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Yasna wrote:Holy shit is the left obsessed with labels.
Saim wrote:I'm happy you agree. Do you not think this is indicative of Carl's larger ideological bent?
So here's the question: is he naive (in a way that is useful to fascists) or a cryptofascist?
Why are you making excuses for this? Linking to jihadwatch is unacceptable unless you're unaware of what it is or you're pointing out how deranged they are.
The video fits into a narrative that would have that:
1) Rape culture doesn't exist and sexual assaults happen less than claimed by feminism
2) Muslims do have a rape culture and commit sexual assaults more often than claimed by feminism
This is the infamous Islamophobic pseudofeminist two-step, where we're trying to defend women but only from the evil brown people who are the real sexists/assaulters. This is especially disgusting coming from someone who not only said "I wouldn't even rape you" to a women, but still defends the statement to this day.
Because I think it accurately describes the online space he represents. He is towards the beginning of a radicalisation pipeline, which is why all sorts of fascists and racists love him -- just look at any of his comment sections or the endorsements I mentioned.
I fully admit that Carl might be too dogmatic and arrogant, or too high on his own ideology, to realise the function his videos have. But that doesn't exactly make a great case in his favour.
In fact, I wouldn't be particularly bothered by a description of some of the progressives on RT as part of a socdem -> Stalinist radicalisation pipeline.
Another thing about communists is they don't tend to hide their views so much, if you ask them most of them time they'll just tell you what they are. Fascists on the other hand engage in all sorts of word games to avoid letting slip what they are because their primary interest is engaging in propaganda. So in general with fascists and fash-adjacent nationalists you have to be more careful with taking their claims about themselves at face value.
vijayjohn wrote:Yasna wrote:Holy shit is the left obsessed with labels.
And the right is not?
Yasna wrote:Are you sure you want to start judging people by the comment section of their videos?
A harsh critique of capitalism can function as a tool for anything from social democracy to communism. See the problem here?
but I do think it's hyperbolic to say Muslims have a "rape culture".
That's fair, but there's the constant danger of this hunt for "cryptofascists" devolving into McCarthyism.
You've brought up these radicalization pipelines a few times now. Do you have any specific accounts of this happening?
As you probably know, people in general become less radical as they grow older.
Saim wrote:I'm not talking about a single critique.
I don't, just to be clear. But I don't trust anyone who massively overplays the incidence of rape and sexual assault committed by one ethnic or religious group and massively underplays cases committed by "their" group.
Also, telling a woman "I wouldn't even rape you" is unacceptable under any circumstances, and he still stands by the statement.
I'm not in any sort of position to engage in McCarthyism, nor is anyone of my ideological persuasion.
If by "accounts" you mean anecdotal evidence, then at least Spencer (as well as many many other alt-right figures, including ones that have been openly critical of him) thinks that Carl is a useful entry point, and in this hangout at least one nazi claimed that Carl put him on the path towards the alt right.
Yasna wrote:I'm not in any sort of position to engage in McCarthyism, nor is anyone of my ideological persuasion.
You think the rampant false accusations of racism, sexism, fascism, etc. have no serious effect on people's professional and social lives?
Yasna wrote:I encourage you to read up on grooming gangs. It's hard to overplay the scale of this atrocity.
Britain’s Grooming Gang Crisis
Moreover, I don't want to be deprived of views or information on either side of the political spectrum
Yasna wrote:I encourage you to read up on grooming gangs. It's hard to overplay the scale of this atrocity.
Britain’s Grooming Gang Crisis
[...]
Agreed. I have no doubt he's trolling, but that doesn't excuse it.
You think the rampant false accusations of racism, sexism, fascism, etc. have no serious effect on people's professional and social lives?
I suppose that sort of thing does happen sometimes. I still think it's a weak criticism though.
If Sargon is wrong about some things, I think it's 1000x more powerful to point out exactly how is he wrong rather than point to him being a potential radicalization pipeline in some nebulous cases.
Wait so do that make you a left-wing nationalist or how does this work?Saim wrote:As a leftist I'm not exactly a massive fan of liberal multiculturalism
But his free speech you regressive!!!If I had the power to ruin Carl's professional and social life I would be thrilled. Alas, I do not, so Carl's professional and social life remains intact. In fact, as far as I know he gets payed quite a lot for his garbage opinions.
mōdgethanc wrote:Wait so do that make you a left-wing nationalist or how does this work?Saim wrote:As a leftist I'm not exactly a massive fan of liberal multiculturalism
When I see people calling the strict observation of gendered, religious-based hair taboos empowering, for example, I can't help but think of this as a bit of an overcorrection for Western Islamophobia.
Often progressive(-ish) Westerners seem to ignore that Islamic societies have their own internal dynamics and struggles, with local feminists fighting for their right to not cover their hair; I personally sympathise with progressive and opposition groups in the Islamic world, as I do with struggles around the world.
Saim wrote:I'll just stress here that I'm not some weirdo Maoist who thinks that ethnic cleansing of "settlers" is justified
Lur wrote:Lur - who doesn't want to move to Canada because they speak English and French and that's boring, and because of the very very very dumb reason of being white (but not in a self-flagellating way)
linguoboy wrote:Lur wrote:Lur - who doesn't want to move to Canada because they speak English and French and that's boring, and because of the very very very dumb reason of being white (but not in a self-flagellating way)
The Northwest Territories has eleven official languages: Chipewyan, Cree, English, French, Gwich’in, Inuinnaqtun, Inuktitut, Inuvialuktun, North Slavey, South Slavey and Tłįchǫ/Dogrib.
linguoboy wrote:Lur wrote:Lur - who doesn't want to move to Canada because they speak English and French and that's boring, and because of the very very very dumb reason of being white (but not in a self-flagellating way)
The Northwest Territories has eleven official languages: Chipewyan, Cree, English, French, Gwich’in, Inuinnaqtun, Inuktitut, Inuvialuktun, North Slavey, South Slavey and Tłįchǫ/Dogrib.
Wikipedia wrote:[T]he NWT government only publishes laws and other documents in the territory's other official languages when the legislature asks it to. Furthermore, access to services in any language is limited to institutions and circumstances where there is a significant demand for that language or where it is reasonable to expect it given the nature of the services requested. In practical terms, English language services are universally available, and there is no guarantee that other languages, including French, will be used by any particular government service, except for the courts.
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