What have you given up on?

This is our main forum. Here, anything related to languages and linguistics can be discussed.

Moderator: Forum Administrators

vijayjohn
Language Forum Moderator
Posts: 24190
Joined: 2013-01-10, 8:49
Real Name: Vijay John
Gender: male
Location: Austin
Country: US United States (United States)

Re: What have you given up on?

Postby vijayjohn » 2017-10-14, 22:57

linguoboy wrote:
dEhiN wrote:But it seems to me that since then you've been able to maintain your Irish; I remember you were able to help księżycowy earlier this year (if I remember correctly) when he started learning Irish.

I double-check everything I tell księżycowy just to make sure I'm not getting it wrong. Today a sean-nós singer I know tried to chat with me on Facebook and I put him off partly because I was fixing lunch but mostly because I realised my Irish just wasn't up to it. I couldn't even remember for sure how to say "later" without looking it up.

Idk, I think you may just be being too hard on yourself. Sometimes I have to double-check what I'm telling people in English, and I (try to) always do this in other languages, too. (Well, unless I think I can get away with it, like with Malayalam on this forum, which no one currently seems to be learning anyway :P).

User avatar
dEhiN
Posts: 6248
Joined: 2013-08-18, 2:51
Real Name: David
Gender: male
Location: Toronto
Country: CA Canada (Canada)
Contact:

Re: What have you given up on?

Postby dEhiN » 2017-10-14, 23:25

vijayjohn wrote:
linguoboy wrote:Today a sean-nós singer I know tried to chat with me on Facebook and I put him off partly because I was fixing lunch but mostly because I realised my Irish just wasn't up to it. I couldn't even remember for sure how to say "later" without looking it up.

Idk, I think you may just be being too hard on yourself. Sometimes I have to double-check what I'm telling people in English, and I (try to) always do this in other languages, too. (Well, unless I think I can get away with it, like with Malayalam on this forum, which no one currently seems to be learning anyway :P).

I do kinda hate how our brains operate on a use-it-or-lose-it M.O. I understand why, but yeah I look up basic stuff all the time in languages like French and Portuguese - stuff I know I know but haven't used in a while and need to confirm just in case. There are even more advanced or high register words in English that I've forgotten and had to look up, or had to pause to remember, just because I hadn't used the word in a bit.
My TAC for 2019.

(en-ca) (ta-lk) (fr) (es) (en_old)

User avatar
Osias
Posts: 8417
Joined: 2007-09-09, 17:38
Real Name: Osias Junior
Gender: male
Location: Vitória
Country: BR Brazil (Brasil)
Contact:

Re: What have you given up on?

Postby Osias » 2017-10-14, 23:53

Ciarán12 wrote:Over the last few months I gave up on every language except for Portuguese.
Agora que foi cair a ficha do motivo disso, porque li o post onde você mencionou sua namorada.
2017 est l'année du (fr) et de l'(de) pour moi. Parle avec moi en eux, s'il te plait.

vijayjohn
Language Forum Moderator
Posts: 24190
Joined: 2013-01-10, 8:49
Real Name: Vijay John
Gender: male
Location: Austin
Country: US United States (United States)

Re: What have you given up on?

Postby vijayjohn » 2017-10-15, 0:45

dEhiN wrote:
vijayjohn wrote:
linguoboy wrote:Today a sean-nós singer I know tried to chat with me on Facebook and I put him off partly because I was fixing lunch but mostly because I realised my Irish just wasn't up to it. I couldn't even remember for sure how to say "later" without looking it up.

Idk, I think you may just be being too hard on yourself. Sometimes I have to double-check what I'm telling people in English, and I (try to) always do this in other languages, too. (Well, unless I think I can get away with it, like with Malayalam on this forum, which no one currently seems to be learning anyway :P).

I do kinda hate how our brains operate on a use-it-or-lose-it M.O. I understand why, but yeah I look up basic stuff all the time in languages like French and Portuguese - stuff I know I know but haven't used in a while and need to confirm just in case. There are even more advanced or high register words in English that I've forgotten and had to look up, or had to pause to remember, just because I hadn't used the word in a bit.

Well, those are also instances of using it! Right? :)

User avatar
Ciarán12
Posts: 3452
Joined: 2011-12-31, 15:23
Real Name: Ciarán
Gender: male
Location: Baile Átha Cliath (Dublin)
Country: IE Ireland (Éire / Ireland)

Re: What have you given up on?

Postby Ciarán12 » 2017-10-15, 8:53

kevin wrote:
Ciarán12 wrote:You'd think so, but life can change pretty drastically. Like if you live in Japan, there's no getting around learning and using Japanese, but if you leave Japan and stop making any effort to maintain it it will fall away pretty quick.

I doubt that you'll really lose it that quickly. It may become rusty, but don't such languages tend to come back relatively easily when you get some exposure again? I mean, you will probably forget something, but far from everything.


I hope you’re right. My experience has generally been of not going back into a situation where I had such exposure again (I don’t live in Japan or Spain anymore…).

kevin wrote:And of course, welcome back once again. ;)



Thanks, maybe I’ll actually stick around this time! :P

księżycowy wrote:
vijayjohn wrote:
kevin wrote:
Ciarán12 wrote:Over the last few months I gave up on every language except for Portuguese.

Even Irish? :shock: :(

That's what I was wondering, too. :(

Me three.


Portuguese not exotic enough for you guys? I only gave up on it in the sense that I’ve used it very little over the last few months and haven’t made an effort to actively maintain it. Let’s hope Yasna and Kevin’s theory about proficiency coming back to you are right.

Osias wrote:
Ciarán12 wrote:Over the last few months I gave up on every language except for Portuguese.
Agora que foi cair a ficha do motivo disso, porque li o post onde você mencionou sua namorada.


Não é mais segredo! :P Pois sim, é por isso que o português é a única língua que mantive ao longo desses mêses.

User avatar
księżycowy
Posts: 13123
Joined: 2006-09-13, 23:51
Real Name: Paweł
Country: US United States (United States)
Contact:

Re: What have you given up on?

Postby księżycowy » 2017-10-15, 9:38

Ciarán12 wrote:Portuguese not exotic enough for you guys? I only gave up on it in the sense that I’ve used it very little over the last few months and haven’t made an effort to actively maintain it. Let’s hope Yasna and Kevin’s theory about proficiency coming back to you are right.

Well, given my last post on this thread, Romance languages don't float my boat much. But I'm not you, so I'm glad you have a language you're into (as I would be with anyone with any language really).

I personally wouldn't call Irish all that exotic. Lesser know, sure, but not my picture of exotic. :P

At any rate, sorry to say this so late, but it's good to see you back!

kevin
Language Forum Moderator
Posts: 2021
Joined: 2012-03-29, 11:07
Gender: male
Country: DE Germany (Deutschland)
Contact:

Re: What have you given up on?

Postby kevin » 2017-10-15, 10:40

Ciarán12 wrote:I hope you’re right. My experience has generally been of not going back into a situation where I had such exposure again (I don’t live in Japan or Spain anymore…).

I wasn't really thinking of living there again, but just spending a few days with some Spanish or Japanese speakers, which might be more likely to happen.

Thanks, maybe I’ll actually stick around this time! :P

Creidfidh mé é nuair a fheicfidh mé é. :P

Portuguese not exotic enough for you guys?

Primarily not Irish enough that I would have thought you'd content yourself with it. ;)

vijayjohn
Language Forum Moderator
Posts: 24190
Joined: 2013-01-10, 8:49
Real Name: Vijay John
Gender: male
Location: Austin
Country: US United States (United States)

Re: What have you given up on?

Postby vijayjohn » 2017-10-15, 16:04

Ciarán12 wrote:Portuguese not exotic enough for you guys?

For me at least, it's not at all about how exotic it is but rather about the fact that...I mean, it's at least your heritage language, right? I know firsthand what it's like to lose your heritage language. I wouldn't wish that on anyone even if I hated their guts.

User avatar
Ciarán12
Posts: 3452
Joined: 2011-12-31, 15:23
Real Name: Ciarán
Gender: male
Location: Baile Átha Cliath (Dublin)
Country: IE Ireland (Éire / Ireland)

Re: What have you given up on?

Postby Ciarán12 » 2017-10-15, 17:30

księżycowy wrote:Well, given my last post on this thread, Romance languages don't float my boat much. But I'm not you, so I'm glad you have a language you're into (as I would be with anyone with any language really).


They don't interest me much either from a linguistic perspective, I don't think I would have developed a particular passion for them if they weren't ubiquitous enough that they've crossed my path so many times.

księżycowy wrote:I personally wouldn't call Irish all that exotic. Lesser know, sure, but not my picture of exotic. :P

Well, maybe not the in "grass skirts and drinking out of a coconut" kind of way, but in the obscure and distant kind of way...

księżycowy wrote:At any rate, sorry to say this so late, but it's good to see you back!


Go raibh maith agat! :)

kevin wrote:I wasn't really thinking of living there again, but just spending a few days with some Spanish or Japanese speakers, which might be more likely to happen.


I'd say a good deal of it would come back if I rededicated myself to them for a few days/weeks and tried listening and reading as much as possible, but for Japanese, I'd very much have to go out of my way to do so. For Spanish, I know lots of Spanish speakers, but they all speak English far better than I speak Spanish, speaking to them in Spanish is a bit like "okay, let's let Ciarán do his little trick and then we can go back to having real conversations". I could find Spanish speakers with a more basic level of English who eould be easier to persuade to speak Spanish to me, but again, I'd have to go out of my way.

kevin wrote:Creidfidh mé é nuair a fheicfidh mé é. :P


Yeah, táim saghas abhógach (flakey, níl a fhios agam más é sin an focal is fearr a chur air) maidir leis an fóram seo, gath mo leithscéal!

kevin wrote:Primarily not Irish enough that I would have thought you'd content yourself with it. ;)


Taking a different tack this time - I'm learning a language with hundreds of millions of speakers, where there are loads of opportunities to use it and media to consume in it. I not motovated by an interest in the language itself really, it's more what you can do with it once you know it. I actually know comparitively little about Portuguese grammar, but I can speak it far more fluently than I can Irish because I get hours of exposure every day, which would be almost impossible to acheive for Irish.

vijayjohn wrote:
For me at least, it's not at all about how exotic it is but rather about the fact that...I mean, it's at least your heritage language, right? I know firsthand what it's like to lose your heritage language. I wouldn't wish that on anyone even if I hated their guts.


I'm still interested in Irish, and still proud of it as part of my heritage, but it's difficult to integrate into your life. I didn't choose Portuguese randomly, it chose me, I have an opportunity/necessity to learn it that almost rivals living in a country where it's spoken. It's hard to do that with Irish (and I do live in a country where it is spoken!).

User avatar
Osias
Posts: 8417
Joined: 2007-09-09, 17:38
Real Name: Osias Junior
Gender: male
Location: Vitória
Country: BR Brazil (Brasil)
Contact:

Re: What have you given up on?

Postby Osias » 2017-10-15, 17:33

Ciarán12 wrote:Não é mais segredo! :P Pois sim, é por isso que o português é a única língua que mantive ao longo desses meses.
Apesar de não ter acento gráfico, a pronúncia é a mesma de que se tivesse.
2017 est l'année du (fr) et de l'(de) pour moi. Parle avec moi en eux, s'il te plait.

kevin
Language Forum Moderator
Posts: 2021
Joined: 2012-03-29, 11:07
Gender: male
Country: DE Germany (Deutschland)
Contact:

Re: What have you given up on?

Postby kevin » 2017-10-15, 18:14

Ciarán12 wrote:Yeah, táim saghas abhógach (flakey, níl a fhios agam más é sin an focal is fearr a chur air) maidir leis an fóram seo, gath mo leithscéal!

Is maith linn thú mar atá tú .;)

Is dóigh liom go n-úsáideann tú an foclóir céanna liomsa, mar sin caithfidh go bhfuil an focal sin maith go leor. :silly:

I actually know comparitively little about Portuguese grammar, but I can speak it far more fluently than I can Irish because I get hours of exposure every day, which would be almost impossible to acheive for Irish.

Tuigim, ach is mór an trua é.

User avatar
księżycowy
Posts: 13123
Joined: 2006-09-13, 23:51
Real Name: Paweł
Country: US United States (United States)
Contact:

Re: What have you given up on?

Postby księżycowy » 2017-10-15, 18:22

Ciarán12 wrote:Well, maybe not the in "grass skirts and drinking out of a coconut" kind of way, but in the obscure and distant kind of way...

I wasn't even thinking of "grass skirts" and the like when I said that. In fact, after all the years I've been exposing myself to different languages and such, I wonder what I would call exotic. :hmm: Vijay?

Obscure and distant, maybe.

kevin
Language Forum Moderator
Posts: 2021
Joined: 2012-03-29, 11:07
Gender: male
Country: DE Germany (Deutschland)
Contact:

Re: What have you given up on?

Postby kevin » 2017-10-15, 18:28

Yeah, I guess you could call Vijay exotic. :P

User avatar
księżycowy
Posts: 13123
Joined: 2006-09-13, 23:51
Real Name: Paweł
Country: US United States (United States)
Contact:

Re: What have you given up on?

Postby księżycowy » 2017-10-15, 18:39

:lol: Not what I meant, but sure. :lol:

vijayjohn
Language Forum Moderator
Posts: 24190
Joined: 2013-01-10, 8:49
Real Name: Vijay John
Gender: male
Location: Austin
Country: US United States (United States)

Re: What have you given up on?

Postby vijayjohn » 2017-10-15, 18:48

:lol:
księżycowy wrote:In fact, after all the years I've been exposing myself to different languages and such, I wonder what I would call exotic. :hmm: Vijay?

Papuan languages? Nilo-Saharan languages? Oirata, Fataluku, Teiwa, Alor, Dinka, Koyra Chiini?

User avatar
księżycowy
Posts: 13123
Joined: 2006-09-13, 23:51
Real Name: Paweł
Country: US United States (United States)
Contact:

Re: What have you given up on?

Postby księżycowy » 2017-10-15, 20:35

There you have it ladies and gentlemen!

If it's not one of those languages, it's not exotic. Word of God.

User avatar
dEhiN
Posts: 6248
Joined: 2013-08-18, 2:51
Real Name: David
Gender: male
Location: Toronto
Country: CA Canada (Canada)
Contact:

Re: What have you given up on?

Postby dEhiN » 2017-10-16, 2:49

vijayjohn wrote:Papuan languages? Nilo-Saharan languages? Oirata, Fataluku, Teiwa, Alor, Dinka, Koyra Chiini?

Why Nilo-Saharan? Papuan I can get, but what's so exotic about the Nilo-Saharan family? Also, I make a motion to add Pictish to this list.
My TAC for 2019.

(en-ca) (ta-lk) (fr) (es) (en_old)

User avatar
linguoboy
Posts: 23278
Joined: 2009-08-25, 15:11
Real Name: Da
Location: Chicago
Country: US United States (United States)

Re: What have you given up on?

Postby linguoboy » 2017-10-16, 3:23

Ciarán12 wrote:abhógach (flakey, níl a fhios agam más é sin an focal is fearr a chur air)

"Scaipthe" ("scattered") is ea an focal ab fhearr liom.
"Richmond is a real scholar; Owen just learns languages because he can't bear not to know what other people are saying."--Margaret Lattimore on her two sons

vijayjohn
Language Forum Moderator
Posts: 24190
Joined: 2013-01-10, 8:49
Real Name: Vijay John
Gender: male
Location: Austin
Country: US United States (United States)

Re: What have you given up on?

Postby vijayjohn » 2017-10-16, 3:24

dEhiN wrote:
vijayjohn wrote:Papuan languages? Nilo-Saharan languages? Oirata, Fataluku, Teiwa, Alor, Dinka, Koyra Chiini?

Why Nilo-Saharan? Papuan I can get, but what's so exotic about the Nilo-Saharan family?

Nilo-Saharan is almost as weird, endangered, and little-known as Papuan, just with fewer languages. It's also not clear that Nilo-Saharan is a valid language family. (I think it's pretty clear that Papuan languages aren't a valid language family, though :P).
Also, I make a motion to add Pictish to this list.

I see your Pictish and raise you one non-Pama-Nyungan, non-Papuan Australian!

User avatar
dEhiN
Posts: 6248
Joined: 2013-08-18, 2:51
Real Name: David
Gender: male
Location: Toronto
Country: CA Canada (Canada)
Contact:

Re: What have you given up on?

Postby dEhiN » 2017-10-16, 3:54

vijayjohn wrote:
dEhiN wrote:
vijayjohn wrote:Papuan languages? Nilo-Saharan languages? Oirata, Fataluku, Teiwa, Alor, Dinka, Koyra Chiini?

Why Nilo-Saharan? Papuan I can get, but what's so exotic about the Nilo-Saharan family?

Nilo-Saharan is almost as weird, endangered, and little-known as Papuan, just with fewer languages. It's also not clear that Nilo-Saharan is a valid language family. (I think it's pretty clear that Papuan languages aren't a valid language family, though :P).

Yeah I remember you teaching me a few years ago that Papuan is an areal term. Is Nilo-Saharan one as well? (Also, in writing my previous reply, I learned that Khoisan is no longer considered a valid language family! Man, I'm so behind the times in some linguistic stuff!)

vijayjohn wrote:
Also, I make a motion to add Pictish to this list.

I see your Pictish and raise you one non-Pama-Nyungan, non-Papuan Australian!

*Quickly googles Pama-Nyungan languages* Well...I think I'll fold since you're clearly the more advanced player in this game. :D
My TAC for 2019.

(en-ca) (ta-lk) (fr) (es) (en_old)


Return to “General Language Forum”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest