Polski Kącik / Polish Corner / Angolo Polacco

User avatar
dorenda
Posts: 2896
Joined: 2004-11-17, 23:02
Real Name: Dorenda
Gender: female
Country: PL Poland (Polska)
Contact:

Re: Polski Kącik / Polish Corner / Angolo Polacco

Postby dorenda » 2013-10-14, 17:18

Since you're not only asking about native speakers... :wink: I do have a bit of a problem sometimes understanding people who don't roll their r's. It depends on what sound they replace it with. If it's replaced by an r pronounced somewhere in the throat, it's not much of a problem (I may just have to get used to it a bit the first few minutes). But there are also people who just omit the sound or replace it by something l-like, and that makes it really difficult to understand for me. Do natives have problems with that too? (If you don't know, google some videos of Hanna Gronkiewicz-Waltz for an example.)
нехай мій гаманець порожній
моя дорога невідома
я стану вільним, подорожнім
найголовніше вийти з дому

Ahzoh
Posts: 289
Joined: 2013-09-13, 1:20
Real Name: Malcolm
Gender: male
Country: CA Canada (Canada)

Re: Polski Kącik / Polish Corner / Angolo Polacco

Postby Ahzoh » 2013-10-14, 17:24

Phew, I've been attempting to practice rolling my Rs for a year trying different methods and watching countless videos with not even a little effectiveness and I'm starting to come to the conclusion that I may be those rare people who just can't trill.

I am Canadian so I use an Alveolar Approximant which sounds exactly the same as a trill, except you don't trill it.
A native of [flag=]en-CA[/flag]
Conlang: Image
Economic Left/Right: -6.88
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -4.46

Covered
Posts: 142
Joined: 2009-03-08, 21:47
Gender: male
Location: Porto Alegre
Country: BR Brazil (Brasil)

Re: Polski Kącik / Polish Corner / Angolo Polacco

Postby Covered » 2013-10-16, 22:07

rolling R's są łatwe :D

User avatar
pittmirg
Posts: 720
Joined: 2008-06-11, 7:37
Gender: male
Country: PL Poland (Polska)

Re: Polski Kącik / Polish Corner / Angolo Polacco

Postby pittmirg » 2013-10-17, 12:53

@up: mówisz, że spółgłoski drżące mają lekkie obyczaje?
занесіть мя в Верховину / де родився, хай загину

Ahzoh
Posts: 289
Joined: 2013-09-13, 1:20
Real Name: Malcolm
Gender: male
Country: CA Canada (Canada)

Re: Polski Kącik / Polish Corner / Angolo Polacco

Postby Ahzoh » 2013-10-23, 1:46

One thing I have to complain about Polish, and probably alot of slavic language... is the grammatical gender...
you could have different words to have the same meaning and the only difference is whether the speaker was born male or born female.
Why would I need to know who's gender?
I think it's a waste of memory.
Taking up twice amount of energy to memorize words for male and female speakers and listening for them.

perhaps ne day Polish and many other language will abandon the wasteful addition of grammatical gender.
A native of [flag=]en-CA[/flag]
Conlang: Image
Economic Left/Right: -6.88
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -4.46

User avatar
pittmirg
Posts: 720
Joined: 2008-06-11, 7:37
Gender: male
Country: PL Poland (Polska)

Re: Polski Kącik / Polish Corner / Angolo Polacco

Postby pittmirg » 2013-10-23, 15:45

Well, I don't know about you but about the first thing I recognize when I see a stranger is whether they are male or female. That's what my brain spits out incredibly quickly.* It feels, like, biologically important (not surprisingly) and might be the cause or one cause behind the widespread occurence of sex-based grammatical gender systems.** Perhaps you're wired in a different way. But I'm smelling an ideological motivation behind your detestation of grammatical gender.

*of course, I might err (or my brain's algorithms might prove not 100% accurate) due to poor visibility, unusual (in my culture) clothes, hair style etc. Yet I relatively rarely hesitate.
**this isn't to say that grammatical gender doesn't have other fuctions besides reminding about the gender/sex of the one referred to.
занесіть мя в Верховину / де родився, хай загину

Патрислав Андреевич

Re: Polski Kącik / Polish Corner / Angolo Polacco

Postby Патрислав Андреевич » 2013-10-23, 18:15

Ahzoh wrote:perhaps ne day Polish and many other language will abandon the wasteful addition of grammatical gender.


I hope not. :lol: I like it this way and don't think it's a 'wasteful' addition. Gender is important.

Ahzoh
Posts: 289
Joined: 2013-09-13, 1:20
Real Name: Malcolm
Gender: male
Country: CA Canada (Canada)

Re: Polski Kącik / Polish Corner / Angolo Polacco

Postby Ahzoh » 2013-10-23, 19:48

Not really, I find grammatical gender has come more out of societal classing and stuff like that and less out of necessity.

There are very FEW benefits to knowing the gender of your speaker, and the rest is because of the society.

Maybe it's because I find it tad bit sexist(on both sides) and I am an egalitarian.
A native of [flag=]en-CA[/flag]
Conlang: Image
Economic Left/Right: -6.88
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -4.46

User avatar
Leopejo
Posts: 101
Joined: 2010-09-04, 17:36
Real Name: Leo
Gender: male
Location: Wrocław
Country: PL Poland (Polska)

Re: Polski Kącik / Polish Corner / Angolo Polacco

Postby Leopejo » 2013-10-25, 10:48

Ahzoh wrote:Not really, I find grammatical gender has come more out of societal classing and stuff like that and less out of necessity.

There are very FEW benefits to knowing the gender of your speaker, and the rest is because of the society.

Maybe it's because I find it tad bit sexist(on both sides) and I am an egalitarian.

I suggest you to abandon Polish. Not only does Polish have genders (like many languages around the world), not only does Polish have animate gender (like other Slavic languages), but it has a unique virile gender too! How sexist THAT is!

All natural languages are like they are because of society, and that is their beauty. If you look for the most logical language, you better check conlangs. But please don't try to change natural languages because "there are very FEW benefits" to some of their features.

Ahzoh
Posts: 289
Joined: 2013-09-13, 1:20
Real Name: Malcolm
Gender: male
Country: CA Canada (Canada)

Re: Polski Kącik / Polish Corner / Angolo Polacco

Postby Ahzoh » 2013-10-25, 13:14

Well, as I said I had hoped "one day" that world languages would abandon the notion of grammatical gender, for it's practically useless (can't you tell a male and a female by voice and by looking?)

But that said, I'm still wanting to learn Polish, I'm just raising a point/issue.
A native of [flag=]en-CA[/flag]
Conlang: Image
Economic Left/Right: -6.88
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -4.46

User avatar
pittmirg
Posts: 720
Joined: 2008-06-11, 7:37
Gender: male
Country: PL Poland (Polska)

Re: Polski Kącik / Polish Corner / Angolo Polacco

Postby pittmirg » 2013-10-25, 13:20

I suggest you to abandon Polish. Not only does Polish have genders (like many languages around the world), not only does Polish have animate gender (like other Slavic languages), but it has a unique virile gender too! How sexist THAT is!


I don't know, in order to claim that such features are 'sexist' you'd probably have to prove that they correlate with or influence the society in a certain way. On the other hand, there have been societies speaking a genderless languages which are not exactly a feminist's dream (e.g. the Chinese) and there have been societies speaking a highly gender-marking language (e.g. the Iroquois) with a high position of women / relatively egalitarian.

Furthermore, Polish feminists like to endorse overtly marked feminine profession names (so it gets even 'worse'). Traditionally, Polish forms the names of many types of female profession practitioners by zero derivation, e.g. biolog (masculine, case-inflected, can denote a male biologist or one of unspecified gender) becomes biolog (feminine, uninflected, can only denote a female biologist). Women's right activist millieus propagate forms like biolożka (feminine, case inflected, can only denote a female biologist) instead, probably in order to persuade people that a woman can be a biologist. I have read the same tendency can be seen in French.

Well, as I said I had hoped "one day" that world languages would abandon the notion of grammatical gender, for it's practically useless (can't you tell a male and a female by voice and by looking?)


Can't you tell singular and plural merely by looking? Can't you tell present and past tense merely by context?

Grammatical gender (which often extends to inanimate nouns) also serves functions such as sentence disambiguation (when two nouns have a different gender, you instantly know which pronoun refers to which) and homophone disambiguation (in Polish: dwa barki 'two shoulders' or 'two cabinets', dwie barki 'two barges'; barki can have at least 3 meanings, the numeral dwie/dwa which inflects for gender partly disambiguates this).
занесіть мя в Верховину / де родився, хай загину

Ahzoh
Posts: 289
Joined: 2013-09-13, 1:20
Real Name: Malcolm
Gender: male
Country: CA Canada (Canada)

Re: Polski Kącik / Polish Corner / Angolo Polacco

Postby Ahzoh » 2013-10-26, 4:19

Well, as I said I had hoped "one day" that world languages would abandon the notion of grammatical gender, for it's practically useless (can't you tell a male and a female by voice and by looking?)


Can't you tell singular and plural merely by looking? Can't you tell present and past tense merely by context?

Grammatical gender (which often extends to inanimate nouns) also serves functions such as sentence disambiguation (when two nouns have a different gender, you instantly know which pronoun refers to which) and homophone disambiguation (in Polish: dwa barki 'two shoulders' or 'two cabinets', dwie barki 'two barges'; barki can have at least 3 meanings, the numeral dwie/dwa which inflects for gender partly disambiguates this).[/quote]

I'm sorry, but you just can't compare looks/hearing with telling whether something happened now or awhile ago, because the former involves LOOKING and HEARING with your SENSES, the latter does involve context only and nothing to do with the senses.


also, this proves my point, why do INANIMATE objects need a gender? ONLY for disambiguity? then why not just have different words instead of referring to your cabinet as a she? also, if you didn't have grammatical gender, you wouldn't NEED more than one variation of the same pronoun.


but I digress, you can't change what's already there...
A native of [flag=]en-CA[/flag]
Conlang: Image
Economic Left/Right: -6.88
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -4.46

User avatar
dorenda
Posts: 2896
Joined: 2004-11-17, 23:02
Real Name: Dorenda
Gender: female
Country: PL Poland (Polska)
Contact:

Re: Polski Kącik / Polish Corner / Angolo Polacco

Postby dorenda » 2014-02-09, 14:27

Jak się nazywa takie coś?
Przed chwilą tego używałam, jak myłam okna, i uświadomiłam sobie, że nie mam pojęcia jak to się nazywa, a też nie mogłam znaleźć.
Image
A jeszcze to:
Image
Czy to się nazywa "ircha"? Coś takiego znalazłam w Wikipedii.
To taka szmata bardzo miękkiej skóry (choć dziś zwykle robią syntetyczne), która może wchłaniać dużo wody, ale też lekko się ją wyciska.
W Holandii tradycyjnie się używa tych dwóch rzeczy (+ jeszcze gąbki) do mycia okien. :)
нехай мій гаманець порожній
моя дорога невідома
я стану вільним, подорожнім
найголовніше вийти з дому

PiotrR
Posts: 421
Joined: 2013-12-04, 8:13

Re: Polski Kącik / Polish Corner / Angolo Polacco

Postby PiotrR » 2014-02-09, 14:31

ABCDEFGHIJKLMNO
Last edited by PiotrR on 2014-04-02, 1:24, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
dorenda
Posts: 2896
Joined: 2004-11-17, 23:02
Real Name: Dorenda
Gender: female
Country: PL Poland (Polska)
Contact:

Re: Polski Kącik / Polish Corner / Angolo Polacco

Postby dorenda » 2014-02-10, 22:30

Dzięki!
A to drugie to niewiadomo? :)
нехай мій гаманець порожній
моя дорога невідома
я стану вільним, подорожнім
найголовніше вийти з дому

PiotrR
Posts: 421
Joined: 2013-12-04, 8:13

Re: Polski Kącik / Polish Corner / Angolo Polacco

Postby PiotrR » 2014-02-10, 23:08

ABCDEFGHIJKLMNO
Last edited by PiotrR on 2014-04-02, 1:23, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
dorenda
Posts: 2896
Joined: 2004-11-17, 23:02
Real Name: Dorenda
Gender: female
Country: PL Poland (Polska)
Contact:

Re: Polski Kącik / Polish Corner / Angolo Polacco

Postby dorenda » 2014-02-11, 20:51

Ścierka z mikrofibry to współczesny wariant tego co ja miałam na myśli, i czym moja babcia już myła okna. :)
нехай мій гаманець порожній
моя дорога невідома
я стану вільним, подорожнім
найголовніше вийти з дому

PiotrR
Posts: 421
Joined: 2013-12-04, 8:13

Re: Polski Kącik / Polish Corner / Angolo Polacco

Postby PiotrR » 2014-02-12, 19:28

ABCDEFGHIJKLMNO
Last edited by PiotrR on 2014-04-02, 1:23, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
dorenda
Posts: 2896
Joined: 2004-11-17, 23:02
Real Name: Dorenda
Gender: female
Country: PL Poland (Polska)
Contact:

Re: Polski Kącik / Polish Corner / Angolo Polacco

Postby dorenda » 2014-02-13, 17:32

Mamy są nieodzowne! :) Dzięki.
нехай мій гаманець порожній
моя дорога невідома
я стану вільним, подорожнім
найголовніше вийти з дому

User avatar
Krzysiek_CL
Posts: 7
Joined: 2014-02-16, 19:59
Real Name: Cristóbal d.
Gender: male
Location: Santiago
Country: CL Chile (Chile)
Contact:

Re: Polski Kącik / Polish Corner / Angolo Polacco

Postby Krzysiek_CL » 2014-02-17, 12:54

Cześć!
Nazywam się Cristóbal (Krzysztof po hiszpańsku) i jestem chilijczykiem.
Mam 27 lata.
Znam hiszpański, angielski i francuski.
Uczę się niemeckiego i polskiego


Return to “Polish (Polski)”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest