Pronunciation of R

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Ynas Midgard
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Pronunciation of R

Postby Ynas Midgard » 2012-08-13, 23:40

Hi there!

I understand that there is a much greater variation regarding the pronunciation of R than, for instance, in English. As I noticed in some Swedes' speech at least two different Rs (namely, a trilled variant and an approximant not unlike in English, the latter one appearing mostly before consonants (with which R is not combined to make a retroflex sound), I assumed it was not free variation but some sort of complementary distribution.

My question is: are the different R sounds of Swedish in complementary distribution, and if so, in which environments do they appear?

Thank you for your help in advance!

Mac of BIOnighT
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Re: Pronunciation of R

Postby Mac of BIOnighT » 2012-10-08, 23:33

Hope someone will answer, as I've been wondering about the same thing...

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Jurgen Wullenwever
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Re: Pronunciation of R

Postby Jurgen Wullenwever » 2012-10-10, 17:05

The r is rather weak in Swedish, and there are several possible ways of pronouncing it, but I have never thought about if they could be distributed in any particular way. My r is usually as the Welsh rh.
Chekhov wrote:I don't know about naive worldviews, but Jurgen Wullenwhatever pisses me off to no end because of his extreme pessimism and cynicism. You'd think the world was going to end imminently when talking to that guy.

Jag är rebell: jag sockrar teet, saltar maten, cyklar utan hjälm, och tänder glödlampor.
(Ovanstående var förut, nu försöker jag minska sockret och saltet.)

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linguoboy
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Re: Pronunciation of R

Postby linguoboy » 2012-10-10, 20:12

Jurgen Wullenwever wrote:My r is usually as the Welsh rh.

Voiceless, really?
"Richmond is a real scholar; Owen just learns languages because he can't bear not to know what other people are saying."--Margaret Lattimore on her two sons

Midnatt
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Re: Pronunciation of R

Postby Midnatt » 2012-10-10, 20:21

Well I found it almost voiceless in words like kort or fjorton , but the sound was kinda different from what I heard in där borta. :)

P.S. My ears may be deceiving me though :D

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Re: Pronunciation of R

Postby Mac of BIOnighT » 2012-10-10, 22:32

What I've noticed so far is that there's an R in a way similar to the Italian one (but not as "bold"), one similar to the American one (again, not as strong) and an "absent" one as in the British "cart" (more a pause, or a prolonging of the preceding vowel, than a sound).
They seem to depend on/be caused by the surrounding phonemes and be, therefore, unavoidable, as opposed to being chosen word by word.

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Jurgen Wullenwever
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Re: Pronunciation of R

Postby Jurgen Wullenwever » 2012-10-11, 20:51

linguoboy wrote:
Jurgen Wullenwever wrote:My r is usually as the Welsh rh.

Voiceless, really?

Yes, usually as some h + weak r + ɕ, but it sometimes is voiced and then only a ʑ.
Chekhov wrote:I don't know about naive worldviews, but Jurgen Wullenwhatever pisses me off to no end because of his extreme pessimism and cynicism. You'd think the world was going to end imminently when talking to that guy.

Jag är rebell: jag sockrar teet, saltar maten, cyklar utan hjälm, och tänder glödlampor.
(Ovanstående var förut, nu försöker jag minska sockret och saltet.)

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linguoboy
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Re: Pronunciation of R

Postby linguoboy » 2012-10-11, 21:03

Jurgen Wullenwever wrote:
linguoboy wrote:
Jurgen Wullenwever wrote:My r is usually as the Welsh rh.

Voiceless, really?

Yes, usually as some h + weak r + ɕ, but it sometimes is voiced and then only a ʑ.

I'm not sure what you mean by "weak r". The Welsh /r/ is a very strongly-rolled trill with no retroflex quality.
"Richmond is a real scholar; Owen just learns languages because he can't bear not to know what other people are saying."--Margaret Lattimore on her two sons

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Jurgen Wullenwever
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Re: Pronunciation of R

Postby Jurgen Wullenwever » 2012-10-11, 21:15

When I listened to someone recently, the Welsh r was strong like Finnish r, but the Welsh rh more like the Swedish r that I use, sort of similar to my Swedish tj, but a little different, and with a slight short trill.
Chekhov wrote:I don't know about naive worldviews, but Jurgen Wullenwhatever pisses me off to no end because of his extreme pessimism and cynicism. You'd think the world was going to end imminently when talking to that guy.

Jag är rebell: jag sockrar teet, saltar maten, cyklar utan hjälm, och tänder glödlampor.
(Ovanstående var förut, nu försöker jag minska sockret och saltet.)


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