Using traditional characters everywhere?

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Woods
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Using traditional characters everywhere?

Postby Woods » 2020-12-31, 19:43

Is it okay to render Chinese text in traditional characters in Singapore and Mainland China? I mean in official, business and every other context? If one learns Mandarin with traditional characters, is there any need to get a handle of simplified, besides understanding?

Also, to what extent would it be okay to mix both?

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Re: Using traditional characters everywhere?

Postby azhong » 2021-01-03, 4:44

不管是繁體字或者簡體字,如果你會了其中一種,通常就能看懂另一種的大部分, 雖然確實還是有一些你必須特地查閱。我和大陸朋友交流,閱讀彼此的文字,大體上雙方都沒什麼困難。就算你在大陸不小心寫了幾個繁體字應該也不至於被抓去關或者驅逐出境。此外,現在很多大陸人也開始回歸傳統文化,學起了繁體字。

你想怎麼混用都沒關係,這個不是什麼大問題。 等到有一天,也許是你當上了外交官,真的需要釐清楚簡體字和繁體字, 網路上有很多工具,你也會有秘書協助。

說不定你可以兩種一起學著辨認,簡體字是從繁體字簡化而成的。基本上筆劃比較多的就是繁體字。

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Re: Using traditional characters everywhere?

Postby Woods » 2021-01-03, 21:24

azhong wrote:就算你在大陸不小心寫了幾個繁體字應該也不至於被抓去關或者驅逐出境。

But what about the entire text? I kind of don't see the point of ever writing simplified at all - I would like to learn traditional and only recognise the simplified ones, but never use them myself. With this, will it be fine if I produce text that is supposed to be used in China (let's say a contract for example?)


azhong wrote:此外,現在很多大陸人也開始回歸傳統文化,學起了繁體字。

Really? Can you give more details?


azhong wrote:等到有一天,也許是你當上了外交官,真的需要釐清楚簡體字和繁體字, 網路上有很多工具,你也會有秘書協助。

Knowing myself, I would rather ask them to render everything in traditional, because this is my style. Of course if it doesn't cause huge problems. Or maybe even if it does.


azhong wrote:簡體字是從繁體字簡化而成的。

But sometimes they change whole shapes and the meaning is lost completely. Often they simplify without a reason - e.g. the amount of strokes is the same, but they change the character just for the sake of confusing people. Or the character is simple enough but they simplify it anyway. If they just changed a few radicals and shapes to make it easier that would be totally okay. But it isn't the case.

It really looks like it's done much more to cut people from their culture than to make their life easier.

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Re: Using traditional characters everywhere?

Postby azhong » 2021-01-04, 10:14

Woods wrote: ...I kind of don't see the point of ever writing simplified at all ...
請問上面這句是什麼意思?我不懂…

如果真的要簽合約,的確在大陸可能需要使用簡體字,不過不用擔心啦,至少有Google translator能幫助你進行簡體繁體的轉換。

我知道有些台灣朋友在大陸教小孩寫書法、唸<弟子規>,藉此宏揚傳統文化,用的應該是繁體字。我也確實看過有位大陸作家批評某些簡體字的改造是失敗的作品。我只能舉出這些小例子。

有些簡體字的確已經完全失去繁體字原先的樣貌,這是真的,這些字我也需要額外學習。
題外話:有些最近幾十年才發展出來的用語,兩邊的說法也不太一樣,這部分也得另外學;已經不只是簡體繁體的轉換而已。

如果你有興趣討論兩種字體的差異、簡體字的改造原則,等等,你可以具體舉例,我會盡我所能回覆你。不過我也不是完全懂。我們可以一起切磋切磋。

我不想涉入政治的相互批評。我願意相信當初的字體改革者有其良好的立意。

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Re: Using traditional characters everywhere?

Postby OldBoring » 2021-01-04, 13:20

You can certainly write Traditional characters in non-official contexts, but it's certainly discouraged in official contexts.
There is the concept of 规范字 (normative characters).

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Re: Using traditional characters everywhere?

Postby Osias » 2021-01-04, 15:22

It looks like China is putting some serious effort into become so complex as Brazilian Portuguese.
2017 est l'année du (fr) et de l'(de) pour moi. Parle avec moi en eux, s'il te plait.

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Re: Using traditional characters everywhere?

Postby Woods » 2021-01-05, 10:59

azhong wrote:
Woods wrote: ...I kind of don't see the point of ever writing simplified at all ...
請問上面這句是什麼意思?我不懂…

It means that I don't want to be able to write simplified, only traditional. I would like to be able to understand simplified, of course.


azhong wrote:如果真的要簽合約,的確在大陸可能需要使用簡體字,不過不用擔心啦,至少有Google translator能幫助你進行簡體繁體的轉換。

Sounds like a messy job. That's precisely what I want to avoid. And also, I want to make a statement that I support traditional Chinese culture by rendering my texts in traditional characters.


azhong wrote:如果你有興趣討論兩種字體的差異、簡體字的改造原則,等等,你可以具體舉例,我會盡我所能回覆你。

Thanks! Let's see when I get started :)


azhong wrote:我們可以一起切磋切磋。

Sure! But my Chinese is pretty much still at level zero.

What happened to that post where you left your Skype, and then deleted it?

I am busy with what not, but learning Chinese is somewhere in the projects. Let's see how much time I have for it. Also, sometimes I get carried away - like two days ago I was studying something else and then wanted to check one character. From there on - what the character is made of, and from there on - I started learning some Taiwanese. At the end I realised that I had completely failed to do my original task, which had nothing to do with Chinese :D


OldBoring wrote:You can certainly write Traditional characters in non-official contexts, but it's certainly discouraged in official contexts.
There is the concept of 规范字 (normative characters).

Discouraged but tolerated, or discouraged and turned down?


Osias wrote:It looks like China is putting some serious effort into become so complex as Brazilian Portuguese.

Well, they're also planning on conquering Taiwan (and deadly serious about it.) So it's more like Brazilians not giving a fuck about Portuguese (which is the case, isn't it?) but with the justification that they don't have to, because they will conquer Portugal and incorporate it into their empire :(


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