opposite of diminuitive

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adventrue
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opposite of diminuitive

Postby adventrue » 2010-04-23, 17:33

i heard Italian has not only a suffix to make things smaller, but also bigger.
How would you say "bottle' (dutch: fles), then "little bottle" (flesje), "big bottle" (dutch cannot do this), using suffixes?
What is the grammatical term of this opposite of a diminuitive?

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Re: opposite of diminuitive

Postby linguoboy » 2010-04-23, 18:33

See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italian_grammar#Alteration

Since "bottle" is bottiglia, I would expect bottiglina and bottigliona, but I could be wrong. Sometimes suffixed forms in Romance languages have unpredictable meanings and my knowledge of Italian is very limited.
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Re: opposite of diminuitive

Postby Massimiliano B » 2010-04-23, 22:32

"Bottiglia" (bottle)

"bottiglina" (little bottle)

"bottiglione" (big bottle)

The term used to indicate the last form ("bottiglione") is "accrescitivo" (from "accrescere": to increase, to augment, to extend): the suffix you have to add to the end of the word is "-one". Usually it changes the gender of the feminine words: thus "la bottiglia" (feminine), but "il bottiglione" (masculine). Other examples: "la donna" - "il donnone". You can also say "la donnona" (feminine), "la bottigliona" (feminine).

Italian language has not only the "diminutivo" (some diminutive suffixes are -ino, -icino, -ellino, -ello, -icello, -erello, -etto, -icciolo) and the "accrescitivo" ("accrescitivo" suffixes are -one, -ona, -otto, -ozzo), but also "vezzeggiativo" (from the verb "vezzeggiare": to fondle; to caress), and "peggiorativo" (pejorative or depreciative). The "vezzeggiativo" suffixes indicate that the noun is dear, beloved, pleasant, good (in a word, positive). They are -ino, -icino, -olino, -uccio, -uzzo. "Peggiorativo" indicates that the noun is unpleasant, disagreeable, bad (in a word, negative). Suffixes are -accio, -astro, -onzolo, -iciattolo, -ucolo, -ipola, -aglia.

Some of the suffixes listed above may have also a "mixed" meaning: there are "accrescitivo-vezzeggiativo" suffixes, like -ona (mammona); or "diminutivo-vezzeggiativo" like -ino (gattino, little and nice cat); or "accrescitivo-peggiorativo" like -ozzo (predicozzo); or "diminutivo-peggiorativo -etto (ometto, from "uomo").

The name of these suffixes is "suffissi valutativi" (valuational suffixes), and a word with this kind of suffixes is "alterata" ("altered").


Some examples with "accrescitivo" (the thing you're talking about is big):

lettone (lett-one), from "letto" ("bed");
librone (libr-one); from "libro" ("book");
amicona (amic-ona), from "amica"("friend" - female);
nasotto (nas-otto), da "naso"("nose");
predicozzo (predic-ozzo), da "predica" ("sermon");



with "diminutivo" (it involves the idea of littleness):

gattino (gatt-ino), from "gatto" ("cat");
lumicino (lum-icino), from "lume" ("lamp", or "light");
fornellino (forn-ellino), from "forno" ("oven");
vinello (vin-ello), from "vino" ("wine");
venticello (vent-icello), from "vento" ("wind");
fuocherello (fuoch-erello), from "fuoco" ("fire");
vasetto (vas-etto), from vaso ("vase");
muricciolo (mur-icciolo), from "muro" ("wall");



with "vezzeggiativo":

amorino (amor-ino), from "amore" ("love);
cuoricino (cuor-icino), from "cuore" ("heart");
topolino (top-olino); from "topo", ("mouse");
reuccio (re-uccio), from "re" ("king");
occhiuzzo (occhi-uzzo), from "occhio" ("eye");



and with "peggiorativo":

paesaccio (paes-accio), from "paese" ("land", "country", or "village", "town");
poetastro (poet-astro), from poeta ("poet");
mediconzolo (medic-onzolo), from "medico" ("doctor");
omiciattolo (om-iciattolo), from "uomo" ("man");
avvocatucolo (avvocat-ucolo), from "avvocato" ("lawyer");
casipola (cas-ipola), from "casa" ("house");
gentaglia (gent-aglia); from "gente" ("people").

There are other suffixes; I listed here only some of them.

Some suffixes con be used like indipendent words: "è proprio accio?" means: "Is it really bad?".

The suffixes can also be put together (but not every combination is possible): "omaccione" is a "bad and big man".


The suffixes con also be added to adjectives (but their use is not very stylish):

altino (from "alto", "tall"). "Un uomo altino" means "a little-less-than-tall man", or "a tall man, but not to much tall");
bellino (from "bello", "beautiful");
carino, caruccio (from "caro", "dear");
piccolino (from "piccolo", "dear");
pienotto (from "pieno", "full");
poverello (from "povero", "poor")


or to adverbs:

malino (from "male", badly)
tarduccio (from "tardi", late); "è tarduccio!" can mean: "it's late, but not very late; so, don't worry, you have still a little time to get ready, but...hurry up!") :D


or to verbs (here, the suffixes are different):

(from "cantare", to sing): canticchiare (to sing, but not to much and in a good way);
(from "studiare", to study): studiacchiare (to study a bit, or not in a good way).
(from tagliare, to cut): tagliuzzare (to cut a little bit).

Ciao!

(I know I made spelling or grammatical mistakes. Please correct me!)

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Re: opposite of diminuitive

Postby adventrue » 2010-04-26, 14:25

Wow that was exhaustive! Thanks very much, very interesting!

You did not make many mistakes.
Let me correct the ones I see:
you wrote:
"Some suffixes con be used like indipendent words:"


Maybe it's just a typo, but "con" must be "can" (you make this mistake a few times)
"independent" is the correct spelling of the last but one word of your sentence.
and instead of "like" you should use "as". Thus your sentence must be
"Some suffixes can be used as independent words".

You wrote: "The name of these suffixes is "suffissi valutativi" (valuational suffixes), and a word with this kind of suffix is "alterata" ("altered")."
The word in bold must be singular.

You wrote: "The suffixes con also be added to adjectives (but their use is not very stylish):"
A native speaker would not use the word "stylish" here. This adjective is mostly applied to fashion in clothes. Maybe you could formulate it best as "The suffixes can also be added to adjectives (but it is not considered good style to do this)".
Last edited by adventrue on 2010-04-26, 14:48, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: opposite of diminuitive

Postby linguoboy » 2010-04-26, 14:41

adventrue wrote:Thus your sentence must be "Some suffixes can be used as independant words".

Skitt's law in action!
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Re: opposite of diminuitive

Postby adventrue » 2010-04-26, 14:49

thanks linguoboy.
it is less muphry's law, than the fact that i study in france and mix up french and english spelling sometimes ;0)

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Re: opposite of diminuitive

Postby linguoboy » 2010-04-26, 15:01

adventrue wrote:it is less muphry's law, than the fact that i study in france and mix up french and english spelling sometimes ;0)

Muphry's/Skitt's/Hartman's law says nothing about the causes of prescriptivist retaliation; it only states its inevitability. (The -ant/-ent spelling distinction has got to be one of the most useless and arbitrary in all of English orthography. I have to make up little mnemonics to keep them straight and I still screw up half the time. And, yes, knowing French only makes it worse.)
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Re: opposite of diminuitive

Postby Massimiliano B » 2010-04-26, 20:32

Thank you for your corrections!

Yes, "con" for "can" is a typo. I think I wrote "con" two times because in Italian language there is the word "con", whose meaning is "with", which is very used. My fingers wrote it instead of the unusual (for my fingers!) "can".
I wrote "indipendent" because in my language the word is "indipendente" (Latin "de" became "di" in Italian).
It's very difficult to eliminate the linguistic interferences of the mother tongue!

Ciao!

(Other mistakes?)
Last edited by Massimiliano B on 2014-01-18, 2:49, edited 1 time in total.

lu:ka

Re: opposite of diminuitive

Postby lu:ka » 2010-05-04, 10:37

I feel like adding a few notes to Massimiliano B's exhaustive post about suffixes and their usage.

  1. As it is shown by the examples Massimiliano posted, suffixes agree in gender and number with the word they modify:
    1. casa [f.] --> casina
    2. case [f. pl.] --> casine
  2. the gender of the altered word can (rarely) change:
    1. predica [f.] --> predicozzo [m]
      (I can't actually think to any other example in everyday speech)
  3. sometimes a word which looks like an altered one is actually a per se word with its own meaning:
    1. bottone --> button NOT botto (bang) + -one (big) that's you sai "un gran botto" instead of using the suffix
    2. focaccia --> a pizza-like flat bread NOT foca (seal, the animal) + -accia (bad)
    3. mattone --> brick NOT matto (mad person) + -one (big)
    4. mattina/mattino --> morning NOT matto (mad person) + -ino/a (small)

Hope this helps to better clarify some aspects of suffixes.

[Since I'm not a native speaker, please correct any mistake]

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Re: opposite of diminuitive

Postby adventrue » 2010-05-07, 20:54

Quick corrections:

sometimes a word which looks like an altered one is actually (per se) a word with its own meaning:


Hope this helps to clarify some aspects of suffixes.

[Since I'm not a native speaker, please correct any mistakes I make]

A native speaker would word some of your other sentences a bit differently, but they are not mistakes 'per se' :)

lu:ka

Re: opposite of diminuitive

Postby lu:ka » 2010-05-08, 9:55

adventrue wrote:Quick corrections:

sometimes a word which looks like an altered one is actually (per se) a word with its own meaning:


Hope this helps to clarify some aspects of suffixes.

[Since I'm not a native speaker, please correct any mistakes I make]

A native speaker would word some of your other sentences a bit differently, but they are not mistakes 'per se' :)


Thank you, adventrue


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