Random Politics Thread

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Re: Random Politics Thread

Postby vijayjohn » 2018-06-12, 1:31

That reminds me, there's a Fox News interview with Yasser Arafat I've been having so much trouble finding for some reason. It was within a few years before his death, definitely in the 2000s. That felt surreal to watch.

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Re: Random Politics Thread

Postby md0 » 2018-06-13, 4:34

There's a chance the pettiest conflict in the Balkans is getting resolved.

The Government of Greece and the Government of Macedonia converged on the compromise name "Republic of North Macedonia" (translated in all languages1).

It's not clear to me if the name has to be voted on by the Greek Parliament, or with a referendum. It will take a referendum to officially adopt it in Macedonia.

1. Greece for a long time insisted on an untranslated name (eg Republika Severna Makedonija - Ρεπούμπλικα Σέβερνα Μακεντόνιγια)
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Re: Random Politics Thread

Postby Aurinĭa » 2018-06-13, 12:27

IMHO, Greece should name its province South Macedonia, to be fair. Not going to happen, I know.

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Re: Random Politics Thread

Postby md0 » 2018-06-13, 12:42

Maybe it's time for North and South Luxembourg as well :lol:
Why not create a conflict out of nothing, after all?
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Re: Random Politics Thread

Postby vijayjohn » 2018-06-13, 12:50

Aurinĭa wrote:IMHO, Greece should name its province South Macedonia, to be fair. Not going to happen, I know.

It's not a province, though. It's just a traditional geographic region.

The parts of the traditional region are divided among three administrative regions: Western Macedonia, Central Macedonia, and Eastern Macedonia and Thrace (which includes the traditional geographic region of Thrace along with a small part of (traditional) Macedonia).

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Re: Random Politics Thread

Postby md0 » 2018-06-13, 13:38

For what it's worth, these areas were commonly known, and administered as "Northern Greece" until 1988.
In 1988 the Ministry for Northern Greece was renamed to Ministry for Macedonia and Thrace. That's when Greece started to really care about Macedonia.
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Re: Random Politics Thread

Postby Yasna » 2018-06-14, 20:22

A political storm has just been unleashed in Germany. The CSU just gave Merkel a two week ultimatum, demanding that asylum seekers who are already registered in the EU asylum system be turned away at the German border. If no compromise is found, Merkel's coalition is done.

Das Fass ist übergelaufen

"Die Angst der CSU vor dem Verlust der absoluten Mehrheit ist es aber nicht allein, die Söder und Seehofer in ungewohnt geschlossener Formation gegen Merkel antreten lässt. Der CSU melden ihre feinen Antennen, dass nach dem Bamf-Skandal und dem Mord an Susanna F. sich auch jenseits der bayerischen Grenzen viele Deutsche nicht länger vertrösten lassen wollen auf Lösungen, die vielleicht besser wären – aber vielleicht auch nie kommen angesichts des Aufruhrs in vielen Ländern der EU."

"Denn nicht nur die Vorgänge im Bamf und die Ermordung des Mädchens zeigen, dass viele der beschwichtigenden Aussagen und Prognosen aus der Hochzeit der „Willkommenskultur“ wirklichkeitsfremd, ja irreführend waren. Es kamen eben nicht nur schutzbedürftige Flüchtlinge, sondern auch Kriminelle, Hassprediger, Terroristen. Es kamen Ärzte und Krankenschwestern, aber auch Abertausende Analphabeten. Es kamen Integrationswillige, aber auch Migranten, die nur in die deutschen Sozialsysteme einwandern wollten."

"Zur schlimmsten Anklage der Irrtümer, der Versäumnisse und des Versagens wurde aber der Mord an Susanna F., mutmaßlich begangen von einem Iraker, der zurück in seine Heimat flüchten konnte, in die er nicht hatte abgeschoben werden können."
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Re: Random Politics Thread

Postby h34 » 2018-06-15, 10:11

^ The whole issue is controversial but it seems to me that this latest move by the CSU has at least partly been influenced by the fact that there is an election coming up in Bavaria. Using an issue as complicated as the refugee situation for an election campaign is irresponsible.

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Re: Random Politics Thread

Postby vijayjohn » 2018-06-19, 6:01


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Re: Random Politics Thread

Postby Yasna » 2018-06-19, 14:14

Ein Buch muß die Axt sein für das gefrorene Meer in uns. - Kafka

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Re: Random Politics Thread

Postby Luís » 2018-06-24, 9:51

Elections in Turkey today. I really hope it's going to be a bad day for Erdoğan.
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Re: Random Politics Thread

Postby mōdgethanc » 2018-06-26, 10:27

Saim wrote:soedgy
Damn, I thought your avatar was just some generic antifa thing, but you're really out here stanning for anarchism in current year. This brings back memories of my idealistic youth before I became a cynic.

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Re: Random Politics Thread

Postby Saim » 2018-06-26, 10:40

mōdgethanc wrote:Damn, I thought your avatar was just some generic antifa thing, but you're really out here stanning for anarchism in current year. This brings back memories of my idealistic youth before I became a cynic.


Am I edgy or am I an idealist?

I'm not sure if I'm necessarily an anarchist but I've had a visceral hatred of nation-states and borders for years now. I've also never 'supported the troops'. I really don't feel like I have any actual stake in some conflict between Russia and the US (but if I have to choose sides, it'll be the state that didn't bomb the city I'm currently in).

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Re: Random Politics Thread

Postby mōdgethanc » 2018-06-26, 11:21

Saim wrote:Am I edgy or am I an idealist?

I'm not sure if I'm necessarily an anarchist but I've had a visceral hatred of nation-states and borders for years now. I've also never 'supported the troops'.
The edgy thing was just a joke. You seem like more of an idealist. I sympathize, in fact; I would be an anarchist if I thought it could ever happen without the state overtaking it.
I really don't feel like I have any actual stake in some conflict between Russia and the US (but if I have to choose sides, it'll be the state that didn't bomb the city I'm currently in).
I'd pick the one that isn't an authoritarian sham of a democracy and a warmongering, racist, homophobic theocracy. In other words, I'd pick Russia. this is also an edgy joke, I hate Trump but hate Putin more

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Re: Random Politics Thread

Postby Saim » 2018-06-26, 11:31

I don't have any positive feelings towards Putin or Russian nationalism (or the Russian State in general really) but I don't see how the American war machine can unseat him and replace him with anything better. My only interest at the geopolitical level is for there to not be a war, as I'm not in any way convinced that NATO winning a war against Russia would make the world a better place. As for unseating Putin, that's the job of opposition within Russia and I wish them luck; the only thing I can do as an individual is not contribute to symbiotic-but-counterposed nationalisms (i.e. not supporting NATO against Russia, because Russian nationalism presents itself as a guarantee against NATO). Any other suggestions for how to show solidarity (from progressive opposition groups in Russia themselves) are welcome, of course.

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Re: Random Politics Thread

Postby mōdgethanc » 2018-06-26, 11:38

Saim wrote:I don't have any positive feelings towards Putin or Russian nationalism (or the Russian State in general really) but I don't see how the American war machine can unseat him and replace him with anything better. My only interest at the geopolitical level is for there to not be a war, as I'm not in any way convinced that NATO winning a war against Russia would make the world a better place. As for unseating Putin, that's the job of opposition within Russia and I wish them luck; the only thing I can do as an individual is not contribute to symbiotic-but-counterposed nationalisms (i.e. not supporting NATO against Russia, because Russian nationalism presents itself as a guarantee against NATO). Any other suggestions for how to show solidarity (from progressive opposition groups in Russia themselves) are welcome, of course.
I definitely don't think a neoconservative solution like regime change is a good idea and know meddling with Russia's internal politics can only backfire. War between Russia and NATO is also unthinkable because nukes. I only meant I support NATO for the purposes of countering Russia from expanding too much (which as you rightly pointed out, could also backfire). I don't really give a shit about NATO for any reason except that nobody in their right mind would attack it.

If I had to choose a country to live in, of course I'd pick any NATO country over Russia. But that's not setting the bar very high.

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Re: Random Politics Thread

Postby Saim » 2018-06-26, 12:06

mōdgethanc wrote: I only meant I support NATO for the purposes of countering Russia from expanding too much (which as you rightly pointed out, could also backfire).


I dunno, I don't really see the need to support NATO to counteract Russia in Ukraine or the Baltics than I feel the need to support Iran (or indeed Russia) to counteract the US in Iraq or Israel or whatever. Of course my completely verbal support is irrelevant and ineffective anyway, but I feel like the best I can do is to oppose nationalism and militarism in all its forms rather than taking sides in conflicts that'll happen regardless of my input.

If I had to choose a country to live in, of course I'd pick any NATO country over Russia. But that's not setting the bar very high.


Including Albania, Montenegro, Turkey, Bulgaria, and such?

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Re: Random Politics Thread

Postby mōdgethanc » 2018-06-26, 12:28

Saim wrote:I dunno, I don't really see the need to support NATO to counteract Russia in Ukraine or the Baltics than I feel the need to support Iran (or indeed Russia) to counteract the US in Iraq or Israel or whatever.
That might be true, although I'm not aware of Iraq making any expansionist attempts lately. Besides that, I have bigger moral problems with supporting Iran anyway.
Including Albania, Montenegro, Turkey, Bulgaria, and such?
I would say so. I'm much more interested in Russia as a culture but on measures of quality of life, democracy, freedom etc. (and we can debate how unbiased those are, I know) they tend to come out ahead. Russia is just a fucked-up place right now. It seems to be more developed and crime is lower there than it was a decade ago, but it's still authoritarian and corrupt as hell.

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Re: Random Politics Thread

Postby Saim » 2018-06-26, 12:38

mōdgethanc wrote:although I'm not aware of Iraq making any expansionist attempts lately.


Sorry, I wrote that sentence in a way that's kind of ambiguous: I meant supporting Iran to counteract the US in Iraq.

Besides that, I have bigger moral problems with supporting Iran anyway.


Bigger than supporting Saudi Arabia?

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Re: Random Politics Thread

Postby mōdgethanc » 2018-06-26, 12:47

Saim wrote:Sorry, I wrote that sentence in a way that's kind of ambiguous: I meant supporting Iran to counteract the US in Iraq.
At the time I was in fact in favour of the war, until it became apparent that was the losing side. I was also 13, to be fair.
Bigger than supporting Saudi Arabia?
No, both of those regimes are fucked up. If anything Saudi is worse.

See, I may be a shitlib but I try to be consistent.
Last edited by mōdgethanc on 2018-06-26, 14:14, edited 4 times in total.


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