Difference between Serbo-Croatian č and ć?

[felix ahlner]

Yes, what's the difference between ć and č? I guess the difference is that ć is pronounced with the tounge tip closer to the teeth than in č. Is this true?

And is ć used a lot except for "-ić" names?

[duko]

Yes, ć is softer. Some none-speakers cannot hear the difference between those two, once 2 Serbian friends were discussing this matter and which word uses which sound, and the other were going nuts because they couldn't
understand that there is a difference they cannot hear. It was funny.

As far as I know "ić" is the typical ending of names.

[jururu]

Well, according to Croatian grammars

č = as in English Check
ć = as in British English palatalized pronunciation of tune

Serbian č can be close to German TCH. This pronunciation
can be found in Eastern Croatian as well (Vukovar for example).


Croatian ć can be close to semipalatalized t [t'] that can be found in some speakers of Brazilian Northeast (João Pessoa, Paraíba)...Many older speakers of Brazilian Portuguese may also have this pronunciation in tia, diferente, although their tch in tcheco, tchã is closer to č. Very soft ć is still found in Croatian Primorje & scattered parts of Istria, but is disappearing...

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In modern Croatian, bot ć and č have become a sound between these two, and are pronounced like Italian ciao, cinema, certo, but not like German tsch.


ć and č are no longer heard as different, although there may be a slight difference in articulation.

Due do small number of minimal pairs / spavačica (sleeping woman) / spavaćica (woman sleeping dress) / there have been some ideas of eliminating one of these letters since they are pronounced the same nowadays. (Some people still have this distinction...we may compare it with English in which some people still pronounce pairs which/witch, Wales/whales differently...)


The difference between č and ć is strongly maintained in orthography so people who mistakenly write č for ć or ć for č are frequently mocked at.

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The same is true of đ/dž.
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-ić is a deminutive suffix frequent in surnames, as someone has stated before

[jururu]

And is ć used a lot except for "-ić" names?

t changes to ć


cvijet /flower/
cvijeće /flowers/

biti /to be/
biće /being/



k changes to č

vuk /wolf/
vuče /hey, wolf!/



take a look at this

vući /irregular / (vuk+ti /regular some centuries ago/) to be pulling
vukao /regular/ pulled
vuci /irregular / pull!
vučem /irregular/ I am pulling


very complicated

[Mulder-21]

To me it seems, that these letters/sounds also exist in Slovak:

Serbo-Croatian - Slovak

č = č
ć = ť

Is this correct?

And Ð and dž difference look like Ð = [upside-down f] and dž = English j.

Is this correct?

[duko]

To me it seems, that these letters/sounds also exist in Slovak:
... ć = ť ...

Not at all, ć and ť are different sounds. t' palatalized t, and it doesn't need the apostroph if it precedes an 'e' or an 'i'.
Check these words:

Slovak - Serbian - English

t'ava - deva - camel (ok, deva is croatian)
Pit' - piti - to drink
t'ažko - teško - heavy

[Kubi]

In modern Croatian, bot ć and č have become a sound between these two, and are pronounced like Italian ciao, cinema, certo, but not like German tsch.

Hmm...which leads to the question of the difference between those two...

[Vlacko]

There is a difference between č and ć. (ч и ћ) Č is pronounced like German tch. And č is pronouced softer. In Serbian it ć is pronounced a little harder than in Croatian. Same for ć. Ć is prounanced like ciao in Italian.
For Ć you could say that is a letter which isn't used very much, e.g. like Z English.
But yes surnames are usually ending with -IĆ.

[Fenek]

To me it seems, that these letters/sounds also exist in Slovak:

Serbo-Croatian - Slovak

č = č
ć = ť

Is this correct?

And Ð and dž difference look like Ð = [upside-down f] and dž = English j.

Is this correct?

Well, in the standard pronunciation Slovak Ť ť is not the same sound as Ć ć. But I´ve heard a Slovak from Topoľčany who pronounced ť almost like ć . So maybe ť is pronouned like ć in some Slovak dialects? But not in standard Slovak for sure.

As far as I know, the ć and đ sounds exist in three Slavic languages: Serbocroatian, Polish and Lower Sorbian.

Serbian ć = Polish ć
Serbian đ = Polish dź

I can hear a small difference between Serbian ć and Polish ć. But my Serbian friend doesn't hear any difference nad it proves the difference is very small Precisely, the articulation is a bit different (Serbs touch teeths with their tongues, Poles don't).

I said "Serbian" rather than "Serbocroatian", because, as jururu said, many Croats pronounce something like Italian ciao instead of the "real" ć sound. I can confirm what jururu said, I heard that myself.

There are no IPA letters for Ć ć and Đ đ , because these sounds are affricates and IPA doesn't contain letters for affricates.

[Fenek]

Ć is prounanced like ciao in Italian.

I'd say that Italian ciao is somewhere between Serbian ć and č.

[Fenek]

BTW Please check the "Evolution of Scripts" topic. I posted a Croatian/Serbian-related question there.

[kibo]

As far as I know, the ć and đ sounds exist in three Slavic languages: Serbocroatian, Polish and Lower Sorbian.

Serbian ć = Polish ć
Serbian đ = Polish dź

Good to know that.

Precisely, the articulation is a bit different (Serbs touch teeths with their tongues, Poles don't).

Yes. Acording to one of my books, when pronouncing ć, "the tip of the tongue is on the inner side of the lower teeth".

There are no IPA letters for Ć ć and Đ đ , because these sounds are affricates and IPA doesn't contain letters for affricates.

Really? What are ʨ and ʥ then?

Personally my č and ć are very distinguishable. Which is not something I could say for certain speakers in different parts of Serbia, who substitute both sounds for č.

Often people don't know wheather a word has č or ć in it. (Though I have the impression that the confusion is bigger when it comes to đ and dž.) To those who don't differ them, words like ćepavčići mean a great difficulty.

There are several of minimal pairs, though i know exactly how many and if it'd be a large number.

posečen (cut) - posećen (visited)
veče (an evening) - veće (bigger)
kuče (a puppy) - kuće (houses)
čar (a charm) - ćar (a benefit, gain)

t changes to ć
k changes to č

and c can also change into č

stric (uncle) - stričevi (uncles)
zec (male rabbit) - zečica (female rabbit)

[Luís]

Really? What are ʨ and ʥ then?

This is Fenek being picky
What he means is that there is no separate IPA letter for these sounds. But of course you can represent them using 2 of them ( t + ɕ / d + ʑ) with a tie bar on top (which is supposed to be different from what you wrote i.e. without the tie bar). To represent an affricate using the IPA you always need 2 symbols. Not that it's a problem!

[Guest]

To me it seems, that these letters/sounds also exist in Slovak:

Serbo-Croatian - Slovak

č = č
ć = ť

Is this correct?

And Ð and dž difference look like Ð = [upside-down f] and dž = English j.

Is this correct?

Well, in the standard pronunciation Slovak Ť ť is not the same sound as Ć ć. But I´ve heard a Slovak from Topoľčany who pronounced ť almost like ć . So maybe ť is pronouned like ć in some Slovak dialects? But not in standard Slovak for sure.

As far as I know, the ć and đ sounds exist in three Slavic languages: Serbocroatian, Polish and Lower Sorbian.

Serbian ć = Polish ć
Serbian đ = Polish dź

I can hear a small difference between Serbian ć and Polish ć. But my Serbian friend doesn't hear any difference nad it proves the difference is very small Precisely, the articulation is a bit different (Serbs touch teeths with their tongues, Poles don't).

I said "Serbian" rather than "Serbocroatian", because, as jururu said, many Croats pronounce something like Italian ciao instead of the "real" ć sound. I can confirm what jururu said, I heard that myself.

There are no IPA letters for Ć ć and Đ đ , because these sounds are affricates and IPA doesn't contain letters for affricates.

there are IPA letters for Ć ć and Đ đ

See the name of Croatian scientist Mohorovičić in Longman Pronunciation Dictionary (J C Wells).

ć has a symbol close to ç but with different ,

[Maja]

There is a difference between č and ć. (ч и ћ) Č is pronounced like German tch. And č is pronouced softer. In Serbian it ć is pronounced a little harder than in Croatian. Same for ć. Ć is prounanced like ciao in Italian.

I would compare ć with Spanish ch which is really really soft comparing to our hard č.

And yes, yes, čevapčiči... do you want me to break my tongue by switching from ć to č and back?

An average Slovenian doesn't hear the difference between č and ć and has a big problem learning how to pronounce ć. Same goes with dž and đ.

[Fenek]

there are IPA letters for Ć ć and Đ đ

No, there are not
As Luís said, in the IPA these sounds are written with digraphs rather than with single letters.

[kibo]

Really? What are ʨ and ʥ then?

This is Fenek being picky
What he means is that there is no separate IPA letter for these sounds. But of course you can represent them using 2 of them ( t + ɕ / d + ʑ) with a tie bar on top (which is supposed to be different from what you wrote i.e. without the tie bar). To represent an affricate using the IPA you always need 2 symbols. Not that it's a problem!

OK, my mind somehow read that as "there's no possible way to express č and ć using the IPA characters"...

Yes, I've noticed that there's "a tie bar" on some sites, but I didn't and still don't know how to imput it... Didn't know there was a difference, though...

[T0MINH0]

č [tS]

ć [tç] (different ç is used in IPA)

[Saaropean]

ć [tç] (different ç is used in IPA)

Maybe ɕ? That's s\ in XSAMPA, an "alveolo-palatal fricative", thus somewhere between [ç]/[C] and [ʃ]/[S].

[eltigre]

Č is pronounced like german TSCH
Ć is pronounced like german TJ