?!Vlürch wrote: Literally all
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Linguaphile wrote:?!Vlürch wrote: Literally all
vijayjohn wrote:Having a lot of foreign linguistic and cultural influence is hardly even unusual, let alone enough of a valid reason to consider a language or country somehow fake or invented by foreigners.
Vlürch wrote:As much as I'd like to believe that, the fact is that the vast majority of the early Finnish nationalists weren't actually Finnish. Also, the concept of Finland as a unified country apparently didn't even exist until about a century ago, just before Finland became independent
It still makes my blood boil every time someone, especially Finns themselves, say that Finland is a part of Scandinavia and/or a Nordic country, though... but that keeps happening more and more often, so I really wish I could give up on getting pissed off about that too.
vijayjohn wrote:Well, for that matter, the Gandhian movement for independence in India apparently didn't really start gaining international sympathy until American journalists started reporting on the British violently suppressing it, and some of the key figures in the struggle for independence were either allied with the Nazis or operating from London, i.e. their own enemy's capital. Some of the key figures in the American Revolution were French, German, and even British (i.e. born and raised in Britain and having only recently immigrated to the present-day US). There was no concept of India as a unified country until the British took over it, either. But both the US and India are perfectly valid countries, and so is Finland.
vijayjohn wrote:You know, just because someone says either of those things doesn't mean they have anything to do with other countries in Scandinavia or other Nordic countries (aside from contact and certain aspects of history, of course). It's kind of like how Mexico is a part of North America even though it doesn't share a whole lot culturally with Canada and the US.
Ser wrote:Well, those videogame makers must be quite stupid then. If it's any consolation, while I know next to nothing about that part of Europe, I've never thought of Helsinki as Swedish-speaking.
Linguaphile wrote:Ser wrote:Well, those videogame makers must be quite stupid then. If it's any consolation, while I know next to nothing about that part of Europe, I've never thought of Helsinki as Swedish-speaking.
I've been following this discussion and haven't known what to say.
I've never heard of most of the attitudes Vlürch has mentioned
The way Finnic languages have made loanwords "their own" is fascinating from a linguistic perspective
I had no idea that there were people who claimed that Finland or its language are somehow "fake," or that there were people who see the loanwords as diminishing Finnish identity.
Linguaphile wrote:And encountering it here really does creep me out.
Ser wrote:Linguaphile wrote:And encountering it here really does creep me out.
This is not the first time Vlürch goes on a rant that strikes me as overly paranoid and wildly unrepresentative of what people normally say. I'm not creeped out or that much surprised.
vijayjohn wrote:(*p > h at least word-initially in Kannada)
OldBoring wrote:vijayjohn wrote:(*p > h at least word-initially in Kannada)
Kannada lrukkusu lraiku Nihongo desu!
Vlürch wrote: Not sure how to feel about this; I mean, it's nice that it's not a Germanic loanword, but it being coined in like the 20th century is confusing as hell because obviously curses were considered a thing earlier than that.
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