some introduction / beginners' lesson / whatever part 1

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nighean-neonach
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some introduction / beginners' lesson / whatever part 1

Postby nighean-neonach » 2007-01-26, 10:09

I've seen that Jonne posted the first few lessons from Davvin 1 some time ago. So I don't have to do that again :) I strongly suggest that if you want to learn the Northern Sámi language you get this book and the audio materials as well, because that's a really good and useful start for a beginner.

What I'm going to do here, bit by bit, and hopefully for a somewhat longer time, that's this:

* I'll give additional info and comments to the Davvin lessons, which I am drawing out of two German books on Sáami.

* I'll post lessons from one of these books as well, with English comments of course.

* I'll probably give my very own thoughts and comments here and there and try to write some small stuff :)

WARNING: I am a learner!!! Don't trust me! :)
Writing poetry in: Scottish Gaelic, German, English.
Reading poetry in: Latin, Old Irish, French, Ancient Greek, Old Norse.
Talking to people in the shop in: Lithuanian, Norwegian, Irish Gaelic, Saami.
Listening to people talking in the shop in: Icelandic, Greenlandic, Finnish.

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Postby nighean-neonach » 2007-01-26, 10:15

Summary of greetings, some of which are in the first lesson of Davvin 1:

bures = hello
buore iđit = good morning
buore beaivvi = good day
buore eahket = good evening
buore idja = good night
ipmel atti = "may god give it" = answer to all these greetings.

báze dearvan = "stay healthy" = goodbye (says the one who leaves to the one who stays)
mána dearvan = "go healthy" = goodbye (says the one who stays to the one who leaves)

dual forms of these:
báhcci dearvan
manni dearvan

plural forms of these:
báhcet dearvan
mannet dearvan
Writing poetry in: Scottish Gaelic, German, English.
Reading poetry in: Latin, Old Irish, French, Ancient Greek, Old Norse.
Talking to people in the shop in: Lithuanian, Norwegian, Irish Gaelic, Saami.
Listening to people talking in the shop in: Icelandic, Greenlandic, Finnish.

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Postby nighean-neonach » 2007-01-26, 10:45

Some pronouns are introduced as well, I give a bigger overview here, and the verb "to be" as well, so you can read forms like "I am, you are" etc. from the list as well:

... Nom | to be | Gen-Akk | Lok

1.sg | mun | lean | mu | mus
2.sg | don | leat | du | dus
3.sg | son | lea | su | sus

1.du | moai | letne | munno | munnos
2.du | doai | leahppi | dudno | dudnos
3.du | soai | leaba | sudno | sudnos

1.pl | mii | leat | min | mis
2.pl | dii | lehpet | din | dis
3.pl | sii | leat | sin | sis

What you can read from this list as well is how to say "I have..." etc., because these work with the locative:
Mus lea x = With me is x = I have x

The genitive form is used for example to say:
mu namma lea = my name is

~ ~ ~

Some simple verb forms are introduced in the first lesson as well. I give the whole present tense pattern for one class of verbs here. In the German books this verb class is called "gleichsilbig" which means it has an even number of syllables in the infinitive, and the infinitve is in the strong grade.

(I won't explain much about consonant gradation right now, I think it might be in some of the posts which already exist, or you can read about it on wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consonant_gradation or I'm going to write about it another time. It's not really important to understand and know the complete patterns right from the start anyway :) )

Some verbs now:

boahtit = come
mannat = leave
hupmat = speak
orrut = live

The personal forms are in the same usual pattern as the pronouns above, so I won't write 1.sg, 2.sg etc. again ;) ):

boađán | human | orun
boađát | humat | orut
boahtá | hupmá | orru

bohte | hupme | orro
boahtibeahtti | hupmabeahtti | orrobeahti
boahtiba | hupmaba | orruba

boahtit | hupmat | orrut
boahtibehtet | hupmabehtet | orrubehtet
bohtet | hupmet | orrot

~ ~ ~

All verbs have a negative form as well:
boađe | huma | oro

This negative form is used together with the so-called negation verb, which has the following personal forms:

mun in
don it
son ii

moai ean
doai eahppi
soai eaba

mii eat
dii ehpet
sii eai

Pronoun and negation verb can also be turned around: "mun in boađe" or "in mun boađe" = I don't come.

~ ~ ~

Question forms are build by adding an interrogative particle to the relevant word, mostly the verb:

boađátgo? = do you come?

positive answer: "juo" = yes, or "de mun boađán" = I do come.
negative answer: "in" = no, or "in mun boađe" = I don't come.
("in" is the negative verb alone)
Writing poetry in: Scottish Gaelic, German, English.
Reading poetry in: Latin, Old Irish, French, Ancient Greek, Old Norse.
Talking to people in the shop in: Lithuanian, Norwegian, Irish Gaelic, Saami.
Listening to people talking in the shop in: Icelandic, Greenlandic, Finnish.

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Postby nighean-neonach » 2007-01-26, 10:55

Some useful phrases:

leage buorre = please
(ollu) giitu = thanks
ii mihkke váivvit = you're welcome

dat lea suohtas = that's great
dat lea unohas = that's bad
dat lea duohta = that's true
dat lea boastut = that's wrong

mot manna? = how are you?
bures dat manna = it is good = I'm fine

gii don leat? = who are you?
mun lean... = I am...

mii du namma lea? = what is your name?

gos don boađát? = where do you come from?
mun boađán... + Lok. = I come from...

~ ~ ~

Bures! Mu namma lea Mona. Mot manna? Mun boađán Duiskkas. Humatgo sámegiela? Mun human duiskkagiela, engelasgiela, in mun máhte sámegiela ;)
Writing poetry in: Scottish Gaelic, German, English.
Reading poetry in: Latin, Old Irish, French, Ancient Greek, Old Norse.
Talking to people in the shop in: Lithuanian, Norwegian, Irish Gaelic, Saami.
Listening to people talking in the shop in: Icelandic, Greenlandic, Finnish.

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Postby gothwolf » 2007-01-26, 12:58

nighean-neonach wrote:There are some exercises at the end of the lesson in the book, do you want me to post them here?


Oh, sure... I'm very excited :bounce: of course, if this is not a problem for you :)

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Postby Steisi » 2007-01-26, 14:12

Yeah, and some of them don't correspond with the answers. Like you get a picture of an old man and you don't know whether to say "good morning" or "this is pekka" or "goodbye" etc.
Native: English
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Want to resuscitate: German
Actively learning: Hebrew
Wishes she had time for: Northern Sámi
En usko humalaan.

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Postby nighean-neonach » 2007-01-26, 14:19

I don't find the exercises in the first few lessons of Davvin very effective... in fact the book goes far to slow for my taste ;)
But in contrast the German book is full of grammar and stuff but does not contain colloquial language and useful phrases for communication.

So well, we have to make the best out of them :)

I think it's very useful to make up your own little sentences and dialogues, like for example, from the material above one could say things like:

Do you have a car?
No, I don't.
The car is in the river ;)
etc.
Writing poetry in: Scottish Gaelic, German, English.
Reading poetry in: Latin, Old Irish, French, Ancient Greek, Old Norse.
Talking to people in the shop in: Lithuanian, Norwegian, Irish Gaelic, Saami.
Listening to people talking in the shop in: Icelandic, Greenlandic, Finnish.

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Steisi
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Postby Steisi » 2007-01-26, 14:44

Do you have resources for Greenlandic, by the way?
Native: English
Fluent: Finnish
Want to resuscitate: German
Actively learning: Hebrew
Wishes she had time for: Northern Sámi
En usko humalaan.

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Postby nighean-neonach » 2007-01-26, 17:20

Stacy wrote:Do you have resources for Greenlandic, by the way?


Yes, quite a lot :) I work a lot on that language at the moment, I have several books and stuff.

Obviously there is no Greenlandic forum here. I am on another language forum where there's a Greenlandic sub-forum, and on a yahoo mailing group, and I have a penfriend in Greenland.

If there are some people here who are interested in the language, maybe we can ask for a sub-forum to be opened?
M
Writing poetry in: Scottish Gaelic, German, English.
Reading poetry in: Latin, Old Irish, French, Ancient Greek, Old Norse.
Talking to people in the shop in: Lithuanian, Norwegian, Irish Gaelic, Saami.
Listening to people talking in the shop in: Icelandic, Greenlandic, Finnish.

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Postby Steisi » 2007-01-26, 17:22

Definitely, I've been looking for resources! I think I love you :bounce:

I'll ask for the forum now.
Native: English
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Postby gothwolf » 2007-01-26, 18:17

Bures...

I have some questions.
1. Are the negative question forms of the verbs formed by this way:
ingo mun boađe?
itgo don boađe?
iigo son boađe? ...

2.The preposition "lahka" is used with Genitive, but where is it situated? - in front of the noun, or after it? "joga lahka" (near a river), "vári lahka" (near a mountain?

3. I've made up some sentences and could you say if there are right?
-Who are you? - Gii du leat?
-Where is my Saami hut? - Gos mu goahti lea?
-My name is Hristian. - Mu namma lea Hristian.
-Where do they live? - Gos orrot?
-This is an old mountain. - Dát lea boaris várri.
-We live near the river and the mountain. - Orrut goađi ja(?) vári lahka (how is "and" in Saami. I used the Finnish preposition ;P)

Ok.. Btw... I want to learn Greenlandic, too ;P

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Postby gothwolf » 2007-01-26, 22:05

And how does the verb "mannat" conjugate ?

mun manan
don manat
son manná
moai manne
doai mannabeahtti
soai mannaba
mii mannat
dii mannabehtet
sii mannet


Could you say more verbs :oops:

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Postby Steisi » 2007-01-27, 10:45

nighean-neonach wrote:
mot manna? = how are you?
bures dat manna = it is good = I'm fine


Iigo leat "mot manná"?

Isn't it "mot manná"?

Jonne wrote the Davvin lessons here

If anyone's interested, I can post the other Davvin lessons from book 1. And if any Finns want it in Finnish I can do that, too (my book is in Finnish ;)) so just let me know :D
Native: English
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Actively learning: Hebrew
Wishes she had time for: Northern Sámi
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gothwolf
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Postby gothwolf » 2007-01-27, 11:52

Stacy wrote:If anyone's interested, I can post the other Davvin lessons from book 1. And if any Finns want it in Finnish I can do that, too (my book is in Finnish ;)) so just let me know :D


Yes, I'm interested... :P

btw. But I'm not so good in Finnish, so it will be better in English (if this is not a problem for you, of course)

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Postby Steisi » 2007-01-27, 12:56

Alright :) If it's alright with you, I'll get myself to that level (shouldn't take long, I'm on the 5th lesson and they're very easy going) and then I'll start posting them continuing from Jonne left off :D (sixth lesson I think).

By the way, I love your avatar :yep:
Native: English
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Want to resuscitate: German
Actively learning: Hebrew
Wishes she had time for: Northern Sámi
En usko humalaan.

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nighean-neonach
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Postby nighean-neonach » 2007-01-27, 13:35

That would be great, Stacy! :D That's good because then I can focus on the stuff from my German books and post some additional info to the Davvin lessons.

By the way, what about the audio stuff? And can you send me a private message with your postal address, I'm about to pack a nice little Greenlandic surprise package for you :)

gothwolf, I will get back to your questions soon, but I will have to look some things up in the books, and I'm busy with some other stuff for university this weekend...
See you later!
Writing poetry in: Scottish Gaelic, German, English.
Reading poetry in: Latin, Old Irish, French, Ancient Greek, Old Norse.
Talking to people in the shop in: Lithuanian, Norwegian, Irish Gaelic, Saami.
Listening to people talking in the shop in: Icelandic, Greenlandic, Finnish.

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Steisi
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Postby Steisi » 2007-01-27, 14:08

:bounce: :bounce: :bounce:

Promise it's not a Greenlandic letter bomb ;)

I'll reinstall the audio files on my computer since my ipod ate them (it went crazy and rebooted itself) and then I'll send them to you :)
Native: English
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Actively learning: Hebrew
Wishes she had time for: Northern Sámi
En usko humalaan.

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gothwolf
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Postby gothwolf » 2007-01-27, 14:28

Hei... whatever you send to each other I want it, too :roll:

p.s. Stacy, your avatar is not bad, too :wink:

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Steisi
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Postby Steisi » 2007-01-27, 14:31

gothwolf wrote:Hei... whatever you send to each other I want it, too :roll:

p.s. Stacy, your avatar is not bad, too :wink:


Thanks but it's a bit poo ;) But I think it illustrates a point :lol:
Native: English
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Actively learning: Hebrew
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nighean-neonach
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Postby nighean-neonach » 2007-01-27, 15:35

gothwolf wrote:Hei... whatever you send to each other I want it, too :roll:


Didn't your mum teach you how to ask for things? ;) :twisted:

Stacy and I are sort of exchanging stuff, so what would you offer to share?
M
Writing poetry in: Scottish Gaelic, German, English.
Reading poetry in: Latin, Old Irish, French, Ancient Greek, Old Norse.
Talking to people in the shop in: Lithuanian, Norwegian, Irish Gaelic, Saami.
Listening to people talking in the shop in: Icelandic, Greenlandic, Finnish.


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