Saim'in notları - türkçe

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Re: Saim'in notları - türkçe

Postby Saim » 2017-09-28, 19:27

Derya Ulag - Okyanus

Her yerde okyanus, sen boğuldun derede
Zamanla unutulur, hani aklın nerede?
Saatin mi bozuldu, niye kaldın geçmişte?
Al bi' zaman bi' de akıl
Bu da benden sana hediye

You're surrounded by ocean but you drowned in a river
It'll be forgotten over time, but where is your mind
Is your watch broken, why did get stuck in the past
Get a little sense and some time, my gift to you

boğmak - to drown tr. (I assume boğulmak is intransitive)
unutulmak - to be forgotten (I assume the -ul here is the same -ul that differentiates boğmak and boğulmak, as unutmak means to forget)
hani - where?
bozulmak - to fail, break down, go bad (bozmak - to ruin, corrupt, spoil; here's -ul again)
bi' - short for bir?
hediye - gift (ar. هدية)

Dön hadi artık dünyaya
Aç gözünü zaman dar
Vazgeç artık eh be yavrum
Bunun sonu çok zarar

Come back to the real world
Open your eyes, time is short
Let it go baby
Before all this hurts you

dar - narrow
vazgeçmek - to give up, quit
zarar (noun!) - damage (ar. ضرر)
bunun sonu - the end of this?

Eller ne dese inanmadın
Yürek yandı aldırmadın
Vuruldu kaç kere yüzüne
Sevmiyor dediler duymadın

You did not believe what others said
Your heart burned but you didn't mind
They told many times to your face that
She doesn't love you but you didn't hear

dese - from demek I imagine but I'm not sure what this form is
inanmak - to believe
yürek - heart
yanmak - burn
aldırmak - to mind
yüz - face
vurulmak - to be hit (vurmak - to hit)
duymak - hear

I find it interesting that the word for ocean is so close to the original Greek in both Turkish and Hebrew (אוקיינוס), whereas in most European languages (including English) it's changed a lot more, and in Arabic it seems to be different (محيط). Also Turkish dere is probably cognate to Urdu دریا (although according to the dictionary nehir is river and dere is creak).

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Re: Saim'in notları - türkçe

Postby voron » 2017-09-28, 21:34

Saim wrote:aldırmak - to mind

That's the key word in the refrain of the Turkish version of "Frozen":
Aldırma, aldırma! Engel olamıyorum.
Aldırma, aldırma! Uzaklaşmak istiyorum.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RlojsQlulrI&t=1m14s
:)

Saim wrote:dese - from demek I imagine but I'm not sure what this form is

-se is the conditional suffix (if...), and used together with a question word it gives the meaning of "-ever":
Eller ne dese -- whatever people say.

All your guesses are correct.
-ul is the passive voice suffix (yapmak - to do, yapılmak - to be done, etc)
bi' is short for bir (always pronounced like that in colloquial language)
bunun sonu - the end of this

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Re: Saim'in notları - türkçe

Postby eskandar » 2017-09-28, 21:41

Saim wrote:Also Turkish dere is probably cognate to Urdu دریا (although according to the dictionary nehir is river and dere is creak).

I don't think so. Turkish dere meaning "valley" comes from Persian دره but I'm not sure if dere meaning "creek" is the result of semantic drift, or is an unrelated homophone of Turkic origin. Turkish does have derya (from Persian دریا , source of the Urdu word) and nehir is cognate to Urdu نہر (ultimately from Arabic).
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Re: Saim'in notları - türkçe

Postby Saim » 2017-09-29, 16:20

voron wrote:-se is the conditional suffix (if...), and used together with a question word it gives the meaning of "-ever":
Eller ne dese -- whatever people say.

All your guesses are correct.
-ul is the passive voice suffix (yapmak - to do, yapılmak - to be done, etc)
bi' is short for bir (always pronounced like that in colloquial language)
bunun sonu - the end of this


I knew the pair yapmak - yapılmak but I guess I didn't look at it from a grammatical perspective. Or maybe I did learn it and then forgot. :lol:

So the literal meaning of bunun sonu çok zarar would be 'the end of this hurts a lot' (and 'before all this hurts you'
is just a more poetic way to translate it in the context of the song)?

eskandar wrote:
Saim wrote:Also Turkish dere is probably cognate to Urdu دریا (although according to the dictionary nehir is river and dere is creak).

I don't think so. Turkish dere meaning "valley" comes from Persian دره but I'm not sure if dere meaning "creek" is the result of semantic drift, or is an unrelated homophone of Turkic origin. Turkish does have derya (from Persian دریا , source of the Urdu word) and nehir is cognate to Urdu نہر (ultimately from Arabic).


Yani hatalıydım. Teşekkür ederim. :)

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Re: Saim'in notları - türkçe

Postby Saim » 2017-09-29, 16:34

Speaking of Frozen;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RlojsQlulrI&t=1m14s

Pırıldıyor kar taneleri
Bütün izler silinmiş
Bir soyutlanma kırallığı
Bense sanki prensesi

pırıldıyor - to twinkle; GT gives the infinitives parıldamak and parlamak; maybe the first ı is a typo?
iz - mark, trace
silinmiş - ?
soyutlanma - isolation
-se sanki - as if

Rüzgar uluyor coşan fırtına gibi
Durduramadım oysa denedim

ulumak - howl
coşan - gushing
fırtına - storm
durdurmak - to stop
oysa - whereas, but

Aman sakla görmesinler
Seni iyi biri sansınlar
Ört hisleri bilmesinler
Biliyorlarr

aman - oh!, mercy, quarter (I assume the first meaning here)
saklamak - to hide
örtmek - to cover

-sin-, -sın- - ?

Aldırma aldırma
Engel olamıyorum
Aldırma aldırma
Uzaklaşmak istiyorum

engel - obstacle
uzaklaşmak - move away

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Re: Saim'in notları - türkçe

Postby voron » 2017-09-29, 17:11

Saim wrote:Speaking of Frozen;

:D Everyone loves Frozen.

pırıldıyor - to twinkle; GT gives the infinitives parıldamak and parlamak; maybe the first ı is a typo?

Nah, GT doesn't know everything:
http://tureng.com/en/turkish-english/p% ... 4%B1ldamak
http://www.tdk.gov.tr/index.php?option= ... 4%B1ldamak

silinmiş - ?

Passive voice again. The verb is "silmek" (to erase), and "-in-" is a positional variant of "-il-" after the root ending in a vowel or the "l" consonant (*sililmek would sound ugly). -miş- is the past participle suffix. So,

silinmiş = to erase + the passive voice + the past participle = (having been) erased

aman - oh!, mercy, quarter (I assume the first meaning here)

It's used in Serbian too (as an interjection) no?
http://hjp.znanje.hr/index.php?show=sea ... tnXg%3D%3D

-sin-, -sın- - ?

This is the imperative suffix in the 3rd person: "let him/her/them... ", similar to the Serbian "da".
görmesinler - let them not see, Serbian: da ne vide
sakla görmesinler - hide so that they don't see, Serbian: sakrij da ne vide

EDIT:
-se sanki - as if

Hmm they don't mean "as if" together, just sanki is enough.

"-se" is a contraction of ise (bense = ben ise), and, besides being the conditional particle, it also has another meaning: it's a contrastive conjunction, quite similar to the Slavic "a", which switches attention to a new topic.
Bir soyutlanma kırallığı - To je izmišljeno kraljestvo
Bense sanki prensesi - A ja sam kao njegova princeza

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Re: Saim'in notları - türkçe

Postby voron » 2017-09-29, 17:32

Saim wrote:So the literal meaning of bunun sonu çok zarar would be 'the end of this hurts a lot' (and 'before all this hurts you' is just a more poetic way to translate it in the context of the song)?

Yeah sure. The literal translation is smth like "The end of this is a big loss".

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Re: Saim'in notları - türkçe

Postby eskandar » 2017-09-30, 4:51

voron wrote:
Saim wrote:aman - oh!, mercy, quarter (I assume the first meaning here)

It's used in Serbian too (as an interjection) no?

I've long wondered how Urdu escaped picking this one up when it's ubiquitous in Arabic, Persian, Turkish, Kurdish, even Greek...
Away from Unilang until further notice.

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Re: Saim'in notları - türkçe

Postby kalemiye » 2017-11-22, 10:46

Yani hatalıydım.


In this case you'd say "yanıldım" :)
Not available

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Re: Saim'in notları - türkçe

Postby Saim » 2017-12-27, 18:19

Gülşen - Bangır Bangır
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=icZ-OlVSvb4

Yanım çok kalabalık sesin gelmiyor bağır
Müzik son ses bangır bangır
Ağzı bozuk şarkılar tuttum sana biraz ağır
Haydi, haydi saldır saldır
Gül gibi uyuyan yılanı uyandırdın
Garanti bildin beni, havalandın
Yürek yemiş sanki mübarek
Neyine güvendin evladım?
Gül gibi uyuyan yılanı uyandırdın
Garanti bildin beni havalandın
Adın bensiz buralarda etkisiz eleman, sıfır aldın

yan - side
bağırmak - to shout
bangır bangır - loudly (bangır bangır bağırmak, bangır bangır çalmak)
tutmak - to hold, keep
ağzı bozuk - profine (ağzı bozukluk - profanity)
saldırmak - to attack
uyuyan - sleeping
yılan - snake
uyandırmak - to wake up (tr.; intr. uyanmak)
havalanmak - to lift, take off; to act flirtatiously
yürek - heart
yemiş - fruit (?)
sanki - as if, like
güvenmek - to trust
evladım - son, boy
etkisiz - ineffective
eleman - element, component

Very crowded around me, can't hear you, shout
Music at full blast, loudly
Got some explicit songs for you, might offend you
Come on, go on attack
You woke up the peacefully sleeping snake
You've taken me for granted and got cocky
You got too overconfident
What did you rely on boy?
You woke up the peacefully sleeping snake
You've taken me for granted and got cocky
Your name is of no worth without me, a score of zero

Yavrum kaldır kollarını
Teslim ol etrafın sarılı
Sabret af çıksın sana
Ben öptürcem bu evin yollarını
Yavrum kaldır kollarını
Teslim ol etrafın sarılı
Bunlar iyi günler
Sana ben gösterecem kıvrak oyunlarımı

kaldırmak - remove, lift
kol - arm
teslim - surrender, delivery (teslim olmak - to surrender, ar. تسليم, ur. تسلیم)
etraf - surroundings (cognate to ur. اطراف, from ar. أطراف; synonyms taraflar, yanlar)
sarılı - wrapped, covered
sabret! - be patient! (related to ur. صبر کرنا?)
af çıksın sana - not sure about the construction here
öpmek - to kiss (-tür- marks the causative)
kıvrak - agile

Put your arms up babe
Give up you're surrounded
Be patient until you're forgiven
I'll make you kiss the paths to this home
Put your arms up babe
Give up you're surrounded
These are the good days
Gonna show you my wicked tricks
Last edited by Saim on 2018-01-01, 16:58, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Saim'in notları - türkçe

Postby Saim » 2018-01-01, 16:58

İrem Derici - Evlenmene Bak

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-dpdsuewpYI

Beni üzgün görmezsin, çünkü buna değmezsin
Aşk önünde beklenilmez yar
Hızlı geçer görmezsin, toz dumandan ölmezsin
Bir gider ki farkedilmez yar

üzgün - upset
buna değmez - not worth it
beklenilmek - to be expected, waited for
toz - dust
duman - smoke
farkedilmez - inconspicuous (farkedilebilir - noticeable)
yar - cliff (in the fourth line, in the second it's cognate to Urdu/Punjabi یار)

You won't see me upset, because you're not worthy of this
Darling ,you can't stay against love
You'll go fast and not see it, you won't die from the cloud of dust
They will go, the inconspicuous cliff

Alemsin, işte böyle beklersin
Bir de bebek istersin, oldu hoşçakal
Bendensin, yak bir acı iyi gelsin
Bitti süren çoktandır doldu hoşçakal

böyle - such, like this
yakmak - to burn
acı - pain
süren - ?
dolmak - (in this context) to expire

You are the universe, this is what you were waiting for
And you'll want a baby too, goodbye now you have one
It's on me, set me on fire, the pain will do good
It's been over for a long time, time was up, goodbye

Başka türlü biri olsan olurdu ancak
Ben gidiyorum sen lütfen eğlenmeneye bak
Nerden bileyim bu kalbimi kim dolduracak
Rahatsız olsa başkasıyla evlenmene bak
Ben gidiyorum hadi sen evlenmene bak

türlü - various
ancak - but
eğlenme - fun (eğlenmek - to have fun)
evlenme - marriage (evlenmek - to get married)

If you had been someone different, though, it would have worked
I'm going, please just go and have fun
How will I know who will fill up this heart of mine
Don't worry, just go and marry someone else
I'm going, just go and look at your marriage

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Re: Saim'in notları - türkçe

Postby voron » 2018-01-01, 19:34

Saim wrote:Beni üzgün görmezsin, çünkü buna değmezsin
Aşk önünde beklenilmez yar
Hızlı geçer görmezsin, toz dumandan ölmezsin
Bir gider ki farkedilmez yar

You won't see me upset, because you're not worthy of this
Darling ,you can't stay against love
You'll go fast and not see it, you won't die from the cloud of dust
They will go, the inconspicuous cliff

Where did you find this translation? It looks somewhat off.
I understand it this way:

You won't see me upset, because you're not worthy of this
One can't (just sit and) wait in front of love, darling
(Love) will pass fast, you won't (even) see it, and you won't die from the dust (that it will leave behind)
It will go away unnoticed, darling

I'd say that "yar" in both cases means "darling".

süren - ?

süre + 2S.POSS

Ben gidiyorum sen lütfen eğlenmeneye bak

eğlenmene

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Re: Saim'in notları - türkçe

Postby Saim » 2018-01-01, 20:16

voron wrote:Where did you find this translation? It looks somewhat off.


It's from the subtitles on the YouTube video. Thanks, I understand the song much better now; this one was kind of confusing me. :D

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Re: Saim'in notları - türkçe

Postby Saim » 2018-01-04, 16:42

Ece Seçkin - Adeyyo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2g3-Ba0NA5E

Upuzun yollar, arkandayım
Takip mesafesi aramızda
Duyduğuma değil de gördüğüme inanayım

upuzun - long (=uzun?)
mesafe - distance (from Arabic مسافة distance, from the same root as future tense particle سَوْفَ, cognate to Urdu مسافت [f], which is a synonym of فاصلہ [m])
aramızda - between us (ara - gap, spacing, intermediary)
duymak - to hear

Duyduğuma, gördüğüme - why does this end with -a/e and not -u/ü as I would've expected based on [url=http://learnturkish.pgeorgalas.gr/IndirectConjugationSetEn.asp
]this[/url]?

On the long roads I'm behind you
The following distance between us
I'll believe what I see, not what I hear

Demeye de kalmadı
Sırtımdan, vurdun, vurdun
Hiç acımadan ardımdan
Duydum, duydum
Ne işler dönmüş arkamdan

sırt - back
vurmak - to hit
acıma - pity (related to acı - pain?)
ardından - behind (=arkadan?)

No sooner had I said than
You shoot, shoot me in my back
Without mercy behind my back
I heard, heard
What's been going on behind my back

Bir kere zıpla, iki kere zıpla
Bıkmadın Allah Allah
Ben hadi neyse atlatırım da
Yerle bir ol sen inşallah

zıpla - jump
bıkmak - to get bored, be sick of something
neyse - anyway
atlatmak - to overcome, get over
yerle bir olmak - razed to the ground

Jump once, jump twice
You're not done yet, oh my god
I'll get over it anyway
But I hope it destroys you

Bence sen öyle gün yüzü görme
O yılanı besle koynunda
Kusuruma bakma, bizde de böyle
Her şeye yok ki eyvallah.

beslemek - to feed, nurture
koyun - bosom
kusuruma bakma - sorry

I'd say you won't see the light of day
Nursing the snake in your bosom
Sorry this is how we do
I won't take it lying down [I really don't see the similarity between this and the original Turkish]

Only two pop songs out of my original list left. :D

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Re: Saim'in notları - türkçe

Postby Saim » 2018-01-05, 17:14

Burak King - Koştum Hekime
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l61SKSxzw5s&list=RDl61SKSxzw5s

(Partial) translation

Bastın da yarama basma dedim
Dönmek yok asla dedim
Sen yüzünü asma dedim
Varsa getir dermanını

yara - wound
basmak - to press
yüzünü asmak - to frown
derman - cure
varsa - ?

You pushed on my wounds even though I told you not to
There is no going back
Don't frown
Bring me my treatment

Koştum hekime hasta gibi
Ezberledim yollarını
Kader mi, rastlantı mı?
Kelepçeledi kollarımı

hekim - doctor
ezberlemek - to memorise
rastlantı - coincidence
kelepçelemek - to handcuff (kelepçe - handcuffs)

I ran to the doctor like a patient,
I memorized the roads
is this fate and put handcuffs in my hands?

[the rest has no translation]

Yürü ya da koş, e dolu ya da boş
Dağlara paralel denize yakamoz
Gece yere, göğe, aya beni sor
Saçıma ak düşsün içime kor

dağ - mountain
yakamoz - sea sparkle, phosphorescence
göğe - ?
aya - is this the dative of ay (moon) or the nominative of aya (palm)?
saçı - hair
ak - white (=beyaz?)
düşmek - to fall
kor - coal
içime - 1psg possessive dative of iç (inside)?

[attempt at translation mine]
Walk or run, fill or empty
Mountains parallel, sparkle in the sea
?
My hair is white, you fall (into me), coal

Uzak kendinden yol, bul gel dünden zor
Bugün! Korkarım yine de ararım seni
Duramam diye çok, ara dur aynı yerde
Gez gör gönlüm, gez gör gönlüm

Çalsın sazlarım aşka gelir
E çalsın o darbuka aşka gelin

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Re: Saim'in notları - türkçe

Postby voron » 2018-01-05, 17:48

Saim wrote:Varsa getir dermanını

varsa - ?

if there exists
(if there exists medicine, bring it)

Yürü ya da koş, e dolu ya da boş
Dağlara paralel denize yakamoz
Gece yere, göğe, aya beni sor
Saçıma ak düşsün içime kor


göğe - it's the dative of gök
aya - (here) it's the dative of ay

My attempt at translation:

Walk or run, busy or idle,
A road of moonlight into the sea, parallel to the mountains
At night, ask the earth, the sky, the moon about me
Let whiteness fall onto my hair, and an ember inside me

Yakamoz is specifically this:
http://www.yukle.tc/galeri/6/images/Yakamoz-6.jpg

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Re: Saim'in notları - türkçe

Postby Saim » 2018-01-06, 21:33

Çok teşekkür ederim. :)

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Re: Saim'in notları - türkçe

Postby Saim » 2018-01-25, 12:23

http://langmedia.fivecolleges.edu/cultu ... e-Learning
http://langmedia.fivecolleges.edu/fileu ... sh_a1e.pdf

Röportajcı: Peki seni dinleyecek olan öğrencilere, biliyorsun Türkçe öğrenmek isteyen
öğrenciler, ne tür nasihatlar verirsin?
Erkek: Vallahi yaşım o kadar büyük değil ama, nasihat de veremem ama...
Röportajcı: Bir dil öğrencisine mesela. Yani Türkçe sence nasıl?
Erkek: Türkçe karışık bir dil, kolay bir dil değil ama, böyle moralinizi bozuyor gibi
olmayayım ama güzel bir dil, geniş bir dil.
Röportajcı: Geniş derken kelime hazinesini (hazinesinin) fazla olduğundan mi
bahsediyorsun?
Erkek: Evet kelime hazinesi çok geniş ama geniş olmasına rağmen bizim kullandığımız
300- 400 kelimeyi geçmiyor. Biz Türk olarak bile 300- 400 kelimeden fazla kelime
kullanamıyoz ( kullanamıyoruz) günlük hayatımızda. Bu kadar. Türkçeyi de hiç sevmem
bu arada.
Röportajcı: Niye? Hangi dili seviyorsun?
Erkek: Ders olarak..[sevmem]
Röportajcı: Ha ders Türkçe dersini...
Erkek: Ders olarak hiç sevmem.
Röportajcı: Ama siz Türkçe görmüyorsunuz, edebiyat görüyorsunuz, dil bilgisi...
(Incomplete sentence)
Erkek: Edebiyat olarak hiç sevmem.
Röportajcı: Peki İngilizceyle sizin aranız nasıl?
Erkek: İngilizceyi hiç sevmem.
Röportajcı: Neden?
Erkek: Bilmiyorum. Belki hocalarımızdan dolayı, belki iyi bir eğitim göremedik ondan
olabilir. Ingilizcem hem iyi değil. İnşallah üniversiteye giderken İngilizceyi de düzeltiriz.
Röportajcı: Tamam, teşekkürler.

nasihat - advice
mesela - for example
karışık - mixed
kelime hazinesi - vocabulary (hazine - treasury)
bahsetmek - mention, refer to, talk about
rağmen - despite
belki - maybe
düzeltmek - to fix (to get better - düzelmek)
Last edited by Saim on 2018-01-25, 12:36, edited 1 time in total.

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voron
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Posts: 4496
Joined: 2007-07-15, 3:29
Real Name: Igor
Gender: male
Country: TR Turkey (Türkiye)

Re: Saim'in notları - türkçe

Postby voron » 2018-01-25, 12:32

Saim wrote:http://langmedia.fivecolleges.edu/culturetalk-subtopics/Turkey/192/Thoughts-on-Language-Learning


Cool interview! I wish materials like this (natural interviews with native speakers supplemented with transcripts) were available for more languages, and became a standard in language learning. Easylanguages is another cool project that implements this idea; unfortunately it only has a couple videos for Turkish.

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Saim
Posts: 4999
Joined: 2011-01-22, 5:44
Location: Poznań
Country: RS Serbia (Србија)

Re: Saim'in notları - türkçe

Postby Saim » 2018-01-25, 12:52

voron wrote:Cool interview! I wish materials like this (natural interviews with native speakers supplemented with transcripts) were available for more languages, and became a standard in language learning. Easylanguages is another cool project that implements this idea; unfortunately it only has a couple videos for Turkish.


Yeah, I use Easylanguages for German and Russian and it's great.

Unfortunately with language learning there's a lot of saturation in not hugely useful resources for eternal false beginners (audio courses where the speech is unnaturally slow and half of it is in English, phrasebooks that no-one needs anymore in countries where you have cheap access to mobile data, flashcards as if you can't just make your own or use Anki or Memrise, textbooks that barely have any dialogues in them) because that's where the money is, but things that make things insanely easier. The fact that Duolingo, which only barely started to move things in the right direction, got so popular is a testament to that fact...


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