johanna wrote:To be fair, I don't think they knew anything about Pet Shop Boys apart from their songs, not even Neil Tennant's name.

I recall that they were quite cross with Jimmy Somerville for outing them back in the day, which I suspect means most of their fans had no idea they were gay and they preferred it that way.

Yeah, but we're talking the early 00's or so, way after that happened and Neil himself came out officially.

The most popular commercial radio station at the time, even among teenagers, played a mix of pop and rock from the 60's up to the current hits, but 80's stuff was especially popular.
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Re: LGBTQA+ issues

Postby IpseDixit » 2018-12-10, 0:19

I hate gay couples in which the two guys are identical. I mean, are you gay or huge narcisists?

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Re: LGBTQA+ issues

Postby Prowler » 2019-05-31, 10:46

I was thinking recently: How many cases of famous professional athletes that turned out to be gay or bissexual do you guys know? As a big fan of football/soccer I can't really think of any. Maybe in lower leagues or in leagues from smaller countries gay players have come out but I can't think of ANY case like that among the bigger names in top European clubs. :hmm:

I dunno much about other sports but I vaguely recall reading some years ago that there was yet to be an NFL player publicly admitting to be anything but straight.

I guess it's because sports, particularly team sports, are considered a very "masculine thing" and a gay player could possibly get blacklisted or be subjected to insults on the pitch/court.

There was a rumour here in Portugal around 2000-2001 that one of Benfica's players was gay. It turned out not to be true and just a made up rumour, but a lot of Benfica fans made fun of him and would call him... well you can imagine, from the stands. And the player himself said he's gotten insulted a few times while walking down the street holding his wife's hand and all. So yeah, I guess that's why you don't hear more cases of gay and bisexual players publicly admitting their orientation.

But yeah, it seems like it's more acceptable for a musician or an artist to openly admit being gay than for a sportsman.

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Re: LGBTQA+ issues

Postby md0 » 2019-05-31, 12:07

It's not surprising, isn't it? :hmm:

I came across two profiles on Grindr of men presenting themselves as professional football players. One of them just shows his torso and appears to be an international player for a team in northern Cyprus, and the other has a blury far-away shot of him playing football in the kit of a 3rd division team in southern Cyprus.

And the only article that comes up when I search about this topic on local press is this one with horror stories of coming outs going really wrong in Europe
http://omada.reporter.com.cy/football-i ... le/399751/
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Re: LGBTQA+ issues

Postby Prowler » 2019-06-01, 3:07

md0 wrote:It's not surprising, isn't it? :hmm:

I came across two profiles on Grindr of men presenting themselves as professional football players. One of them just shows his torso and appears to be an international player for a team in northern Cyprus, and the other has a blury far-away shot of him playing football in the kit of a 3rd division team in southern Cyprus.

And the only article that comes up when I search about this topic on local press is this one with horror stories of coming outs going really wrong in Europe
http://omada.reporter.com.cy/football-i ... le/399751/


It seems like the most notorious case I could find in European football was Thomas Hitzlspergen: https://www.theguardian.com/football/20 ... -interview
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Hitzlsperger

He wasn't as big of a star nor did he play for top clubs, but he's not exactly unknown to football fans either. He was part of the Stuttgart team that won the Bundesliga in 2007.

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Re: LGBTQA+ issues

Postby Saim » 2019-06-01, 10:03

Prowler wrote:It seems like the most notorious case I could find in European football was Thomas Hitzlspergen: https://www.theguardian.com/football/20 ... -interview
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Hitzlsperger

He wasn't as big of a star nor did he play for top clubs, but he's not exactly unknown to football fans either. He was part of the Stuttgart team that won the Bundesliga in 2007.


Maybe I've misinterpreted what you're trying to say here, in which case I apologise in advance.

In English "notorious" generally has the connotation of being famous for something negative (infamous, ill-famed). If I've correctly understood the definition over at priberam.pt, in Portuguese notório doesn't have this connotation. For that reason I think it could be interpreted as homophobic to say that someone's coming out was "notorious" (although I'm sure that's not what you meant, which is why I'm pointing it out).

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Re: LGBTQA+ issues

Postby Aurinĭa » 2019-06-01, 12:35

The only openly out professional sportsperson I can name off the top of my head is a female basketball player.

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Re: LGBTQA+ issues

Postby Car » 2019-06-01, 18:54

Prowler wrote:It seems like the most notorious case I could find in European football was Thomas Hitzlspergen: https://www.theguardian.com/football/20 ... -interview
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Hitzlsperger

He wasn't as big of a star nor did he play for top clubs, but he's not exactly unknown to football fans either. He was part of the Stuttgart team that won the Bundesliga in 2007.


That was a big topic here and he worked on TV afterwards and is now working for Stuttgart.
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Re: LGBTQA+ issues

Postby Luís » 2019-06-03, 8:32

Saim wrote:
Prowler wrote:It seems like the most notorious case I could find in European football was Thomas Hitzlspergen: https://www.theguardian.com/football/20 ... -interview
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Hitzlsperger


In English "notorious" generally has the connotation of being famous for something negative (infamous, ill-famed). If I've correctly understood the definition over at priberam.pt, in Portuguese notório doesn't have this connotation. For that reason I think it could be interpreted as homophobic to say that someone's coming out was "notorious" (although I'm sure that's not what you meant, which is why I'm pointing it out).


Yeah, notório just means "well-known" in Portuguese.
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Re: LGBTQA+ issues

Postby linguoboy » 2019-06-03, 16:03

Prowler wrote:I dunno much about other sports but I vaguely recall reading some years ago that there was yet to be an NFL player publicly admitting to be anything but straight.

Maybe they meant no player currently playing for the NFL? Here's a list of two dozen professional gridiron football players who have come out openly as gay. With two recent exceptions, though, all the NFL players waited until after retirement. Michael Sam famously came out right before the 2014 NFL draught and, though draughted, never made the official team roster. Bryant was outed by an ex in college and was draughted by the Steelers but didn't play for them; he openly acknowledged being gay around the same time.

Baseball is a slightly different story. Glenn Burke came out in 1978 while playing for the Dodgers. The next active MLB player to come out was also a Dodger, Billy Bean. David Denson came out will playing for the Brewers in 2015, but retired two years later. As far as I know, no one currently playing for the MLB is openly gay. There is one current Major League Soccer player who is openly gay, Collin Martin of Minnesota United FC (currently on loan to the USL team Hartford Athletic).

It's different in other sports, such as women's tennis. I mean, who hasn't heard of Martina Navratilova?
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