Discussion Group for General Hebrew Questions

księżycowy
Re: Discussion Group for General Hebrew Questions

Postby księżycowy » 2017-06-06, 19:38

Excellent.

I admit I was a little skeptical about it's usefulness as a self-study book, but their companion website has a ton of helpful stuff, including answer keys! Apparently even translations to the exercise instructions can be found there. All of this is a huge plus.

if you had to approximate the level the textbook gets you too on the CEFR scale, what would it be? A2? B1?

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Re: Discussion Group for General Hebrew Questions

Postby Lemanensis » 2017-06-20, 20:59

księżycowy wrote:if you had to approximate the level the textbook gets you too on the CEFR scale, what would it be? A2? B1?


I don't know what the requirements are for the CEFR scale, in terms of actual grammar and number of words of vocabulary. I think I calculated that Routledge was about 1200 to 1500 words (depending on what you include), and that isn't so very much. It still leaves you with lots of gap, and though the grammar goes quite far, it's a long way from being complete.
Martin
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księżycowy

Re: Discussion Group for General Hebrew Questions

Postby księżycowy » 2017-06-20, 21:03

Would you describe it as getting you to an "intermediate" understanding of the language then? It seems so from what you've said there.

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Re: Discussion Group for General Hebrew Questions

Postby Lemanensis » 2017-06-21, 16:26

księżycowy wrote:Would you describe it as getting you to an "intermediate" understanding of the language then? It seems so from what you've said there.


Yes.
Actually when I was in Haifa U for the intensive ulpan there was one of the author's students in my class and who had only studied with that book. Now, I have to say that she didn't appear to be a born linguist. However, she did have a solid grounding that enabled her to join the class. The range in the class was about 3 different levels and I would say that the lowest level was dalet, but even within dalet you get quite a large range.
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księżycowy

Re: Discussion Group for General Hebrew Questions

Postby księżycowy » 2017-06-21, 16:43

I can safely say I have no knowledge of the different levels in the ulpan system of Israel (dalet or otherwise), and what that equates to in other level systems. But I think I understand enough from what you're said.

Thanks! :D I think I'll be using this book for my studies in Modern Hebrew. Once I get a good foundation in Biblical that is.

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Re: Discussion Group for General Hebrew Questions

Postby Lemanensis » 2017-06-21, 22:01

księżycowy wrote:I can safely say I have no knowledge of the different levels in the ulpan system of Israel (dalet or otherwise), and what that equates to in other level systems. But I think I understand enough from what you're said.

Thanks! :D I think I'll be using this book for my studies in Modern Hebrew. Once I get a good foundation in Biblical that is.


The system goes from Aleph to Vav, though perhaps in uneven steps. Vav meaning high fluency.

Certainly Routledge is as good as any, and better than most, I would say.
Martin
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księżycowy

Re: Discussion Group for General Hebrew Questions

Postby księżycowy » 2017-06-21, 23:06

Definately seems like it would give me a damn good start at the least. :wink:

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Re: Discussion Group for General Hebrew Questions

Postby HoneyBuzzard » 2017-07-09, 3:27

Proverbs 11:31
הֵ֣ן צַ֭דִּיק בָּאָ֣רֶץ יְשֻׁלָּ֑ם אַ֝֗ף כִּֽי־רָשָׁ֥ע וְחוֹטֵֽא׃


יְשֻׁלָּם is pual imperfect 3. masc sg., but why is the vowel in the second syllable qāmeṣ? Is it because the corresponding (stative) qal has sērê, שָׁלֵם? Or is it because the word carries eṯnaḥtā (i.e., it's in pause)?

I thought it was because of eṯnaḥtā, but then I saw הִטַּמָּא (qal טָמֵא), which seems to show the same thing. Of course here it could be due to the aleph.

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Re: Discussion Group for General Hebrew Questions

Postby Drink » 2017-07-09, 15:20

HoneyBuzzard wrote:Proverbs 11:31
הֵ֣ן צַ֭דִּיק בָּאָ֣רֶץ יְשֻׁלָּ֑ם אַ֝֗ף כִּֽי־רָשָׁ֥ע וְחוֹטֵֽא׃


יְשֻׁלָּם is pual imperfect 3. masc sg., but why is the vowel in the second syllable qāmeṣ? Is it because the corresponding (stative) qal has sērê, שָׁלֵם? Or is it because the word carries eṯnaḥtā (i.e., it's in pause)?

I thought it was because of eṯnaḥtā, but then I saw הִטַּמָּא (qal טָמֵא), which seems to show the same thing. Of course here it could be due to the aleph.


It is because it is in pausal position. And in הטמא it's because of the א.
שתה וגם גמליך אשקה

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Re: Discussion Group for General Hebrew Questions

Postby HoneyBuzzard » 2017-07-11, 9:37

That makes sense. Thank you.

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English words in Hebrew

Postby caleteu » 2017-09-07, 11:43

So how are you supposed to figure out what a word like אנדרדוג means??? :hmm: Fortunately Lexilogos knew.
If it hat been אונדרדוג I might have been able to figure it out.
yours, clt

IpseDixit

Re: English words in Hebrew

Postby IpseDixit » 2017-09-07, 12:07

caleteu wrote:If it hat been אונדרדוג I might have been able to figure it out.


This is a conceptual mistake IMO. Hebrew transliterations are based on the pronunciation of words, not on the orthography.

Probably you thought that since "underdog" begins with <u> then it had to be או in Hebrew, but the first phoneme of "underdog" is [ʌ] which is perceived to be closer to [a] rather than [u] or [ɔ]. Hence why the single alef without vav.

אונדרדוג would be pronounced as "onderdog" or "oonderdog".

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Re: English words in Hebrew

Postby Lemanensis » 2017-09-21, 19:00

caleteu wrote:So how are you supposed to figure out what a word like אנדרדוג means??? :hmm: Fortunately Lexilogos knew.
If it hat been אונדרדוג I might have been able to figure it out.
yours, clt


Thing is, with words like this, the consonants are all wrong (too many, no pattern) for this to be a Hebrew word. So the standard rule of aleph being A, and vav being O or U applies. Even if you put A in everywhere there's no vav it would still be understandable with a bit of imagination.
Martin
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Directions preposition מן

Postby caleteu » 2017-10-25, 13:06

What is the difference between לפני and מלפני? What would be the difference between לפני הגן and מלפני הגן? According to the exercise they aren't the same, but the book doesn't explain the difference

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Re: Discussion Group for General Hebrew Questions

Postby Luís » 2017-11-02, 21:49

1. What is the common word for "Poland" in Hebrew? Assimil uses פולניה for some reason, but I get the impression פולין is far more common.

2. What is the exact meaning of דיבורים? Blabber? Or can it simply mean "a conversation".

3. What is the more common word for "laptop"? מחשב נישא or מחשב נייד?
Quot linguas calles, tot homines vales

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Help would be appreciated!

Postby sahartov » 2017-11-09, 7:04

Hi!

I'm very much in love with an amazing guy from Israel, he's currently traveling so we can't be together. However Im starting to learn Hebrew for him and I want to send him a voice message to show him that I like him and that I will make an effort. Anyone willing to help me? As I want to send a spoken message I would really have to know how to pronounce the sentences so any way of exchanging spoken messages would be great!

P.S. I'm new here but very excited to be more involved. I'm 24 and from the Netherlands

Thank You!

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Re: Discussion Group for General Hebrew Questions

Postby Lemanensis » 2017-11-10, 12:43

Luís wrote:1. What is the common word for "Poland" in Hebrew? Assimil uses פולניה for some reason, but I get the impression פולין is far more common.

2. What is the exact meaning of דיבורים? Blabber? Or can it simply mean "a conversation".

3. What is the more common word for "laptop"? מחשב נישא or מחשב נייד?


As you haven't had any other answer, here are my impressions

1. פולין
2. talks. blabber would be closer to פטפוט
3. מחשב נייד might be slightly ahead in the race, though most people would probably even say לפטופ
Martin
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Re: Discussion Group for General Hebrew Questions

Postby Luís » 2017-11-11, 15:42

:) !תודה

I've been going through Assimil Hebrew and I'm coming across things such as שיעור שש עשרה. Considering שיעור is a masculine noun, shouldn't it be שיעור שישה עשר? :hmm:
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Re: Discussion Group for General Hebrew Questions

Postby Baldanders » 2017-11-11, 22:33

Luís wrote::) !תודה

I've been going through Assimil Hebrew and I'm coming across things such as שיעור שש עשרה. Considering שיעור is a masculine noun, shouldn't it be שיעור שישה עשר? :hmm:


It's a nominal number, which always take the feminine form.
I'd only consider it a mistake of consistency if they used ordinal numbers in previous chapters.

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Re: Discussion Group for General Hebrew Questions

Postby Baldanders » 2017-11-11, 22:38

Lemanensis wrote:As you haven't had any other answer, here are my impressions

1. פולין
2. talks. blabber would be closer to פטפוט
3. מחשב נייד might be slightly ahead in the race, though most people would probably even say לפטופ


All correct, except I'd say מחשב נייד is at least as common as לפטופ (probably more common), and מחשב נישא hardly ever sees use, certainly not in speech.


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