ahmed_crow wrote:The pronunction of "g" in classical arabic can be soft "j" like j in "jaguar", but the other one is hard like g in "college"
linguoboy wrote:These two words have exactly the same 'j' sound in every native variety of English I'm familiar with, i.e. [ʤ] ("'j' as in 'judge'"). If I heard this word with [ʒ] ("'s' as in 'measure'"), I would assume I was dealing with a hyperforeignism.
cHr0mChIk wrote:ahmed_crow wrote:The holy quran is highest Classical Arabic, there's no "s as in measure" pronunction in it, it's all like j or g in "judge".
The Holy Qur'an is a text. Also, it's 14 centuries old. The letter could've been pronounced any way, we don't know, so it's not much of an argument.
However, yes, an argument could be that Tajweed, indeed is something which is learned and passed from generation to generation and that, based on that, it's pronunciation is accurate. But, even so, the language constantly changes and evolves, and not even that is a solid proof of the correct pronunciation of ج.
Even, so, we do have something on which we can rely, which shows us the pronunciation of Classical Arabic letters, and that is the 8th century book "الكتاب" (Al-Kitab) by Sibawayh, which says:
"وبين وسط الحنك األعلى مخرج الجيم والشين والياء"
From between the tongue and the palate are the sounds of geem, sheen, and ya'.
Sibawayh pairs ج with ش and ي by the places of articulation, and by his description, they can be realized as /ɟ/, /ɕ/, and /j/.
So, there you have it. The Classical Arabic pronunciation of ج was as a "voiced palatal plosive" /ɟ/, the way it's pronounced in Sudanese Arabic.
cHr0mChIk wrote:ahmed_crow wrote:Quran is a text, yes, but it's not a normal text in Arabic language, for example gospels have writers, and gospels are not necessary to be the highest level in langauge that they were written in it, but Quran has no writers, God said it all, said all words and structers inside it, it's the highest level in the arabic language, so many native Arabs and I'm one of them are making the Quran to be the standard source of Arabic language.
Sure, Akhi. I have no problem with what you say - what I said is not related to this, what I said is related to the pronunciation only.
Yes, the Qur'an-i-Kareem is as it is from it's earliest times until today - we know, because we have manuscripts to prove it. And there's no problem with the "written" part of it. But the exact pronunciation of the Qur'an, and each 7arf we don't know for sure... the only thing which we could consult regarding this are some books of those times which deal with this subject exactly... like Sibawayh's al-Kitab.
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