Hey guys,
I’ve been in Helsinki for the last month and a half (didn’t want to wait until the summer so I picked up the worst month of the year ), which means I’ve been having time for everything else but studying Finnish
That’s why I haven’t responded to your replies (been gathering new questions instead), but I read them thoroughly a couple of times.
Virankannos, your explanation about breaking the word into syllables and thus knowing whether to use the weak or the strong grade now makes sense
Naava, I’ll have to go over your tips on phonetics again when I have time, so that we can discuss it further…
So far I’m trying to get a hold of the grammar and then I’ll have to start learning words…
Now there’s a paragraph in this “Finnish: An Essential Grammar” that puzzles me again. Here it goes:
“An adjective complement is also in the partitive when the subject is an infinitive or a subordinate clause, or when there is no subject.
On ilmeis/tä, että… (It is clear that…)
On parasta lähteä. (It is best to leave.)
Luennolla oli hauska/a. (It was nice at the lecture.)
With some adjectives both nominative and partitive are equally possible as complement cases; of then the nominative is better.
Minun on vaikea(a) tulla. (It is difficult for me to come.)
Oli hauska(a) tutustua. (It was nice to meet you.)
Ei ole helppo(a) päättää. (It is not easy to decide.)”
Now this is where it gets really confusing. All three of the examples in the last paragraph fall in the category of adjective complements followed by infinitive subjects. Didn’t the author just say that in this case the adjective complement is in the partitive? Then he says that “[w]ith some adjectives both nominative and partitive are (…) possible,” but “nominative is better.”
So, should I use nominative or partitive? And if I should use partitive, what was the point in the previous paragraph? Okay, and what about if the subject is a subordinate clause or if there’s no subject?
I also don’t quite understand the next paragraph:
“If the subject is plural, the adjective complement must also be in the plural (concord), and is usually in the partitive plural. But the nominative plural is often equally possible. This form [apparently he means the nominative] is obligatory if the subject is a plural invariable word or if the concept referred to by the subject is clearly of limited scope.
A plural adjective complement (…) is generally in the partitive, but it takes the nominative if the subject is an invariable plural or refers to a clearly limited concept.”
So he gives the following examples, where the adjective is in the partitive, but then says the nominative is also possible:
Oletteko ilois/ia? (Are you (pl.) glad?)
Omenat ovat tanskalais/ia. (The apples are Danish.)
Nämä kirjat ovat kalli/ita. (These books are expensive.)
Tulppaanit ovat punais/ia. (The tulips are red.)
He ovat miellyttäviä. (They are pleasant.)
Voileivät ovat hyviä. (The sandwiches are good.)
…and then the ones below, where he says the nominative is obligatory:
Jalat ovat likaiset.
Saappaat ovat pitkät.
Kasvot olivat valkoiset.
Sakset ovat terävät.
Housut ovat harmaat.
In the first group of examples, isn’t it more logical to say:
Tulppaanit ovat punaiset.
Omenat ovat tanskalaiset.
Nämä kirjat ovat kalliit.
Voileivät ovat hyvät.
…so that the adjective is in the same case as the substantive?
In “Oletteko iloisiä?” the partitive sounds fine to me, because there’s no subject, and with “He ovat miellyttäviä” I would rather think whether “he” is an indefinite amount of people (in which case I would use the partitive) or a given number of persons (e.g. five), in which case I would rather use the nominative. Am I wrong?
This “generally”-type of definition that the author uses throughout the book really confuses me. What is “generally?” Should I derive the conclusion that I should always prefer the partitive over the nominative for an adjective complement, except for the cases when the nominative is obligatory, or not really?