General discussion

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Yasna
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Re: General discussion

Postby Yasna » 2012-12-19, 21:14

Nice to see that someone in the Persian-speaking world knows how to design a website. It seems like all the Iranian news sites I find have an awful to mediocre layout. The best I've found is entekhab.ir. I would read this Afghan one if I wasn't concerned about Dari influencing the Iranian Persian that I strive for.
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Limagne
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Re: General discussion

Postby Limagne » 2012-12-20, 10:08

There's a bunch of other relatively well-designed news sites in Iranian Persian too.

http://www.khodnevis.org/persian/
http://www.mardomak.org/
http://www.roozonline.com/
http://www.baharnewspaper.com/

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Re: General discussion

Postby Kenny » 2013-02-10, 7:30

Sorry for butting in with an extralinguistic question but here it goes:
Since the "thumbs up" hand gesture is considered rude in Iran (apparently it's the equivalent of the middle finger in the Western world), how do you express the idea behind this Western construct with body language? Ie. how would you express "Great!" without opening your mouth, if that's at all possible?

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Re: General discussion

Postby hor_313 » 2013-02-24, 13:51

in iran you can use V gesture with your fingers instead "thumbs up"

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shprakh
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Re: General discussion

Postby shprakh » 2013-04-03, 5:29

Salâm! I'm here to whine.

I don't understand why some Persian courses, or any courses on languages written with the Arabic script, introduce new vocabulary without any transliteration or vowel marking. They even say that it's difficult for native speakers to know the exact pronunciation of an unknown word. I just don't get it. Maybe I'm just too dumb to figure it out myself.

Yes, I know that there is the audio to help us, but what if you can't get access to it or something?

[/whine]

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Yasna
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Re: General discussion

Postby Yasna » 2013-04-03, 15:49

shprakh wrote:Salâm! I'm here to whine.

I don't understand why some Persian courses, or any courses on languages written with the Arabic script, introduce new vocabulary without any transliteration or vowel marking. They even say that it's difficult for native speakers to know the exact pronunciation of an unknown word. I just don't get it. Maybe I'm just too dumb to figure it out myself.

Yes, I know that there is the audio to help us, but what if you can't get access to it or something?

[/whine]

I've thought the same thing to myself many times. It's really aggravating.
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Re: General discussion

Postby shprakh » 2013-04-03, 16:32

Yasna wrote:I've thought the same thing to myself many times. It's really aggravating.


I'm not alone then. Good.

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Limagne
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Re: General discussion

Postby Limagne » 2013-04-03, 18:44

You'll overcome it once you start to understand how words are built.

Obviously, as much of Persian vocabulary was taken from a number of languages, the task is quite daunting.

If you're really having a hard time guessing how things are pronounced and feel it is hampering your learning, then by all mean spend some time on formal lexical study. It will prove very useful for the later stages of your studies.

I remember when I started reading short news articles on the BBC Persian website, I was always struggling with compound nouns and adjectives.

Arabic roots have their fair share of quirks and intricacies, but if you put in some effort they definitely shouldn't be too hard to tame.

Take the arabic nouns starting with an alef for instance. I was always reading them wrong until I realized that irregular plurals usually take a fatheh (اَسرار : asrâr - mysteries), while verbal nouns need a kasreh (اِصرار : esrâr - insistence). Most of the time you can readily infer from context wether the word in question is a plural or an abstract verbal noun.

Get your hands on a good reference grammar. Both Lambton and Mace have dense sections dealing with word building (moreso the former than the latter though). If you want something free, then I can only praise Philott's Higher Persian Grammar. There's nothing more comprehensive on the market.

No need to worry though. I'd say it's normal if you have the impression to hit a brick wall when you try to read native material on your own. Vocabulary acquisition and a conscious study of grammar will eventually solve the problem.

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Re: General discussion

Postby shprakh » 2013-04-05, 5:17

Thanks, Limagne. That was rather interesting and helpful :)

Yes, I've been told that it gets better with time when you know the language better, but I believe this is more true for Arabic, since Persian is not a Semitic language after all and the alphabet doesn't really suit it.

I still think that beginner resources should have transliterations of all words. I feel that by thinking that they'll make the learning process faster for the learner if they only use the script, they actually slow it down.

Anyway, I'm going to continue learning as many words as I can from several sources and then I'll worry about writing. I practise reading texts with words that I already know, for example with Assimil, and it's not bad. Writing Persian is much harder.

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Re: General discussion

Postby Meera » 2013-08-12, 17:26

shprakh wrote:Salâm! I'm here to whine.

I don't understand why some Persian courses, or any courses on languages written with the Arabic script, introduce new vocabulary without any transliteration or vowel marking. They even say that it's difficult for native speakers to know the exact pronunciation of an unknown word. I just don't get it. Maybe I'm just too dumb to figure it out myself.

Yes, I know that there is the audio to help us, but what if you can't get access to it or something?

[/whine]


Yeah it's iratating to me too, but I think the courses do this on purpose. Because in the long run you have to know the word without the vowels. I know it's frustrating, but it will help you read words later on.
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Re: General discussion

Postby YngNghymru » 2013-09-03, 22:51

To be fair, if the course has audio it's not designed to be used without audio. Trying to do an audio course without audio is a bit silly to start with.

That said, a lot of courses (and dictionaries!) have this problem and are not provided with audio. Words from Arabic are often predictable, it's true, but there is no predictability in native Persian vocabulary at all - you have to learn the words, or at least the morphemes. Unfortunately, Persian being written with Arabic script introduces a lot of issues for non-natives (and for natives - I'd imagine a lot of people have trouble spelling words from Arabic or spelt Arabic-style, for example). I'd suggest looking into derivational morphology, as other people have said - it helps a lot with guessing the pronunciation of new words. forvo should have lots of Persian words on it and may also be able to help you.
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Re: General discussion

Postby Rémy LeBeau » 2014-04-21, 13:31

So, it's been a while! In the three years since I've been MIA from the forums, I've been living in Kabul, and for the last half year in Dushanbe. If all goes well in June I will be moving to Tehran for the next two years or so.

One thing I've always found a bit lacking over my years of study is the level of my handwriting. I'm interested in getting a calligraphy tutor or attending calligraphy classes in Tehran once I move. I'll be working a full time job and occasionally travelling as part of it, so I won't be able to attend courses that require regular attendance during normal work hours. If anyone has any recommendations based on their own experiences or the experiences of others, please let me know.

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Re: General discussion

Postby Yasna » 2014-04-21, 16:28

Rémy LeBeau wrote:If all goes well in June I will be moving to Tehran for the next two years or so.

I'm jealous. If you have time, tell us once in a while about your experiences so I can live vicariously through you. :)
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Re: General discussion

Postby eskandar » 2014-04-21, 21:20

Welcome back Jade. What will you be doing for work in Tehran? I don't know specific information on evening calligraphy classes there (though they may well exist) but getting a calligraphy tutor should actually be pretty easy. I can put you in touch with some folks once you're there. It looks like the regular class times for this organization would fall during working hours, but you might also contact them and see if they can arrange private lessons for you that work with your schedule.
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Re: General discussion

Postby Rémy LeBeau » 2014-04-22, 8:28

I'll be working with the relevant ministries of the Iranian and Iraqi governments on the exhumation, identification and repatriation of soldiers from the war.

The Calligrapher's Association classes seem like just the sort of thing I would have loved to have done full time. I'll make a trip to their Tehran office when I'm there and see if I can find someone willing to tutor me privately outside of class hours.

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Re: General discussion

Postby Michael » 2014-07-21, 1:22

I've been wanting to learn Nasta‘līq for a very long time now. I got from Amazon two books on it, one an introductory course on Iranian Nasta‘līq and the other TY Urdu Script. Both are great books.
American English (en-us) Pizzonese (nap) N Italian (it) Mexican Spanish (es-mx) Brazilian Portuguese (pt-br) Albanian (sq) B1 Greek (el) Persian (fa) A2 Turkish (tr) Azerbaijani (az) Old English (en_old) A1
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Re: General discussion

Postby Meera » 2014-07-21, 4:35

Aóristos wrote:I've been wanting to learn Nasta‘līq for a very long time now. I got from Amazon two books on it, one an introductory course on Iranian Nasta‘līq and the other TY Urdu Script. Both are great books.

I loved the TY Urdu Script. It helped me so much.
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Re: General discussion

Postby Michael » 2014-08-31, 14:21

این فروم خیلی‌ خاموش شده‌است. کاش که در آن زمان‌ها اینجا باشم…
American English (en-us) Pizzonese (nap) N Italian (it) Mexican Spanish (es-mx) Brazilian Portuguese (pt-br) Albanian (sq) B1 Greek (el) Persian (fa) A2 Turkish (tr) Azerbaijani (az) Old English (en_old) A1
“Iċ eom māra þonne þes middanġeard; lǣssa þonne håndwyrm; leohtre þonne mōna; swiftre þonne sunne.”

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Re: General discussion

Postby mojnia » 2014-10-09, 9:29

Aóristos wrote:I've been wanting to learn Nasta‘līq for a very long time now. I got from Amazon two books on it, one an introductory course on Iranian Nasta‘līq and the other TY Urdu Script. Both are great books.


for learning nastaliq you can see this site :
http://www.nastaliqonline.ir

you see this link: http://s5.picofile.com/file/8144948518/nastaliq.jpg

http://s5.picofile.com/file/8144951018/ ... r_aspx.jpg
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Re: General discussion

Postby nadi » 2015-01-04, 12:16

فارسی را خیلی دوست دارم ولی سختی برای من این است که وقتی می نویسم نمی توانم فرق بین حرفهای ص س ث را بشناسم. حرفهای دیگر هم همانطور هستند. ط ت، ض ز ذ ظ ... شما این سختی را چطور حل کردید؟


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