Language List

[księżycowy]

Apparently Hakka is a dialect of Korean.

Suffice it to say, the language list (not drop down list), is a cluster.

[OldBoring]

And Wu is also listed as if it were a dialect of Japanese.

That explains why Shanghainese sounds like Japanese!

[Luís]

English name: Khalaj
Language name: خلج تیلی
ISO code: klj
Flag:

English name: Salar
Language name: Salırça
ISO code: slr
Flag:

Added

Already added:
English name: Shor
Language name: шор тили
ISO code: cjs
Flag:

Added flag

Change Kumyk "ksk" -> "kum"

Changed code

English name: Karakhanid
Language name: ?
ISO code: xqa
Flag:

English name: Old Turkic
Language name: ?
ISO code: otk
Flag:

English name: Old Uighur
Language name: ?
ISO code: oui
Flag:

I need the native names before I can add these languages...

There is something wrong with the list. It is not ordered alphabetically. What French, English and German do almost at the end of the list? Belarusian is between two Chinese languages, Romani and Serbian are listed under Japanese as if they were dialects of it.

Yeah, I made a mistake after the last update It should be fixed by now (languages that have sub varieties are at the end, that isn't new though)

[księżycowy]

It's definitely in alphabetical order now, but both lists (native name and english name) are now exactly the same.

Fix one problem, create another.

[Luís]

EDIT: Fixed

[księżycowy]

Not to further complicate things, but I notice that while the main list is alphabetical, the languages in groups (i.e. with dialects) are not.

EDIT: To be clear, I mean that Arabic, for example, is in the middle of the grouped languages. I don't care about the dialects, just the main heading.

[MarkusP]

Folkspraak
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Folkspraa ... spraak.svg

Old Swedish
https://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tre_krono ... iament.svg
symbol likely imported during the 1300's.

Westrobothnian
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/V%C3%A4st ... _vapen.svg

Westrogothian
https://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/V%C3%A4st ... _vapen.svg

Värmlandic (dialects closely related to Standard Swedish)
https://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lista_%C3 ... flagga.svg

Värmlandic of Hagfors
https://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mall:Land ... verige.png

[Luís]

MarkusP, when requesting a new language please use the following format:

English name
Native name
ISO code
Flag
Script (optional)

(see Multiturquoise's post above)

Also, I'm not sure when it comes to adding Swedish dialects (we've have this discussion before for other languages). Maybe someone who knows more about the subject would like to comment?

[Karavinka]

English name: Karakhanid
Language name: ?
ISO code: xqa
Flag:

English name: Old Turkic
Language name: ?
ISO code: otk
Flag:

English name: Old Uighur
Language name: ?
ISO code: oui
Flag:

I need the native names before I can add these languages...

With the medieval/extinct languages, I think you could just leave the native name field blank like my last request for Ancient South Arabian.

[dEhiN]

Also, I'm not sure when it comes to adding Swedish dialects (we've have this discussion before for other languages). Maybe someone who knows more about the subject would like to comment?

But some of those aren't dialects per se (though of course it depends on who you talk to). For example, Johanna's native "dialect" is Westrogothian, but I'm pretty sure if you ask her, she considers it to be its own Germanic language. My understanding is that Värmlandic might be the only one that could actually be considered a dialect (or group of dialects ?) of Standard Swedish.

[MarkusP]

Also, I'm not sure when it comes to adding Swedish dialects (we've have this discussion before for other languages). Maybe someone who knows more about the subject would like to comment?

But some of those aren't dialects per se (though of course it depends on who you talk to). For example, Johanna's native "dialect" is Westrogothian, but I'm pretty sure if you ask her, she considers it to be its own Germanic language. My understanding is that Värmlandic might be the only one that could actually be considered a dialect (or group of dialects ?) of Standard Swedish.

My impression of Westrogothian has been that of a dialect, obviously having older traits. I'm not aware of its different varieties. Westrobothnian however is another story where some varieties are very distinct.

Värmland borders to several different counties. The southern varieties are pretty much Standard Swedish but with end-vowels rather being -e than -a.

Swedes have an extremely low awareness of their dialects, even of the ones inside their own county.

I'm very discontent with this: http://swedia.ling.gu.se/
The subjects (atleast the ones in Värmland) do speak very Swedishized forms.

[dEhiN]

My impression of Westrogothian has been that of a dialect, obviously having older traits. I'm not aware of its different varieties. Westrobothnian however is another story where some varieties are very distinct.

I'll ask Johanna what she considers Westrogothian (and also Westrobothnian) to be.

Värmland borders to several different counties. The southern varieties are pretty much Standard Swedish but with end-vowels rather being -e than -a.

Huh, I didn't know that; thanks!

I'm very discontented with this: http://swedia.ling.gu.se/
The subjects (atleast the ones in Värmland) do speak very Swedishized forms.

Instead of subjects, I would say "the people" or perhaps "the citizens". Subjects as referring to people is rarely used nowadays and is resemblant of feudal society with kings and lords and such. The people under the king/lord were subjects.

[OldBoring]

Legally you are also a subject of Elisabebeth II, Queen of Canada!

[MarkusP]

Instead of subjects, I would say "the people" or perhaps "the citizens". Subjects as referring to people is rarely used nowadays and is resemblant of feudal society with kings and lords and such. The people under the king/lord were subjects.

I meant the people who were being recorded

[Aurinĭa]

This post, as well as the two posts linked in it and a few posts following those, explain why certain dialect divisions were removed earlier this year.

[MarkusP]

This post, as well as the two posts linked in it and a few posts following those, explain why certain dialect divisions were removed earlier this year.

So for political reasons? Or "idle" flags?

[IpseDixit]

I'd have a few complaints and tips about the list. Probably I'm not the first one to raise these issues so bear with me:

1) Even though I myself have asked to add a dialect at least once in the past, I'm now quite convinced that we'd be better off without them. I mean, they're a waste of space and make it more difficult to navigate the language list, and above all - in many cases - they're not based on actual linguistic criteria but rather on countries, so - quite ironically - at the end of the day you don't even know what dialect a person really speaks.

2) I think we should get rid of flags too. They're nice and colorful and all but they represent countries or other political entities, not languages (except for a few ones maybe) and this could raise quite a few problems.

3) I also need to get this off my chest: I see people ask to add obscure languages that they themself are not going to study (or at least I'm under this impression, I mean I've seen people ask to add new languages and then they didn't even bother to add them to their profile). Is this really necessary, could you just ask to add languages that you are quite sure you're going to study?

[księżycowy]

I agree with you for the most part.

2) I think we should get rid of flags too. They're nice and colorful and all but they represents countries or other political entities, not languages (except for a few excpetions maybe) and this could raise quite a few problems.

You're not the only one on this one.
I tried the waters with this thread before: viewtopic.php?f=9&t=52875

Personally, I do think flags are neat, but they also create more headaches than they are worth.

[IpseDixit]

You're not the only one on this one.
I tried the waters with this thread before: viewtopic.php?f=9&t=52875

What a pity I didn't see it. :\

[księżycowy]

I only dealt with the flags associated with the language forums, so....

We could still start something (poll? discussion?) about the language flags. Or even the flags in general. Just because that poll is over doesn't mean the discussion has to be.