Hokkien Study Group

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Re: Hokkien Study Group

Postby Salajane » 2018-06-11, 17:56

księżycowy wrote:I've thought about it before, but if I was to go that way, I'd probably start with Indonesian and/or Tagalog first.

That's what I'm doing! :)

But I already have enough going on linguistically. :P
Sorry. (Unless you can manage to convince me to swap/change something.)

Maybe when you're done with one of your languages? After we finish SAH?

I do like this study group idea very much though. :yep:

Me too. We can make a tradition out of this.
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Re: Hokkien Study Group

Postby księżycowy » 2018-06-11, 18:01

Salajane wrote:Maybe when you're done with one of your languages? After we finish SAH?

That's certainly a possibility. :)

Me too. We can make a tradition out of this.

I'm hoping to see some more of these sprout up in the coming weeks. I saw voron suggest one for Arabic in his TAC.

But hopefully they remain active and don't burn out. I'm not to worried about ours here though.

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Re: Hokkien Study Group

Postby vijayjohn » 2018-06-11, 19:23

I would LOVE to see a study group or something for both Malayalam and Romani! :mrgreen: Other Dravidian languages would be good, too. Even other Indic languages would be good. Honestly, anything would be good!
księżycowy wrote:
I don't think I'll bother with the pronunciation stuff since that's available on Wikipedia. :P I can do the (first) sound drill, though. I guess for the grammar sections, I'll just type out the examples, not all the English text surrounding it. :P (Assuming, of course, that I get to those in the first place).


Leave me some space and I'll type out the English explanations. I mean, I'd hate the see you do all the work for SAH.

Okay! :lol:
I mean, if we're typing up 75ish percent of the book, why leave it there? :P

Well, let's see how much we actually get around to doing. :P
Practical Balinese?

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Oh, and I thought this might interest you, Vijay:
https://support.google.com/docs/answer/2494888?hl=en

:lol:

EDIT: I wonder whether it might be possible to add the Google Docs we're working on as language resources.
EDIT2: Or am I getting a little too ahead of myself? :para:
EDIT3:
Salajane wrote:
księżycowy wrote:I've thought about it before, but if I was to go that way, I'd probably start with Indonesian and/or Tagalog first.

That's what I'm doing! :)

Me, too!

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Re: Hokkien Study Group

Postby Salajane » 2018-06-11, 19:47

vijayjohn wrote:I would LOVE to see a study group or something for both Malayalam and Romani! :mrgreen: Other Dravidian languages would be good, too. Even other Indic languages would be good. Honestly, anything would be good!

Can you read my thoughts? That's what I was thinking about today. I just thought that it would be cool to learn a language with retroflex sounds, and firstly I wanted to pick up an Indo-Aryan or Dravidian language, but then I decided that Javanese would be easier.

EDIT: I see you've deleted this comment, but in case you're still interested: "salajane" means "secret" in Estonian (adjective).
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Re: Hokkien Study Group

Postby vijayjohn » 2018-06-11, 20:05

Yeah, I deleted it because I looked it up and figured it out. :P

Oooh! Maybe I could help you learn Malayalam then!!

But I wonder how...maybe I could start by going over the phonology? I have a thread where I post Malayalam lessons at least twice a year or so, but I could start another thread in the South Asian forum if you'd like.

EDIT: If you didn't know, I also have a website where I used to teach Malayalam, but the design is so bad it's virtually non-existent. :P I don't really have the option of working on it anymore, either. :doggy: (Which is why I offer lessons on UniLang instead). I don't think the fonts work anymore, either, not even for me. :para: It might still have some material you could find useful, though.

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Re: Hokkien Study Group

Postby księżycowy » 2018-06-11, 20:14

vijayjohn wrote:I would LOVE to see a study group or something for both Malayalam and Romani! :mrgreen: Other Dravidian languages would be good, too. Even other Indic languages would be good. Honestly, anything would be good!

It's decided then. I'm creating a study group for:
Japanese, German, Irish, Polish, Seneca and Hebrew.

And you're joining them all.


Well, let's see how much we actually get around to doing. :P

It's too late to back out now. We're in too deep.


No, Everyday Balinese

50/50 shot. :P

EDIT: I wonder whether it might be possible to add the Google Docs we're working on as language resources.
EDIT2: Or am I getting a little too ahead of myself? :para:

Maybe we could, even if lesson by lesson!
I like this idea. It should be alright, copyright wise, as we're changing things enough I think.

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Re: Hokkien Study Group

Postby vijayjohn » 2018-06-11, 21:31

Well, we're using a different transcription system and trying to write out the Chinese characters. Is that really enough to avoid copyvio?

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Re: Hokkien Study Group

Postby księżycowy » 2018-06-11, 21:34

I'm far from an expert, but I'd say we've made it our own.

Of course the book is OOP now, so that might tip the scales in our favor as well.

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Re: Hokkien Study Group

Postby vijayjohn » 2018-06-11, 22:45

Hó. :)

Finished the sentences and the numbers!

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Re: Hokkien Study Group

Postby dEhiN » 2018-06-12, 22:22

Hey all, so I haven't been able to check UniLang for like the past 8 days! Sorry about that.

I'm glad you guys picked a book, and thank you for retyping it. I'll have to check the Google Doc tonight or tomorrow. Does the Google Doc retype or the original SAH teach the tones? Or does Hokkien use the same tones (and markers) as Mandarin?
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Re: Hokkien Study Group

Postby księżycowy » 2018-06-12, 22:38

The retype skips ahead to Unit 1. SAH (as in the pdf) largely relies on the audio to help you learn the tones, but it does give some explanation both before Unit 1 and some during the lessons.

The pronunciation files over at Taiwanese Made Easier do a good job of teaching the tones.

Sorry, I have a habit of just diving in. I like to see if I sink or swim. :P

If you guys want to take a slower approach to pronunciation, we can start with the pronunciation lessons over at TME. (Or do those in addition to SAH.)

And no, Hokkien does not use the same tone markers as Mandarin. Well, depending on which system is being used. Taiwanese has 7 tones (well, really only 5, but traditionally 7).

EDIT: I just noticed that Vijay has added the first sound drill to the retype.

Also, regardless of the number of tones in Taiwanese, they aren't the same as Mandarin. Taiwanese has:
High level
High falling
Mid level
Low falling/level
Low rising

Which, as I'm sure you know, isn't exactly the same as Mandarin.

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Re: Hokkien Study Group

Postby vijayjohn » 2018-06-13, 0:43

dEhiN wrote:Does the Google Doc retype or the original SAH teach the tones?

The original. The Wikipedia article on Amoy dialect actually does a pretty good job of this, too, if you can read the IPA notation for tones. That notation looks more daunting than it is, e.g. [a˥] is [a] with a high tone, [a˩] is [a] with a low tone, [a˥˧] is [a] with a high falling tone (i.e. going from [a˥] to something a bit lower-pitched), etc.
księżycowy wrote:I just noticed that Vijay has added the first sound drill to the retype.

Well, I haven't finished adding it yet! I'm still in the middle of it.

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Re: Hokkien Study Group

Postby księżycowy » 2018-06-13, 1:40

Close enough.

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Re: Hokkien Study Group

Postby vijayjohn » 2018-06-13, 3:05

Well, it's true; I have added the first sound drill. Just not all of it yet. :D

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Re: Hokkien Study Group

Postby dEhiN » 2018-06-13, 16:23

Ok, I've started going through the SAH pdf about the pronunciation. I also glanced at the Spoken Amoy Hokkien Google Doc. Remind me again which sentences we should go through? There's a good possibility I might need to go at a slower pace than you guys, but I'll try to keep up.
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Re: Hokkien Study Group

Postby księżycowy » 2018-06-13, 16:34

1-20, but we can cut it back. I really just chose a random number.

We can do less if you guys want.

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Re: Hokkien Study Group

Postby dEhiN » 2018-06-13, 16:46

What about half that? Or what about this week focusing on pronunciation? I don't need to know it perfectly, but I would like to have some idea of how to say what I'm reading.

Edit: Sorry if I'm slowing you guys down.
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Re: Hokkien Study Group

Postby księżycowy » 2018-06-13, 17:04

No worries about being slow as far as I'm concerned.

I'm ok with either of those options. What does everyone else think?

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Re: Hokkien Study Group

Postby Salajane » 2018-06-13, 17:36

I would also like to focus on pronounciation for the first week.
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Re: Hokkien Study Group

Postby księżycowy » 2018-06-13, 17:40

I think it's safe to say the Vijay would be ok with that. This week is pronunciation week.

EDIT: That reminds me, when do we all want to check in and see what our progress has been? Sunday? Monday? Another day?


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