help me! (magister- magistri)

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KingHarvest
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Re: help me! (magister- magistri)

Postby KingHarvest » 2009-07-05, 22:53

"When the Furies hounded Orestes, he set out for Delphi to ask what would be the end of his troubles" (or less literally, "...when his troubles would end").

Delphi is a plural, which is why the ending is -os, and since it is a town/city, it doesn't need the preposition ad. Sciscitatum is not, as you probably think, a past participle, but rather a supine. The supine can be used after a verb of motion in place of a normal purpose clause. Modus has a rarer meaning of "limit, end."
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Martine
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Re: help me! (magister- magistri)

Postby Martine » 2009-07-07, 6:54

Thank you so much,
KingHarvest, I've got another question, and I don't suppose it's the last one :/ What does the word " "iret". mean? Here goes the sentence:
"Responsum est, ut in terram Taurinam ad regem Thoantem patrem Hypsipyles iret indeque de templo Dianas singum Argos afferet"
My Latin dictionary knows just the word "ire"... :roll: Please, help me.

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Re: help me! (magister- magistri)

Postby KingHarvest » 2009-07-07, 12:55

It's the 3rd person singular of the imperfect subjunctive of ire.
Most men are rather stupid, and most of those who are not stupid are, consequently, rather vain.
-A.E. Housman

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Re: help me! (magister- magistri)

Postby Martine » 2009-07-07, 18:21

Thanks, King. I'm getting back to work :)

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Re: help me! (magister- magistri)

Postby Martine » 2009-07-09, 7:24

Another questions. What do the words "signum" and "malorum" mean? :roll:

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Re: help me! (magister- magistri)

Postby KingHarvest » 2009-07-09, 14:49

Signum means "sign, standard" and malorum is the masculine/neuter genitive plural of malus, "evil, bad."
Most men are rather stupid, and most of those who are not stupid are, consequently, rather vain.
-A.E. Housman

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Re: help me! (magister- magistri)

Postby Martine » 2009-07-10, 11:31

Thank you so much. I still have some questions... :roll:
I don't know the meaning of two words "ferri" and "expiandum". Here goes the sentence:
signum expiandum ad mare ferri oportere et iubere eum interdicere civibus

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Re: help me! (magister- magistri)

Postby Babelfish » 2009-07-10, 14:56

expiandum is the future passive participle (gerundive) of expio to appease, atone.
ferri could be the genitive of ferrum iron, or the passive infinitive of fero, ferre meaning to be carried.
I can't say I understand the entire the sentence so I don't know which meaning matches :|

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Re: help me! (magister- magistri)

Postby Martine » 2009-07-10, 19:19

Thank you so much,Babelfish :ohwell: You helped me much. I translated it in this way:
They order the citizens to carry this penancing statue into the sea.
I'm translating this text into Polish, so it could me wrong in English. And I don't know if it's all right. What do you think about it,Babelfish?
Now I'm looking for the meaning of the word "nacta". Here goes the sentence with this word:
Rex sacerdoti dicto audiens fuit occasione Iphigenia nacta signo sublato cum fratre Oreste er Pylade in navem ascendit.
Is it a noun? I can't find it in dictionary.

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Re: help me! (magister- magistri)

Postby Babelfish » 2009-07-11, 14:05

I can't see "they order" or in fact any non-infinitive verb in the sentence above... Something missing maybe? Anyway my Latin isn't that great, I know the grammar well but the syntax of sentences is often incomprehensible to me. You'd probably better wait for KingHarvest or someone else who knows better :blush:

"nacta" turns out to be the perfect passive participle of "nanciscor" to obtain, meet. Wouldn't have guessed it myself either, I use Whitaker's Words to analyze forms I really don't know how to deal with. I also have no idea what "er" here means...

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Re: help me! (magister- magistri)

Postby modus.irrealis » 2009-07-12, 19:03

Here you need more of the context, which I found online, so:

Quo rex cum intervenisset et rogitaret, cur id faceret, illa ementita est dicitque eos sceleratos signum contaminasse; quod impii et scelerati homines in templum essent adducti, signum expiandum ad mare ferri oportere et iubere eum interdicere civibus, ne quis eorum extra urbem exiret.

Like Babelfish said there are only infinitives, but in context it's a continuation of the indirect discourse, so I would see it as something like:

[and she said that] because the impious and wicked men had be lead to the temple, the sign to be purified ought to be carried to the sea and he ought to order the citizens to forbid any of them from going out of the city.

For the last passage, the site I found punctuates it as Rex sacerdoti dicto audiens fuit; occasione Iphigenia nacta signo sublato cum fratre Oreste et Pylade in navem ascendit which makes it clearer, something like (being very literal):

The king obeyed the priest; Iphegenia, the chance having been obtained, the sign having been taken away, went up on to the ship with her brother Orestes and Pylades.

At first I thought "nacta" would go with "Iphigenia" and be nominative, but it seems to be ablative and go with "occasione." Looking it up in the dictionary, "nanciscor" seems to be one of those deponent verbs whose passive participle can be an actual passive.

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Re: help me! (magister- magistri)

Postby KingHarvest » 2009-07-13, 2:06

I can't see "they order" or in fact any non-infinitive verb in the sentence above... Something missing maybe?


Just because you see only infinitives doesn't mean you should assume that something is missing. Historical infinitives are pretty common, and they only travel in packs, never alone. In this instance, however, it is very clear that the main verb is missing.
Most men are rather stupid, and most of those who are not stupid are, consequently, rather vain.
-A.E. Housman

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Re: help me! (magister- magistri)

Postby Martine » 2009-07-18, 13:05

Babelfish Thank you for telling me what does the word "nacta" mean. Your Latin is great, so much better than mine.
modus.irrealis Thank you so much. I translated it the same as you did :) I know it's all right. Thanks so much!

Latin is very difficult for me :roll: However it's getting better and better :)
And I have another question. Don't know the meaning of the word " eluxit". I'm translating this this text. Can't find it in my dictionary. Please help me

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Re: help me! (magister- magistri)

Postby modus.irrealis » 2009-07-18, 22:32

For these sort of things, Whittaker's words (which Babelfish linked to) is really great. In this case it says that the word is from eluceo "shine forth; be apparent"

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Re: help me! (magister- magistri)

Postby Martine » 2009-07-19, 9:31

Thanks you so much, modus.irrealis. Now I've got just two text to translate :)
And now I'm looking for the meaning of the word "cecidit". Here goes the sentence:
eoque ipse dux cecidit proelio

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Re: help me! (magister- magistri)

Postby KingHarvest » 2009-07-19, 18:18

It's the perfect tense of cado, to fall.
Most men are rather stupid, and most of those who are not stupid are, consequently, rather vain.
-A.E. Housman

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Re: help me! (magister- magistri)

Postby Martine » 2009-07-20, 7:34

Thank you :) Now I'm wondering what "querentem" means.
Now I'm translating the text about Timeleon. It's the last one :) Here goes the sentence with the word "qurentem" :
Quam calamitatem ita moderate tulit, ut neque eum querentem quisquam audierit (...)

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Re: help me! (magister- magistri)

Postby modus.irrealis » 2009-07-20, 13:38

It's the participle of queror "complain": "that neither did anyone hear him complain(ing)..."

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Re: help me! (magister- magistri)

Postby Martine » 2009-07-21, 13:15

modus.irrealis Thanks. And what does the word "vectus" mean?

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Re: help me! (magister- magistri)

Postby modus.irrealis » 2009-07-21, 15:14

vectus is the perfect participle of veho.


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