Kurmanji Study Group

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Kurmanji Study Group

Postby voron » 2018-07-09, 15:16

This is a group for Kurmanji studies. :partyhat:

We're going to do the textbook Hînker 3. (PM me if you want to get this textbook).
The level of the book is B1-B2.

Rate
I suggest 1 chapter per 2 weeks. There are 8 chapter plus the opening chapter named "Beginning".

Supplementary materials
Grammar: https://sites.fas.harvard.edu/~iranian/ ... rammar.pdf
Dictionaries: Glosbe, Google Translate

Kurmanji grammar is fairly straightforward, so anyone with some knowledge of Persian and/or Hindi/Urdu should be able to follow this book.

There is currently Vijay and me who're going to do this book together, and I hope we can get more learners as we go.

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Re: Kurmanji Study Group

Postby vijayjohn » 2018-07-09, 15:25

Yay! Thanks so much for creating this group! :mrgreen:

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Re: Kurmanji Study Group

Postby voron » 2018-07-09, 15:42

Chapter Destpêk (Beginning)
Plan: July 9 - July 23

My notes about some expressions in this chapter, and the book in general.
Asta Sêyemîn - the 3rd level
ast - level, -a is the construct state ending for feminine nouns
sê - three
(y)emîn - used to produce ordinal numbers from cardinal

The chapter is divided into 5 sections. Names of the sections:

Xwenasandin
xwe - reflexive pronoun (similar to German sich and Russian свой -- and probably a cognate with them)
nasandin - comes from nasîn (to know)
-în - an infinitive ending. All verbs with this ending are regular.

Replacing -în with -andin produces the causative of the verb.
nasandin - to make know; to introduce
xwenasandin - introducing yourself

Cînavk û qertaf
cînavk - pronoun
qertaf - affix

This chapter revises the personal pronouns and the copula affixes in the present tense.

Veqetandek
veqetandek - izafe marker

Heye/Hene
heye/hene - there is/there are

Tewang
tewang - declension

As we see from the section names, this chapter should remind (or teach) us the noun morphology.

Vijay, what would you like to do with this chapter? Perhaps translating the texts? Or doing the exercises? It's old material for me so I don't need to stay on it for too long. For the subsequent chapters I'm planning to create Excel sheets with new words (perhaps I'll later export them into Anki), and maybe doing some of the exercises.

Also, make sure that for every musical exercise you find and listen to the song in the exercise. Kurdish songs are so awesome!
For example, in the "Cînavk û qertaf" section:
Image

Here's the song: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fGDhDBHqY_4

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Re: Kurmanji Study Group

Postby voron » 2018-07-09, 15:46

vijayjohn wrote:Yay! Thanks so much for creating this group! :mrgreen:

It's totally my pleasure! Ser çava!

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Re: Kurmanji Study Group

Postby vijayjohn » 2018-07-09, 15:46

All right, I think we can try just doing the exercises, actually. :D

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Re: Kurmanji Study Group

Postby Antea » 2018-07-09, 15:57

I am going to take a look. But with my zero level, I don’t know where I will get :roll:

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Re: Kurmanji Study Group

Postby voron » 2018-07-09, 17:35

vijayjohn wrote:All right, I think we can try just doing the exercises, actually. :D

Ok, let's do the exercises in turn then (you do the 1st, I do the 2nd etc). You start!

Antea feel free to join anytime you wish!

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Re: Kurmanji Study Group

Postby Antea » 2018-07-09, 20:07

Thanks! I am very happy to get to know this language :D . But first I have to study... :roll:
Last edited by Antea on 2018-07-24, 12:38, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Kurmanji Study Group

Postby vijayjohn » 2018-07-10, 0:54

1. Rûken ji Wanê ye.
2. Rûken hevdeh salî ye.
3. Rûken xwendekar e.
4. Çavên Rûkenê qehweyî ne.
5. Belê, Rûken keçeke dirêj e.
6. Sosin diya Rûkenê ye.
7. Porê Sosinê zer û kurt e.
8. Remo bavê Rûkenê ye.
9. Remo karsaz e.
10. Rohat û Ferhat birayên Rûkenê ne.

EDIT: I'm listening to "Ez berf im," and the lyrics sound a little different both from what the book says and what this says. The book says "çiyayê," the link I just gave says "çiyakê," and it sounds more like "çiyangê" to me. :P Is that just dialect variation within Kurmanji or something?

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Re: Kurmanji Study Group

Postby voron » 2018-07-10, 2:24

Wow Vijay! I'm happy that our group is taking off!

As far as I can tell, there are no mistakes in your exercise (and I assume it wasn't particularly difficult for you).
vijayjohn wrote: I'm listening to "Ez berf im," and the lyrics sound a little different both from what the book says and what this says. The book says "çiyayê," the link I just gave says "çiyakê," and it sounds more like "çiyangê" to me.

Çiya, çiyak, çiyang -- they all exist and mean 'mountain'. Yes, it's a dialect variation.

You can find many more performances of 'Ez berf im' on youtube, it's a very popular song that everyone knows, for example:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I7XS2DrvLx0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T3ADiqDhXm4

I won't make you wait too long! Here are my answers to the next exercise (Section B, Exercise 2):
1. Zozan xweşik e. - Zozan is pretty.
2. Zîlan ji Amedê ye. - Zilan is from Amed (=Kurdish name of Diyarbakır).
3. Ez tî me. - I am thirsty.
4. Em xwendekar in. - We are students.
5. Mala me mezin e. - Our house is big.
6. Tu delal î. - You are beautiful.
7. Pisîka min nexweş e. - My cat is sick.
8. Hûn ji ku derê ne? - Where are you (pl.) from?
9. Birayên min jîr in. - My brothers are smart.
10. Xwişkên te çawa ne? - How are your sisters?
11. Mamosteya me baş e. - Our teacher is good.
12. Ew buha ye. - That is expensive.
13. Bavê min cotkar e. - My father is a farmer.
14. Zelal û Delal xwişkên min in. - Zelal and Delal are my sisters.
15. Nave wê Derya ye. - Her name is Derya.

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Re: Kurmanji Study Group

Postby vijayjohn » 2018-07-11, 0:27

Next exercise (hopefully I understood how to do it correctly):

Diya min kin e.
Hevalê min dirêj e.
Ev derî lawaz e.
Bavê min qelew e. :silly:
Heval-xebatê min teral in. :?: (I meant 'my co-workers are lazy' :P).
Birayê min jîr e.
Keça birayê min bedew e.
Zêrr buha ye.
Tu zana yi.
Em rûvekirî ne.
Ez xwîngerm im.
Gul xweşik in.

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Re: Kurmanji Study Group

Postby voron » 2018-07-11, 2:11

vijayjohn wrote:Next exercise (hopefully I understood how to do it correctly):

Yeah, the task says 'Create sentences (hevok) with the adjectives (rengdêr) below'.

Heval-xebatê min teral in. :?: (I meant 'my co-workers are lazy' :P).

We can say hevkar (colleage).
Hevkarên min teral in.

Keça birayê min bedew e.

Double izafe, cool!

Zêrr buha ye.

The digraph 'rr' is an attempt to reform the alphabet to distinguish between the flap and the trill which is phonemic in Kurmanji, but AFAIK it's not currently standardized in Kurmanji (and AFAIK, it is standardized in Zazaki). The book doesn't use it (so the spelling used by the book would be 'zêr').

Here is the next exercise.
Section B (Cînavk û qertaf), part b (cînavkên kesane yên tewandî -- 'declined' personal pronouns, i.e. personal pronouns in the oblique case)
Exercise 4
1. Xwişkeke min heye. Nave wê Besê ye.
2. Du birayên min hene. Navên wan Serhat û Serdar in.
3. Ev Apê min e. Navê wî Bahoz e.

It was too short, I'll do the next exercise as well.
Exercise 5
Navê min Zelal e. Ez ji Mêrdînê me. Ez pazdeh (15) salî me. Çavên min reş in. Porê min kin e.

Navê bavê min Cemîl e. Ew çil (40) salî ye. Ew zîvker (silversmith) e. Çavên wî reş in. Porê wi qehweyî ye. Ew dirêj u lawaz e. Bavê min gelekî zarşêrîn (well-spoken, articulate) e.

Diya min Selma sî û heşt (38) salî ye. Ew bermalî (housewife) ye. Çavên wê şîn in. Porê wê xingalî (curly) ye. Ew dirêj e. Diya min rûgeş (cheerful, smiling) e.

Du xwişkên min hene. Navên wan Fatma û Zozan in. Fatma sêzdeh (13) salî ye. Ew xwendekar e. Ew çavşîn e. Zozan yek salî ye. Çavên wê hingivîn (honey) in.

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Re: Kurmanji Study Group

Postby Antea » 2018-07-11, 14:37

Please, carry on with your study at your usual pace. I am just a guest here. I am interested in the language, but obviously I am not going to follow you at your rythm, nor will I do the exercises. I am doing a more general approach,as I am a complete beginner, and compulsory methods do not work very well on me :nope:

By the way,I found this link that seems interesting for a beginner http://www.learnkurmanji.com :hmm:

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Re: Kurmanji Study Group

Postby vijayjohn » 2018-07-13, 4:48

Exercise 6

Ez keç im, keça kurdan im.
Kullîka serê lawan im.
Rîhana rez û çeman im.
Lawiko ez bêrîvan im.

Like you found for exercise 4, voron, I find this exercise pretty short, so I'll move on to the next one while continuing to listen to this. :P

Exercise 7

Navê dapîra min Asya ye. Ew şêst û sê salî ye. Porê wê spî ye. Çavê wê reş in. Ew qelew e. Bapîrê min şêst û şes salî ye. Navê wî Temo ye. Porê wî spi ye.

Apê min heye. Navê wî Ferman e. Ew parêzer e. Navê amojina min Nazê ye. Ew bijîşk e. Ew gelekî xwîngerm e. Navê pismamê min Firat e. Ew deh salî ye. Ew çavsîn e. Ew yekî şermok ye.

Btw Antea, I know I'm kind of jumping the gun, but what do you think of maybe doing lesson 1 from learnkurmanji.com by next Saturday (July 21)? :whistle:

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Re: Kurmanji Study Group

Postby voron » 2018-07-13, 13:59

vijayjohn wrote:while continuing to listen to this. :P

:good4u:

Kullîka Kulîlka

Ew yekî şermok ye.


Exercise 8
I'm skipping it because it is too simple -- it just asks to underline the instances of izafe.

Exercise 9
Skipping it too -- it asks to write a text using the text from Exercise 8 as an example; so it's just replacing personal names and adjectives.

Exercise 10
It asks to write a text about your family -- skipping it too, don't feel like doing it. :silly:

Exercise 11
Construct sentences with the words below.

1. Jêhat xortekî teral e.
2. Selma ji Mêrdînê ye.
3. Porê min dirêj e.
4. Ew keçeke jîr e.
5. Bavê min zilamekî zana ye.
6. Diya Azad rûken ê.
7. Xaniyê wan mezin e.
8. Bavê hevalê min parlamenter e.
9. Hevsera birayê Zozanê bedew e.
10. Deriyê mala me zexm e.
11. Birayê Dîlanê mirovekî hêja ye.
12. Tu jineke çalak î.
13. Ferhat zilamekî çeleng e.
14. Teriya pisîkê kurt e.
15. Li Amedê dêrên (church) ermenan hene.
16. Ew keçeke zexel e.
17. Xaniyê apê wî mezin e.
18 Birayê hevsera Cemîl parêzer e.
19. Lîstika zarokan xweş e.
20. Meta min jineke jêhatî ye.

Note that there is a spelling change happening when we add a suffix to the nouns ending with -î:
xanî - xaniye
derî - deriye
terî - teriya
(î changes to i before y).

Vijay, if you like, you can do Exercise 10 and write about your family. Or, go ahead and continue with Chapter 1 (Nasîn).

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Re: Kurmanji Study Group

Postby vijayjohn » 2018-07-14, 4:56

Thanks for the corrections and comments! :) I probably went a little overboard with Exercise 10 here, but I thought I'd try anyway. :silly:

Navê bavê min Thomas e. Ew bîrkar e. :) Ew hinek qelew e. :twisted: :whistle: Lê gelek aqildar û şîrin e! Ew aşpêjê baş e. Porê wî spî ye.

Navê diya min Prabha ye. Ew zikmakîzan e. Ew kurt e. Porê wê reş e. Dê-bavê min hindiyanî ne lê hemwelatiyên Amerîkayê ne.

Yek birayê min heye. Navê wî Chand e.

Okay, this is what I meant. :P
► Show Spoiler

Lol I didn't really feel like writing more than that. :silly:

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Re: Kurmanji Study Group

Postby voron » 2018-07-16, 17:25

vijayjohn wrote:Ew aşpêjê baş e.

Yek birayê min heye

Hînker prefers using the indefinite construct ending here:
Ew aşpêjekî baş e.
Birayekî min heye.

I'm going ahead with Chapter 1 'Nasîn' (Introduction).
Exercise 1
1. Ez ji muzika kurdî ya nûjen hez dikim. (I like modern Kurdish music)
2. Kêfa min ji stranbêjên Şahê Bedo û Aram Serhad re tê. (I enjoy the singers Şahe Bedo and Aram Serhad)
3. Na, ez Evdalê Zeynikê nas nakim. Lê niha ez li stranekî wî ji youtube guhdarî dikim û kêfa min jê re tê. (No, I don't know Evdalê Zeynikê. But now I'm listening to his song from youtube, and I'm enjoying it.)

I've read the text and written down the new words in Excel.

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Re: Kurmanji Study Group

Postby voron » 2018-07-16, 20:06

voron wrote:Chapter Destpêk (Beginning)
Plan: July 9 - July 23

And we completed it in 1 week instead of the planned 2 weeks. Vijay, we rock!

I don't want to rush so let's plan 2 weeks for Chapter 1 as well, and see if we can do it faster.
Chapter 1 'Nasîn'
Plan: July 16 - July 30

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Re: Kurmanji Study Group

Postby księżycowy » 2018-07-16, 20:12

Not to interrupt, but I got my Kurdish textbook today, and I have to say, it's pretty good! Now to decide if I want to join in or not. :P

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Re: Kurmanji Study Group

Postby voron » 2018-07-16, 20:20

Can you remind me what is the book that you bought? Also, why do you like it?


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