Japanese Study Group

[vijayjohn]

Oh, at the end of lesson 1! That's the part I didn't understand. OK.

But then...why did you write out the questions for the first exercise? To me it looks like we're supposed to listen to the questions and then write out an answer. Like in their example: The recording says, "あなたは先生ですか。" but what they wrote out was "いいえ、[わたしは]先生じゃありません。" Or is that just a difference between editions?

[księżycowy]

Ok, yeah, I didn't really look at the example that well. Oops.
I'll fix it this week.

[vijayjohn]

Oh OK. I did the other exercises in my head and then looked at your answers.

Everything is right except for the first one in lesson #2; the correct answer for that is 1, not 3, because the speaker's introducing Mr. Schmidt to a group of people (the first word she says is 皆さん) before one of them introduces himself to Mr. Schmidt. That one was confusing as fuck, though.

[księżycowy]

Actually, I just checked the answer key and for my edition the script goes like this:
A:　こちらはパワー電気のシュミットさんです。
B:　初めまして。シュミットです。どうぞよろしく。
But they claim the same answer as you, #1! How the fuck can you tell the difference between choice 1 and choice 3 from what I have!? I even double checked the audio, and yeah, that's what they say!

I'm counting it as correct to pick 3!

[vijayjohn]

Mine is exactly the same as yours, except that it has 皆さん before the こちらはパワー電気の... etc. Maybe they made a mistake somewhere along the way.

So what do we do next? Shall we try the exercise on p. 4 of the workbook, since they have the answers to that in the answer key (in the workbook)?

Also, I forgot to address this earlier:

I don't get the point of using a resource written all in Japanese, at least not for me since I'm effectively starting out as a complete beginner.

I don't get why being a complete beginner should prevent you from using a resource written all in Japanese, especially when you have a translation into English anyway. That's what I did for Kurmanji and Zazaki, for instance. I barely even know anything about Zazaki (including now!), and even then I could use a resource in Zazaki for learning Zazaki as long as I had access to a dictionary. FWICT this doesn't require any special skills, just some patience and a willingness to try it out. It's a little harder than having something that spells everything out for you in a language you already know, but in the end, it's just another learning resource.

[księżycowy]

I'll also pile on and say that if you're worried about using a resource that is completely in kana and kanji (even though all the kanji have furigana), I'm sure me and Vijay can help you out on that end.

Personally I prefer Minna no Nihongo to any other Japanese textbook I've ever had, and it's partly because it's set up the way it is. Is it a challenge? You bet, but it's far from insurmountable. But gain, I'm not adverse to switching if that's what the group wants.

[księżycowy]

Mine is exactly the same as yours, except that it has 皆さん before the こちらはパワー電気の... etc. Maybe they made a mistake somewhere along the way.

Probably.

So what do we do next? Shall we try the exercise on p. 4 of the workbook, since they have the answers to that in the answer key (in the workbook)?

How about finishing the exercises in the textbook (page 13) and then, yes, moving on to the workbook?

[vijayjohn]

Okay! 分かりました！

[dEhiN]

I don't get why being a complete beginner should prevent you from using a resource written all in Japanese, especially when you have a translation into English anyway. That's what I did for Kurmanji and Zazaki, for instance. I barely even know anything about Zazaki (including now!), and even then I could use a resource in Zazaki for learning Zazaki as long as I had access to a dictionary. FWICT this doesn't require any special skills, just some patience and a willingness to try it out. It's a little harder than having something that spells everything out for you in a language you already know, but in the end, it's just another learning resource.

Good point! I don't know guys, I'm really torn between doing MnN with you and doing TYCJ on my own. If I did the second option, I would still participate in this group and use it to practice what I'm learning.

[vijayjohn]

What pros do you see to using TY? You have a physical copy of it, right?

[księżycowy]

You could probably pick up a used copy of the first edition of MnN for relatively cheap. You'd just have to know what to buy, and where to look. Just thought I'd through that out there.

[dEhiN]

You could probably pick up a used copy of the first edition of MnN for relatively cheap. You'd just have to know what to buy, and where to look. Just thought I'd through that out there.

It would be in English, right? Hmm, maybe I'll do that then. I'd have to get the workbook too, right? Or do they come as a combo?

[księżycowy]

You'd need the textbook (the book that's only in Japanese), the grammar (in English), and if you didn't want to work off the scanned version of the workbook, that as well.

I wouldn't hazard to quote prices. Maybe 50ish USD all together, if I were to take a guess?

[dEhiN]

You'd need the textbook (the book that's only in Japanese), the grammar (in English), and if you didn't want to work off the scanned version of the workbook, that as well.

I wouldn't hazard to quote prices. Maybe 50ish USD all together, if I were to take a guess?

Why the textbook only in Japanese? Is there no English version of the textbook?

[księżycowy]

You really don't need an English textbook. All the textbook is is dialogues, example sentences, drills, and exercises. All the things you would expect to be done in the language you were learning anyway.

Granted, you wouldn't expect the instructions in the other language, but MnN is light on that sort of stuff.

I get the impression some (most?) of your reservations are due to you not knowing what you're looking at. Shall me and Vijay demystify the material for you?

[dEhiN]

I get the impression some (most?) of your reservations are due to you not knowing what you're looking at. Shall me and Vijay demystify the material for you?

OMG, YES!! And not some, but most and almost all!!!

[księżycowy]

Ok, let's get this party started!

[Because of length, this will probably be split into more than one post. Please excuse the upside down pictures.]

There are two sections on the first page of lesson one called 文系（ぶんけい）and 例文（れいぶん）and basically all they are are example sentences that highlight the grammar and sentence structures to be learned in the lesson. All grammar explanations and vocabulary used are found in the grammar book.

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The 例文（れいぶん）tend to take the form of question and response.

[księżycowy]

The next section, on the next page, if the 会話（かいわ）or dialogue.

SCAN0032.JPG

[vijayjohn]

dEhiN, honestly, I personally just ignore everything except the dialogues in each chapter (and now, I pay attention to the exercises as well since księżycowy and I have started going through them).

[księżycowy]

練習　A（れんしゅう　A）is the first set of drills, which takes the sentence structures, and tells you what you can swap around.

SCAN0033.JPG

For example, #1 simply says that instead of using マイク・ミラー (Mike Miller), you can say かいしゃいん (company employee) instead. The original sentence translates to "I am Mike Miller." The alternative sentence reads "I am a company employee."