Ottoman texts - عثمانلی ترکجه‌سی متینلر

[zhiguli]

Kumru is "turtledove" in English, and as Mert said it has a distinctive appearance. Güvercin is just your ordinary pigeon.
There's also the colour "kumral" which is a kind of reddish brown.

My dictionary gives "sparrow hawk" for atmaca and "falcon" for doğan.

I'm not good with bird names either but searching for them in google images helps to clear up some confusion.


As for your translation, it's fine, there are just some small typos in the transcription, which i've marked in red.
(btw, I've also checked my texts again and found more mistakes, which I will go back and correct.)

حیوانلر، دورلو دورلودو۔

Hayvanlar, türlü türlüdür.

بونلر، اکـثاری دورت آیاقلی اولور۔

Bunlar, ekseri dört ayaklı olur.

perhaps this should be اكثری without the extra alef?

بالینہ بو جنسدندر۔

"Balına" bu cinstendir.

بر طاقمنہ: {ییرتیجی} دینیر: آرسلان، قاپلان، قورت کبی۔

Bir takımına: (yirtici) denir: arslan, kaplan, kurt gibi.

not 100% sure, but i think it should be yırtıcı.

آتی

ayı

آیی

قارا طاووق۔

karabatak.

looks like karatavuk here, which is a completely different bird.

From this small sentence there are two words with a tricky spelling. I will single them out now:
کوکرجین - Güvercin. Here ک has the value of v.

Interestingly in Azeri كوكرجین is "göyərçin"; likewise دوكمك is döymək.

[kalemiye]

Thanks for pointing those typos out!! And thanks to both of your for giving the meanings of those words, I only checked seslisozluk because I couldn't find my Ottoman dictionary anywhere (I think my mom took it to the living room ). Next time maybe I could check up Kamus-i turki and transcribe and translate the definition here, it can be fun as well.

You are right, yIrtIcI is written with undotted I.

As for karabatak, honestly, I don't know what I was thinking about .

I think cinsden is written correctly, though.

[kalemiye]

Let's continue!

بونلر دہ ایکی یہ آیریلیر۔

Bunlar da ikiye ayrılır.

These are also divided in two (groups).

بر طاقمنہ {آھلیّہ}، دیکر طاقمنہ: {غیر آھلیّہ} دینیر۔

Bir takımına (ehliyye), diğer takımına (gayri ehliyye) denir.

One group is called 'domestic' and the other is called 'non-domestic'.

اھلیّہ طاقمی، آولردہ، چیفتلکلردہ بسلہ نن و انساندن قاچمایانلردر: طاووق، قاز، اوردک کبی۔

Ahliyye takımı, evlerde, çiftliklerde beslenen ve insandan kaçmayanlardır: tavuk, kaz, ördek gibi.

The group of the domestic ones, are fed in houses and farms and don't scape from humans, like the duck, the goose and the chicken.

۔{غیر آھلیّہ} دینیلن دیکر طاقمی، انساندن قاچان و آنجق تفک، یاخود باشقہ آلت ایلہ آولانان قوشلردر: بیلدیرجین، ککلک، آتماجہ، طوغان کبی۔

(Gayr-i ehliyye) denilen diğer takımı, insandan kaçan ve ancak tüfek, yâhud başka âlet ile avlanan kuşlardır: bıldırcın, keklik, atmaca, doğan gibi.

The other group called 'non-domestic', escape from people but, however, they are the birds that are hunted with a gun or any other weapon, like the quail, the grouse, the sparrow hawk and the falcon.

بونلرک بعضیلری یینیر؛ بعضیلری یینمز۔

Bunların bazıları yenir; bazıları yenmez.

Some of this animals are edible, some of them are not.

اوچنجی صنف، صوغوق قنلی حیوانلردر۔

Üçüncü sınıf, soğukkanlı hayvanlardır.

The third category are the cold-blooded animals.

بونلرک بعضیلری، الدن آیاقدن محروم اولدقلری جھتلہ یردہ سورونور: ییلان، کرتنکلہ، قاپلومباغہ، تمساح کبی۔

Bunların bâzıları, elden ayakdan mahrum oldukları cihetle yerde sürünür: yılan, kertenkele, kaplumbağa, timsah gibi.

Some of these, because they have no hands or legs, they slither on the earth: like the snake, the slowworm, the turtle and the crocodile.

[kalemiye]

I think I will be able to write the next page tomorrow. But just to have a laugh, I leave her these two comic strips:

[kalemiye]

بو طاقم حیوانلرہ: {زواحف} دینیر

Bu takım hayvanlara: (zevâhif) denir.

This group of animals is called 'reptile'

دوردنجی صنف، ینہ صوغوق قانلی و صو ایچندہ یاشایان حیوانلردر

Dördüncü sınıf, yine soğukkanlı ve su içinde yaşayan hayvanlardır.

The forth class is also cold-blooded and these animals live inside water.

بو طاقمنہ دہ: {بالق} دینیر

Bu takımına da: (balık) denir

This group is called 'fish'.

بالقلر، السز، آیاقسزدرلر۔

Balıkar, elsiz, ayaksızdırlar.

Fish have no hands and no feet.

بونلرک نفس آلمالری، صو ایلہ در۔

Bunların nefes almaları su iledir.

These (animals) breathe water.

بالقلر دخی دورلو دورلودر۔

Balıklar dahi türlü türlüdür.

Fishes are also diverse.

آیری آیری اسملری واردر۔

Ayrı ayrı isimleri vardır.

They have different names.

باشلیجہ لری شونلردر:۔

Başlıcaları şunlardır:

The main ones are these:

قلیج، قالقان، لورک، مرجان، پالاموط،، طوریق، اوسقومرو، باربونیا، لوفر، قایا، کفال، ایزمارید، استاورید، خمسی۔

Kılıç, kalkan, levrek, mercan, palamut, torik, uskumru, barbunya, lüfer, kaya, kefâl, izmarit, istavrit, hamsi.

Swordfish, turbot, bass, coral (?), bonito, large bonito, mackerel, surmullet, bluefish, ____ , mullet, sea bream, horse mackerel, anchovy.

[kalemiye]

بشنجی صنف، طوغدیغی زمان طبقی بالق صنفی کبی السز، آیاقسز اولور؛ صو ایچندہ نفس آلیر۔

Beşinci sınıf, doğduğu zaman tıpkı balık sınıfı gibi elsiz, ayaksız olur; su içinde nefes alır.

The fifth group, when they are born they resemble to fishes, they have no hands and no feet; they breathe underwater.

براز بویودکدن صوکرہ کوچوکلک شکلی بوتون بوتون دکیشیر؛ صوکرہ لری دورت ایاغی طھور ایدی۔ قورباغہ، بو صنفدن در۔

Biraz büyüdükten sonra küçüklük şekli bütün bütün değişir sonraları dört ayağı zuhur eder. Kurbağa, bu sınıftandır.

After growing up a bit their childhood shape changes totally and afterwards four legs become visible. Frogs belong to this group.

[omero]

By chance I found this site and it is great... thank you all very much for the effort you have shown so far.

I'm Turkish and Ottoman language is a hobby for me, I never really studied it. The only Ottoman text I have, is Atatürk's "Speech" (which lasted I think 5 days) in which he told the parliament his view of the events from 1919 to 1923.
It is completely in Ottoman and I sometimes sit down and try to transscribe a few lines. Unfortunately modern versions of the "Nutuk" don't pay respect to the original: they all replace the original words by new modern Turkish words, so that "vaziyet ve manzara-i umumiye" e.g. in the first sentence has become "genel durum ve görünüş"...

I'm reading the texts here thoroughly and that's a good training for me...

Really: great job

[kalemiye]

I have the Nutuk in Ottoman Turkish along with a transcription, send me your email through pm and I will scan it sometime next week .

I will scan also the pages left of the heyvanlar text, I have had no real time to keep up with this thread lately, and I won't be able to really pay attention to it until mid february.

[eskandar]

I found this Ottoman poem from Bâki along with modern transliteration and an English literary translation here. I don't know about the quality of the English translation but it's a nice poem:

ازلدن شاه عشقك بنۀ فرمانيوز جانا
محبت ملكنك سلطان عليشانيوز جانا

سحاب لطفك آب تشن دللردن دريغ اتمه
بو دشتك بغرى يانمش لالۀ نعمانيوز جانا

زمان بزده گوهر سزدگچون دل خراش ايلر
انكچون بغمرز خوندر معارف كانيوز جانا

مكدّر قلمسون گرد كدورت چشمۀ جاني
بلورسن آب روى ملكت عثمانيوز جانا

جهاني جام نظمم شعر باقى كبى دور ايلر
بو بزمك شمدو بز ده جامئ دورانيوز جانا

Ezelden şâh-ı aşkın bende-i fermânıyüz cânâ
Mahabbet mülkünün sultânı âlî-şânıyüz cânâ

Sehâb-ı lutfun âbın teşne-dillerden dirîğ itme
Bu deştin bağrı yanmış lâle-i Nu'mânıyüz cânâ

Zemâne bizde cevher sezdiğiyçün dil-hırâş eyler
Anınçün bağrımız hûndur ma'ârif kânıyüz câna

Mükedder kılmasun gerd-i küdûret çeşme-i canı
Bilürsün âb-ı rûy-i mülket-i Osmâniyüz cânâ

Cihanı câm-ı nazmım şi'r-i Bakî gibi devr eyler
Bu bezmin şimdi biz de Câmi-i devrânıyüz cânâ

Since time first breathed we have been slaves of passion's Shah, my dear.
We in the heart's domain declaim a sultan's law, my dear.

We are the poppies in the wastes. Our grief-charred hearts are black.
Rain like a bounteous cloud and slake the parched heart's shaw, my dear.

Fate saw the jewel in us, and pawed our hearts apart to own it,
Leaving our bleeding bodies mined of love and raw, my dear.

Do not let turbid sadness taint the waters of your fountain.
All faces shine. We are the Ottoman world's awe, my dear.

Around the world go Bâkî's poems: a winecup among friends.
We are time's cycling cup and hand. What wines we draw, my dear!

[kalemiye]

Thank you for posting this poem, I find divan poetry interesting, although very difficult to understand. I will try to find time to read the poem carefully, sorting out all grammar and vocabulary .

[AZForeman]

Hah it's always interesting to find my work making its way into bulletin boards.

The translation of mine you posted is far from literal.

Anyway, if you'd like a more literal translation, I'm happy to supply it. Here's a rough attempt:

ازلدن شاه عشقك بنۀ فرمانيوز جانا
محبت ملكنك سلطان عليشانيوز جانا

Since the origin of time, we have been slaves in service to the king of love, Oh Beloved.
In the kingdom of love, we are the sultan of high resolve, Oh Beloved.

notes: ezel refers to eternity as imagined from the present moment back into the past (as opposed to "ebed" which refers to eternity from now extending into the future)

سحاب لطفك آب تشن دللردن دريغ اتمه
بو دشتك بغرى يانمش لالۀ نعمانيوز جانا

Be as munificent as a cloud and do not hold back water from the thirsty heart
We are the Lale-ye-Nu'man (i.e. poppies) whose hearts are burnt black, oh beloved.

notes: lale usually means tulip, but in the ottoman empire tulips weren't around in the 16th century. Lale usually referred to a kind of wild peony. Lale-i nu'man was a wild poppy.

زمان بزده گوهر سزدگچون دل خراش ايلر
انكچون بغمرز خوندر معارف كانيوز جانا

Within us, fate/time detected a jewel/essence and tore our hearts apart
It left our bodies bleeding and excised of all inner knowledge of love, oh beloved

note: The word "gevher" means both "jewel" and "essence, gist, quintessence." "ma'aref" is a word which contains the arabic عرف root, which is used in mysticism to connote inner, gnostic knowledge as opposed to superficial outer knowledge.

مكدّر قلمسون گرد كدورت چشمۀ جاني
بلورسن آب روى ملكت عثمانيوز جانا

Do not let the dust of sadness turn the fountain of your soul turbid.
For us, faces shine crystal-bright across the ottoman realm, oh beloved.

جهاني جام نظمم شعر باقى كبى دور ايلر
بو بزمك شمدو بز ده جامئ دورانيوز جانا

Baki's pearl-strung verse goes round the world like a winecup at a feast.
We are now the Jami/Winebearer of the age, oh beloved.

"nazm" refers both to the arrangement of pearls on a string, and to the ordering of verses in poetry. The Word "câmî" can refer to both the cupbearer and to the medieval poet "jami." The poet is indulging in an amusing pun. "I pour wine like poetry, and am the greatest wine-bearer/poet (i.e. 'the Jami') of the age."

I have revised the poem considerably, by the way. You can find the new version on my blog.

[eskandar]

Thanks for your helpful post, and I enjoy your blog very much. I read several of the languages you translate from, but wouldn't dare to attempt my own translations!

The translation of mine you posted is far from literal.

I called your translation "literary" (the opposite of literal, a translation that has its own sense of the poetic), not "literal"

I found this Ottoman poem from Bâki along with modern transliteration and an English literary translation

notes: ezel refers to eternity as imagined from the present moment back into the past (as opposed to "ebed" which refers to eternity from now extending into the future)

Thanks, that's a more useful way of thinking about the two words. I had thought of ازل as "eternity without beginning" and ابد as "eternity without end."

[AZForeman]

My mistake re:literal/literary. I read the post too quickly.

Anyway, I only have two ottoman poems posted on my site (at the moment, though I'm working on a couple more) and would welcome any critique/commentary anyone on this board might be able to offer.

[kalemiye]

Is there anybody interested in reading texts in Ottoman Turkish?

[Hassaan Zia]

Is there anybody interested in reading texts in Ottoman Turkish?

I am

[kalemiye]

Is there anybody interested in reading texts in Ottoman Turkish?

I am

Then I will start posting texts I found in an old Ottoman textbook for children asap .

[kalemiye]

Let's start by a poem I think you will like Hassaan .
بر گون گلیر باشقه یرلر گزرسه‌ك
گوکلنده بر یابانجیلق سزه‌رسه‌ك
آننه‌سندن آیری دوشن بر یاورو
گبی صیزلار کوچوك قلبك ایشته بو
وطن سوداسیدر. بو سوزه اینان>
هپمزك آننه‌سیدر بو وطن

اوزاقلردن دونویورکن وطنه
روزگار بر خوش قوقو گتیریر سکا
دالغه‌لرك لسانندن آکلاسك
ایسترسك که گمی اوچسون، یاقلاشسین
بر مناره گوزوکورکن سیسلردن
قلبك طاشار ایچنده‌کی حسلردن

مائی گوکلر، یشیل یرلر، شهرلر
بزه شرف فیصیلدایان نهرلر
اویان دیه اوغولدایان قورولر
دوشون یاوروم بو یرلرده نه‌لر وار؟
ایشته سنك بو مبارك مملکت
آننه‌ گبی اونو سه‌وده خدمت ایت

بر فنا سوز ایشیریرسه‌ك ایی بیل
بگنمه‌ین بزی عثمانلی دکل
بر یابانجی سنی گلیر قاندیریر
اگر دیرسه بو مملکت فنادر
داریل یاوروم اونی صاقین سویلتمه.
طوپراغکی خائنلره چیگنتمعه

ابراهیم علا الدین بك

[Hassaan Zia]

بنم سن شاهِ مه رویه قل اولمق ایله‌در فخرم
گدای دلبر اولمق یك جهانڭ پادشاهیندن

(فاتح سلطان محمد)

[Hassaan Zia]

سودیکم جامِ می‌یه حاجت نه در لعلِ لبڭ
بر شکر خنده‌یله مستِ بی‌مجال أیلر بنی
(ندیم)

[kalemiye]

Hassaan, at the moment I am reading a 19th century Ottoman history book about Kanuni Süleyman, if you want I can post parts of the text here and we can work on its translation together (of course, everybody else is free to participate too!).