Abortion

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sa wulfs
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Re: Abortion

Postby sa wulfs » 2011-01-23, 12:21

Indeed. And I might add
Jurgen Wullenwever wrote:Why?

Has something happened?

Do the Dutch fuck in some odd way, that has some bearing on the abortive issue? :?:

And how is that behaviour causing any hatred?

What about the non-fuckers living there? Are they hated too?

:lol:
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Hunef
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Re: Abortion

Postby Hunef » 2011-01-23, 18:49

KingHarvest wrote:[...] my hate runs so deep [...]
Glad to see that you're so constructive, dude. :roll:
But the fact that some geniuses were laughed at does not imply that all who are laughed at are geniuses. They laughed at Columbus, they laughed at Fulton, they laughed at the Wright Brothers. But they also laughed at Bozo the Clown.
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Jurgen Wullenwever
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Re: Abortion

Postby Jurgen Wullenwever » 2011-01-23, 19:46

Formiko wrote:
KingHarvest wrote:Yes, Augustine also forbid abortion even though he believed the soul didn't inhere in the fetus until 40 days for boys and 80 days for girls.

So? Augustine isn't the word of God. He was WRONG on that, and many other things in fact.

Was Ezra right about being the word of God then?
Chekhov wrote:I don't know about naive worldviews, but Jurgen Wullenwhatever pisses me off to no end because of his extreme pessimism and cynicism. You'd think the world was going to end imminently when talking to that guy.

Jag är rebell: jag sockrar teet, saltar maten, cyklar utan hjälm, och tänder glödlampor.
(Ovanstående var förut, nu försöker jag minska sockret och saltet, och har gett upp mejeriprodukter.)

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Re: Abortion

Postby KingHarvest » 2011-01-24, 2:47

Hunef wrote:
KingHarvest wrote:[...] my hate runs so deep [...]
Glad to see that you're so constructive, dude. :roll:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWdd6_ZxX8c
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Jurgen Wullenwever
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Re: Abortion

Postby Jurgen Wullenwever » 2011-01-26, 20:23

Have we been told why Dutch fuckers are hated? If so, please enlighten me. :?:
Chekhov wrote:I don't know about naive worldviews, but Jurgen Wullenwhatever pisses me off to no end because of his extreme pessimism and cynicism. You'd think the world was going to end imminently when talking to that guy.

Jag är rebell: jag sockrar teet, saltar maten, cyklar utan hjälm, och tänder glödlampor.
(Ovanstående var förut, nu försöker jag minska sockret och saltet, och har gett upp mejeriprodukter.)

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Varislintu
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Re: Abortion

Postby Varislintu » 2012-11-20, 9:34

Following with interest the (potential) developments in Ireland after the death of Savita Halappanavar.
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TeneReef
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Re: Abortion

Postby TeneReef » 2012-11-20, 20:42

The soul enters the body on the 49th day of the intrauterine development, according to many traditions (Hinduism+Buddhism/South Asian/Indian, South American Native Indian...)...It is also when the pineal gland appears (which is the remnant of 3rd eye, and our link to our spiritual self)...On the same day the embryo shows us first clues about the gender/sex of the baby.

So, any abortion after the 48th day of gestation, is butchery of one soul.
If a baby is aborted, the soul will have to reincarnate afresh. One cycle wasted.

my subjective stance on abortion: pro life (I would have hated my mother aborting me :lol: )
my objective stance on abortion: banning abortion would lead to massive illegal abortion activities, with high mortality of pregnant women (as witnessed in Chile and Brazil)
Last edited by TeneReef on 2012-11-20, 20:54, edited 2 times in total.
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Bijlee

Re: Abortion

Postby Bijlee » 2012-11-20, 20:49

Varislintu wrote:Following with interest the (potential) developments in Ireland after the death of Savita Halappanavar.


That story makes me so mad.

TeneReef wrote:If a baby is aborted, the soul will have to reincarnate afresh. One cycle wasted.


I'm just kind of curious, is that important to the people who believe that- to not "waste" a cycle? I don't see how it would be a problem.

I think it would be fun to have a little poll on this topic :D

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md0
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Re: Abortion

Postby md0 » 2012-11-20, 20:56

General note: There is no such thing as "a soul".
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Заря
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Re: Abortion

Postby Заря » 2012-11-20, 21:04

meidei wrote:General note: There is no such thing as "a soul".
General note: That's your opinion.

I can accept abortion, but only to a moment when brain processes aren't enough advanced to create any pain or conciousenss for the child.

Of course if it's a reason of rape or incest. When you are pregnat 'couse your boyfriend didn't put a condom, well shit happens. I am not authorised to kill children because I didn't put condom so I don't think it's okay.
Last edited by Заря on 2012-11-20, 21:18, edited 1 time in total.

Bijlee

Re: Abortion

Postby Bijlee » 2012-11-20, 21:08

Oh, by the way, I'm pro-choice. I don't think the typical arguments about souls and person-hood of the fetus are even relevant, to be honest.

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Re: Abortion

Postby linguoboy » 2012-11-20, 21:11

TeneReef wrote:The soul enters the body on the 49th day of the intrauterine development, according to many traditions (Hinduism+Buddhism/South Asian/Indian, South American Native Indian...).

I count two traditions there. That's not my defintion of "many".
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md0
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Re: Abortion

Postby md0 » 2012-11-20, 21:42

Заря wrote:
meidei wrote:General note: There is no such thing as "a soul".
General note: That's your opinion.


No, this is a scientific fact and no "personal opinions" are above science.
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Re: Abortion

Postby linguoboy » 2012-11-20, 21:59

meidei wrote:
Заря wrote:
meidei wrote:General note: There is no such thing as "a soul".
General note: That's your opinion.

No, this is a scientific fact and no "personal opinions" are above science.

It's a scientific fact that the soul weighs 21 grams.
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md0
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Re: Abortion

Postby md0 » 2012-11-20, 22:10

Really linguoboy? 1900s parapsychology that was never successfully reproduced and was discredited ages ago? If you are serious about this, link us to a neuroscientist that supports the existence of immortal soul (not mind, which is cognition, something that is ultimately biochemical)
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Re: Abortion

Postby linguoboy » 2012-11-20, 22:27

meidei wrote:Really linguoboy? 1900s parapsychology that was never successfully reproduced and was discredited ages ago? If you are serious about this, link us to a neuroscientist that supports the existence of immortal soul (not mind, which is cognition, something that is ultimately biochemical)

You want a serious point? The serious point is that science can't prove a negative. It is solely a matter of opinion whether or not there is such a thing as a "soul". Science has nothing to say one way or the other.
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md0
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Re: Abortion

Postby md0 » 2012-11-20, 22:48

linguoboy wrote:
meidei wrote:Really linguoboy? 1900s parapsychology that was never successfully reproduced and was discredited ages ago? If you are serious about this, link us to a neuroscientist that supports the existence of immortal soul (not mind, which is cognition, something that is ultimately biochemical)

You want a serious point? The serious point is that science can't prove a negative. It is solely a matter of opinion whether or not there is such a thing as a "soul". Science has nothing to say one way or the other.

Fair enough. Science though did explain that all functions attributed to the soul are matters of the mind, except immortality (<-the thing that can't be proven, as you say).
And you are not making medical decisions and create laws using a baseless opinion as a factor (you try as much to avoid it at least). So, if you are going to come against abortion, you use the argument of the fetus being in a state to understand and feel pain etc, not that according to religion X, this will corrupt the soul.
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RubyH

Re: Abortion

Postby RubyH » 2012-11-20, 23:53

Заря wrote:
meidei wrote:General note: There is no such thing as "a soul".
General note: That's your opinion.

I can accept abortion, but only to a moment when brain processes aren't enough advanced to create any pain or conciousenss for the child.

Of course if it's a reason of rape or incest. When you are pregnat 'couse your boyfriend didn't put a condom, well shit happens. I am not authorised to kill children because I didn't put condom so I don't think it's okay.

The first part I agree with,
the later https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DEkjAHS1YWs , I find the topic a bit complicated :roll: , because to understand the argument I must first know why the arguments are actually put forward and why if they are converging or diverging they are in-fact doing so.

yeah I'm prochoice.

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Kenny
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Re: Abortion

Postby Kenny » 2012-11-21, 9:58

linguoboy wrote:
meidei wrote:Really linguoboy? 1900s parapsychology that was never successfully reproduced and was discredited ages ago? If you are serious about this, link us to a neuroscientist that supports the existence of immortal soul (not mind, which is cognition, something that is ultimately biochemical)

You want a serious point? The serious point is that science can't prove a negative. It is solely a matter of opinion whether or not there is such a thing as a "soul". Science has nothing to say one way or the other.

If we do have a soul, how come all it takes to strip you of your personality - which if there is a soul should probably stem from it - is a lobotomy? How come that basically none of what we consider to make you the person you are is independent of your brain? Or are things like "personality" nothing more than something we are "cursed" with throughout our imprisonment on this planet? Honestly, what's the point of living forever if you're the same as everyone else? Or if personality is part of our soul why does it disappear if you push the right "buttons" in someone's brain? Yes, negatives cannot be proved or unproved but how likely does it seem that we do have a soul? It's the same thing as with God: yeah, okay, it's just as likely as Russell's teapot but that doesn't mean it's there.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NQLypwgqefc

RubyH

Re: Abortion

Postby RubyH » 2012-11-21, 11:13

Not just that brain can be easily obliterated, one can simply torture someone and the brain becomes irrepairably damaged. People are also more than cappable of acting evil towards other either rather intentionally or less intentionally, or even not at all intentioanlly. :roll:
Not just can a human be born without a conscience a conscience could be faulty or diseased act on incorrect information come to irrational conclusions, and so on and so forth.
Very politically incorrect, but I'd be inclined to say that I've over the past year heard the word conscience, in the sense of using once conscience used more often in the context of supporting a position which is towards someones detriment without contributing to any good. Assuming that people reallhy were acting on their conscience, conscinece can not just be absent but it seams actually diseased, probably independently of their other mental faculties.
Last edited by RubyH on 2012-11-21, 11:23, edited 2 times in total.


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