Language Course 1

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Axystos
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Postby Axystos » 2004-11-17, 20:31

I thought Pimsleur was only audio-learning, but anyway, that's not the reason of my post.

Today I was in a bookstore to look for languagebooks and dictionaries of Japanese. It seems that languagebooks usually teach the language in a romanized form, mentioning Kana and Kanji, but not using it in later lessons. Are such books useful, or should I rather look for a book that works with the Japanese writing system? Is there a 'best way' to learn Japanese?

Looking forward to your reactions/stories of your experiences.

Axystos.
Native: Nederlands; C2: Deutsch; C1: English;
B1: русский, français, 日本語;
A2: norsk, svenska; A1: português, italiano, español, čeština, polski

aguy who hasnt registered

Postby aguy who hasnt registered » 2004-11-20, 7:25

in japanese its often better to be more polite, than be less polite, politeness to animals isnt really necissary, but speaking to strangers, or people who you are not familiar with their rank in society its best to use the "masu" form of the language, if your talking to supiors, you obviosuly use a higher form of politeness, if your talking to someone younger or of lower rank, you would use a less polite speech,that is if you wish to

later

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nietoperz
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Postby nietoperz » 2004-11-20, 13:04

That's not entirely correct. Of course, there's nothing with using -desu/-masu with strangers etc. Anyway -desu/-masu has nothing to do with politeness, but with formality. In order to be polite you would need to use correct sonkeigo/kenjōgo-forms which are called for in everyday life situations like work, business, university etc. and in which most foreigners will never find themselves in. On the other hand, when addressing a dog there's no need to be formal. (Of course, some people might even talk formally to their dogs... :) )

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nietoperz
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Postby nietoperz » 2004-11-20, 13:20

Axystos wrote:Today I was in a bookstore to look for languagebooks and dictionaries of Japanese. It seems that languagebooks usually teach the language in a romanized form, mentioning Kana and Kanji, but not using it in later lessons. Are such books useful, or should I rather look for a book that works with the Japanese writing system? Is there a 'best way' to learn Japanese?


I'm not sure if there actually is a 'best way' to learn Japanese... Anyway there's no point in trying to learn the language in a romanized form, because you wouldn't be able to read the easiest signs or menus etc. at least once you get to the country. Romanization is useful for people who just need a few words, but for everything else it's no use at all. Besides, once you get used to them the kana alphabets are as good as romanization.

I can recommend the series "Situational Functional Japanese", because the Japanese used in these books sounds quite natural, plus they don't start with the "this is a book"-crap. On the other hand, they are rather student-life-oriented, so some of the situations might not be usable for tourist situations... Another good book is "Japanese for everyone" which is more business/worklife-oriented, but also does a thorough introduction of the writing systems.

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Axystos
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Postby Axystos » 2004-12-01, 13:40

Thanks, nietoperz, for your reply. Today I happened to find "situational functional japanese' in a bookstore here, so I decided that it would me mine from that moment on.

Axystos.
Native: Nederlands; C2: Deutsch; C1: English;
B1: русский, français, 日本語;
A2: norsk, svenska; A1: português, italiano, español, čeština, polski

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projetdefleur
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Postby projetdefleur » 2004-12-01, 21:07

はじめまして!わたしのなまえはイエンです。わたしのしゅっしんはグリンスボロしです。グリンスボロしはノロスケロライナしゅうでです.だいがくのがくせいです;にねんせいです。わたしのせんこうはすうがくとげんごがくです。わたしのしゅみはテレビーゲエムとがいこくご。

Did I use de correctly? Or should I use ni? How would I say "Greensboro is in North Carolina"? Thanks, this is one of my first writings in japanese :)
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victor

Postby victor » 2004-12-02, 0:51

pa-integral wrote:EXERCISE 1: Translate these sentences below into Japanese:

1. You drink coffee.
Anata wa kōhī o nomimasu.

2. The dog sees the cat.
Inu wa neko o mimasu.

3. The woman eats the cake.
Onna no hito wa kēkī o tabemasu.

4. He buys the computer.
Kare wa konpyūta o kaimasu.

5. The student reads the book.
Gakusei wa hon o yomimasu.


I studied Japanese for one year but I remember hardly anything! :wink:
im new, ill try...

1. Anata wa kohi o nomimasu

2. inu was neko o mimasu

3. Onna no hito wa keki o tabemasu

4. Kare wa konpyuta o kaimasu

5. gakusei wa hon o yomimasu

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Postby BobMaster0 » 2004-12-02, 7:42

You should use に instead. So, a better sentence would be: ノースカロライナにあります。
Also, Greensboro should be グリーンズボロ and it would be better to say 大学生(だいがくせい)than 大学の学生(だいがくのがくせい).

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Kubi
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Postby Kubi » 2004-12-02, 14:17

Additional information on で/に:

You use に in order to say where something is located ("passive location") and で to say where something is done ("active location").
Je défendrai mes opinions jusqu'à ma mort, mais je donnerai ma vie pour que vous puissiez défendre les vôtres. - Voltaire

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alois
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Postby alois » 2004-12-02, 15:48

こんにちは

Well, seems like it's the best place to post my question. I've been facing the word こと (koto) several times these days, though I'm still not sure about its real meaning. Is it like the French "en" like in "je n'en ai pas"? Here are some examples in which in found it:


私には払うことができません。
watakushi ni wa harau koto ga dekimasen
I can't afford it (?)

私の友達に会ったことがありますか。 
watakushi no tomodachi ni atta koto ga arimasu ka
Have you met my son? (?)


Thank you in advance!

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Rounin
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Postby Rounin » 2004-12-02, 17:04

こと, and lately also の, are nominalizing particles, meaning they transform the preceding verb phrase into a noun phrase.

私には払うことができません。
watakushi ni wa harau koto ga dekimasen

To me, the act of paying is impossible.

私の友達に会ったことがありますか。 
watakushi no tomodachi ni atta koto ga arimasu ka

Have you had the experience of meeting my friend?

You could further use it in the following context:

およぐこと/およぐのが好きです。
I like swimming.

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alois
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Postby alois » 2004-12-02, 22:19

Hefestos wrote:私の友達に会ったことがありますか。 
Have you met my son? (?)



Son?! :shock: lol! "Friend", my fault. :wink:

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projetdefleur
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Postby projetdefleur » 2004-12-03, 0:30

はじめまして!私のなまえはイエンです。私のしゅっしんはグリーンスボロしです。グリーンスボロしはノロスケロライナしゅうにです.大学生です;にねん生です。私のせんこうはすうがくとげんごがくです。私のしゅみはテレビーゲエムとがいこくご。

There it is again... hopefully everything is fixed, and I used the kanji that I know. let me know if it's correct :)
Native: English

Actively studying: Русский язык

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Kubi
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Postby Kubi » 2004-12-03, 8:14

projetdefleur wrote:はじめまして!私のなまえはイエンです。私のしゅっしんはグリーンスボロしです。グリーンスボロしはノロスケロライナしゅうにです.大学生です;にねん生です。私のせんこうはすうがくとげんごがくです。私のしゅみはテレビーゲエムとがいこくご。

There it is again... hopefully everything is fixed, and I used the kanji that I know. let me know if it's correct :)

Some remarks (to be checked by others, though):

...にです sound awkward to me. You'd better write ...にあります

Instead of the two sentences 大学生です、二年生(にねんせい)です, I'd write 大学の二年生です。

In the last sentence you forgot the です :wink:
Je défendrai mes opinions jusqu'à ma mort, mais je donnerai ma vie pour que vous puissiez défendre les vôtres. - Voltaire

GoktimusPrime
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Postby GoktimusPrime » 2004-12-05, 23:06

Actually, you can just say 大学二年生
This sounds much more natural and is in far more common usage than 大学の二年生

Guest

Postby Guest » 2004-12-21, 21:38

projetdefleur wrote:はじめまして!私のなまえはイエンです。私のしゅっしんはグリーンスボロしです。グリーンスボロしはノロスケロライナしゅうにです.大学生です;にねん生です。私のせんこうはすうがくとげんごがくです。私のしゅみはテレビーゲエムとがいこくご。

There it is again... hopefully everything is fixed, and I used the kanji that I know. let me know if it's correct :)


All Japanese can understand your sentences, but there's still room to improve.


correct expression:
はじめまして!私の名前はイエンです。私のしゅっしんはグリーンスボロ市です。グリーンスボロ市はノースカロライナにあります。大学二年生です。私のせんこうはすうがくとげんごがくです。私のしゅみはテレビゲームとがいこくごです。


native expression:
はじめまして! 僕の名前はイエンです。アメリカのノースカロライナ州グリーンズボロ市出身の大学2年生です。専攻は数学と言語学で、趣味はテレビゲームと外国語の勉強です。

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Car
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Postby Car » 2004-12-22, 20:34

nietoperz wrote:I can recommend the series "Situational Functional Japanese", because the Japanese used in these books sounds quite natural, plus they don't start with the "this is a book"-crap. On the other hand, they are rather student-life-oriented, so some of the situations might not be usable for tourist situations... Another good book is "Japanese for everyone" which is more business/worklife-oriented, but also does a thorough introduction of the writing systems.


Are there other good books in English or German?
Please correct my mistakes!

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Rounin
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Postby Rounin » 2004-12-23, 0:10

Did I mention Genki I and II earlier? They're very good books, in English. A kanji book called "Kanji ABC" is available in both English and German.

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kei
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Kotoshimo yoroshikune.

Postby kei » 2005-01-10, 14:40

新年明けましておめでとうございます。 :partyhat:
遅くなってしまって・・・ちょっと恥ずかしいですが。 :oops:

ところで、皆さんの今年も抱負(ほうふ)は何ですか?
私は、勉強して少しでも英語が上達できればと思っています。
これを英語で書けるぐらいにね。 :wink:

日本語を勉強している皆さんの抱負(ほうふ)は、何ですか?

今年もよろしくお願いします。
いい年でありますように。

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Car
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Postby Car » 2005-01-10, 17:23

Sorry for the late reply.

Thanks for the recommendations Rounin, I'll have a look at them soon.
Please correct my mistakes!


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