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E}{pugnator
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Postby E}{pugnator » 2003-04-30, 19:23

Sorry for not having relied lately, i'm still trying to find a more effective way for us to memorize the characters.

Don't know if I'm saying it again, but I want to find some international words that look the same in Georgian and English for the transcription exercises...I've mailed the guy that made the Unilang's Basic georgian Wordlist, but got no reply yet. Perhaps he hasn't received my e-mail...I think I will try it mylsef.

Anyways, I want you to visit his page. It has some nice resources and an English-georgian dictionary...Perhaps u find some words that sound similar in both languages and can be used for the exercises 8)

http://sisauri.tripod.com/files/index.html
Learning Georgian, Mandarin Chinese, Russian and Papiamentu from scratch. Trying to brush up my Norwegian up to an advanced level.

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Postby Guest » 2003-05-06, 20:00

Hello all,

I need feedback again...You still following this thread?

I have a lot of things to post, I even have a message already written, I even got some words for transcription exercises, but for technical reasons I couldn't be able to copy it and post it here.

Gonna give you an interesting work: I want you to compare the Georgian alphabet with the Greek one, specially the letters' order (the georgian alphabet is accepted as to have being derived from the Greek one) and tell me: which are the "normal" letters in georgian , the ones Georgians usually employ when transcribing foreign/western words?! The ejective or the aspirated ones?! (Of course this question is appliable only for letters whice come in ejective/aspirated pairs, like t, ts, ch etc.).

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Postby leppie » 2003-05-07, 8:22

Anonymous wrote:Hello all,

I need feedback again...You still following this thread?


Yeeees.


Gonna give you an interesting work: I want you to compare the Georgian alphabet
with the Greek one, specially the letters' order (the georgian alphabet is accepted
as to have being derived from the Greek one) and tell me: which are the
"normal" letters in georgian , the ones Georgians usually employ when
transcribing foreign/western words
?! The ejective or the aspirated ones?!
(Of course this question is appliable only for letters whice come in ejective/aspirated
pairs, like t, ts, ch etc.).


mh...
...
mh...
I'll be back soon!
Se il drago rifiuta di combattere,
forse è solo pigro.
Ma se ignora la zanzara,
allora è davvero addormentato.

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Postby leppie » 2003-05-08, 8:42

E}{pugnator wrote:

Don't know if I'm saying it again, but I want to find some international words that look the same in Georgian and English for the transcription exercises..


I've Found some. I'm not going to give the translations! :twisted:

I hope they're right (in particular wowels)...
I've done the work yesterday night, almost sleeping.

ავტორი
ავტორიტეტი
კინო
ევროპა
ევროპიალი
ირონია
იტალია
კრიმლინ
ლილიპუტო
ლიონო
ლიტუა
ლივერპული
მაკარონი
მარტო
პაკეტი
პარალილი
პარლამენი
ფატრიოტი
პოეტი
ტოკიო
ვულკანი
Se il drago rifiuta di combattere,
forse è solo pigro.
Ma se ignora la zanzara,
allora è davvero addormentato.

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Postby leppie » 2003-05-08, 8:46

There're a lot more, once we know s, d and g

I haven't found any with
ყ, წ or ჭ
besides this i've often seen the cluster: წყ...
looks strange!
Se il drago rifiuta di combattere,
forse è solo pigro.
Ma se ignora la zanzara,
allora è davvero addormentato.

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Postby leppie » 2003-05-14, 13:12

the fourth from bottom is
პატრიოტი not,
ფატრიოტი
Se il drago rifiuta di combattere,
forse è solo pigro.
Ma se ignora la zanzara,
allora è davvero addormentato.

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Postby Car » 2003-05-14, 14:14

leppie, could you use a bigger size?

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Postby leppie » 2003-05-14, 14:18

Yes:

I've Found some. I'm not going to give the translations! :twisted:

I hope they're right (in particular wowels)...
I've done the work yesterday night, almost sleeping.


ავტორი --- ავტორიტეტი --- კინო --- ევროპა --- ევროპიალი

ირონია --- იტალია --- კრიმლინ --- ლილიპუტო --- ლიონო

ლიტუა --- ლივერპული --- მაკარონი --- მარტო --- პაკეტი

პარალილი --- პარლამენი --- პატრიოტი --- პოეტი --- ტოკიო

ვულკანი
Se il drago rifiuta di combattere,
forse è solo pigro.
Ma se ignora la zanzara,
allora è davvero addormentato.

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Postby E}{pugnator » 2003-05-15, 20:26

Hi Leppie,

This is what I could trnasliterate (sorry for the mistranslations
and for the translations in different languages...)

avt'ori (author)
avt'orit'et' (authority)
k'ino (cinema)
evrop'i (Europe)
evrop'iali (european?)
ironia (irony)
it'alia (italy)
k'rimlin (Kremlin)
lilip'ut'o (liliput) (?)
lioni (Lyon, lion?)
lit'ua (?)
liverp'uli (Liverpool)
mak'aroni (macarroni)
mart'o (Mars?)
p'ak'et'i (packet?)
p'aralili (parallel?)
p'arlameni (parliament?)
p#at'riot'i (patriot)
p'oet'i (poeta)
t'ok'io (Tokio)
vulk'ani (volcano)

I'm using ' after the ejective consonants and # after the aspirated
consonants (I was going to say this in the messages I wanted to post
since some days ago...
Learning Georgian, Mandarin Chinese, Russian and Papiamentu from scratch. Trying to brush up my Norwegian up to an advanced level.

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Postby leppie » 2003-05-19, 9:41

Right, Exp.

avt'ori (author)
avt'orit'et' (authority)
k'ino (cinema)
evrop'i (Europe)
evrop'iali (european?)
ironia (irony)
it'alia (italy)
k'rimlin (Kremlin)
lilip'ut'o (liliput) (Yes)
lioni (Lyon, lion? ) lion
lit'ua (?) Lituania
liverp'uli (Liverpool)
mak'aroni (macarroni)
mart'o (Mars?) No, March (the month)
p'ak'et'i (packet?) yes
p'aralili (parallel?) yes
p'arlameni (parliament?) yes
p#at'riot'i (patriot) this was: პატრიოტი, p'atrioti, I made a mistake.
p'oet'i (poeta)
t'ok'io (Tokio)
vulk'ani (volcano)

I didn't use aspirated... Just the letters we've learned so far...
Se il drago rifiuta di combattere,
forse è solo pigro.
Ma se ignora la zanzara,
allora è davvero addormentato.

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Postby E}{pugnator » 2003-05-19, 18:53

Now I hopeI can finally post my messages...

Hello, friends

I've found a few more words which have western western roots and I want you to figure out their meaning.


n. ეკლესა
n. კოსტუმი
n. გაზეთი
n. ჟურნალი
n. კლასი
n. ლამპა
n. ტრგედია
(verb root) ანალიზ


Tell me if it displayed properly.
Learning Georgian, Mandarin Chinese, Russian and Papiamentu from scratch. Trying to brush up my Norwegian up to an advanced level.

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Postby E}{pugnator » 2003-05-19, 19:07

Now we know what ejective and aspirated consonants are I'd like to post the alphabet again. The second row has the transcription system we are going to use here. which doesn t contain special IPA characters and therefore is easier to use; the third row has the IPA characters I found.

ა ბ გ დ ე ვ ზ თ ი კ ლ
a b g d e v z t# i k' l
[a] [b] [g] [d] [ɛ] [v] [z] [tʰ] [i] [kʼ] [l]

მ ნ ო პ ჟ რ ს ტ უ ფ ქ
m n o p' zh r s t' u p# k#
[m] [n] [o] [pʼ] [ʒ] [r] [s] [tʼ] [u] [pʰ] [kʰ]

ღ ყ შ ჩ ც ძ წ ჭ ხ ჯ ჰ
gh q' sh ch# ts# dz ts' ch' kh j h
[ɣ] [qʼ] [ʃ] [ʧʰ] [ʦʰ] [ʣ] [ʦʼ] [ʧʼ] [x] [ʤ] [h]

(if the rows don't fit exactly, just associate the first letter of the first row with the first one of the second row and so on...)
Learning Georgian, Mandarin Chinese, Russian and Papiamentu from scratch. Trying to brush up my Norwegian up to an advanced level.

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Postby Car » 2003-05-23, 16:33


n. ეკლესა

ek'lesa (Maybe iglesia= church?)

n. კოსტუმი

k'ost'umi (costume?)

n. გაზეთი

bazet#i (???)

n. ჟურნალი

zhurnali (journal)

n. კლასი

p'lasi (place)

n. ლამპა

lamp'a (lamp)

n. ტრგედია

t'lbedia ???

(verb root) ანალიზ


analiz (analyse)

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Postby E}{pugnator » 2003-05-23, 16:39

Omg

Sorry, Car, I might have pasted some words wrongly. Should be "eklesia", not "eklesa". Gonna retype these and paste here again...zhurnali and lampa are rigt, as for the others I can't tell if it was my fault or yours, 'coz I can't see the Georgian characters here at this computer ;)
Learning Georgian, Mandarin Chinese, Russian and Papiamentu from scratch. Trying to brush up my Norwegian up to an advanced level.

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Postby leppie » 2003-05-23, 21:14

I'm learning new letters row by row... so here a list of words made up of
vowels, already learnt consonants (m n v l r ) and b g d z....
and no ejectives...


არაბი --- აზია --- ბერლინი --- ბამბაზია ---
ბულგარელი --- დოლარი --- ენერგიული ---
გაზი --- გერმანელი --- გერმანია --- უნგრელი ---
იდეოლოგია --- იდიომი --- ირლანდია --- ირონია ---
იანვარი --- ლეგენდა --- ლიმონი --- მარგარინი ---
მედალი --- ნერვი --- ნორვეგია --- ორგანიზმი --- რადიო ---
რომი --- ვანილი --- ვაზა --- ვიოლინო -- ზოოლოგია ---
Se il drago rifiuta di combattere,
forse è solo pigro.
Ma se ignora la zanzara,
allora è davvero addormentato.

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Postby Car » 2003-05-24, 9:43


არაბი --- აზია --- ბერლინი --- ბამბაზია ---


arabi (Arabic) --- azia (Asia) --- berlini (Berlin) --- bambazia (???)


ბულგარელი --- დოლარი --- ენერგიული ---


bulgareli (Bulgaria) --- doliri (???) --- energiuli (energy?)

გაზი --- გერმანელი --- გერმანია --- უნგრელი ---

gazi (gas) --- germaneli (German) --- germania (Germany) --- ungreli (Hungarian)

იდეოლოგია --- იდიომი --- ირლანდია --- ირონია ---

ideologia (ideology) --- idiogi (???) --- irlandia (Ireland) --- ironia (irony)

იანვარი --- ლეგენდა --- ლიმონი --- მარგარინი ---

ianvari (January) --- legenda (legend) --- limoni (lemon) --- margarini (margarine)

მედალი --- ნერვი --- ნორვეგია --- ორგანიზმი --- რადიო ---

medali (medal) --- nervi (nerves) --- norvegia (Norway) --- organizmi (organism) --- radio (radio)

რომი --- ვანილი --- ვაზა --- ვიოლინო -- ზოოლოგია ---


roma (Rome) --- vanili (vanilla) --- vaza (vase) --- violino (violin) --- zoologia (zoo)

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Postby leppie » 2003-05-24, 10:50

Du bist sehr fleißig, Car!
dolari is dollars (I don't know if it's their currency)
and
იდიომი is idiomi, Idiom....
energy is right.
Se il drago rifiuta di combattere,
forse è solo pigro.
Ma se ignora la zanzara,
allora è davvero addormentato.

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Postby Car » 2003-05-24, 11:39

leppie wrote:Du bist sehr fleißig, Car!
dolari is dollars (I don't know if it's their currency)
and
იდიომი is idiomi, Idiom....
energy is right.


Ah, no I see why I couldn't translate them, I simply misstranscribed them... Anyway, I think it's a very good idea and it definitely helps me to get to know the Georgian letters.

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Postby E}{pugnator » 2003-05-26, 17:00

Here I am, trying to type readable messages again...

But now I am smarter...I've also uploaded all messages to the Unilang's courses' server so that you can view them well at your browser (don't forget to switch to Unicode in case it doesn't display well). So, if you just think it looks too bad at the forum, go to

http://www.unilang.org/courses/georgian/Geo2602a.htm
http://www.unilang.org/courses/georgian/Geo2602b.htm
http://www.unilang.org/courses/georgian/Geo2602c.htm
http://www.unilang.org/courses/georgian/Geo2602d.htm

(Don't forget to switch to Unicode, as I think I forgot to add the HTML tag to do it automatically).

Well, these are exactly the messages that are being posted here from now on:

Hi Car,

I'm retyping some words. Apparently, only two words were typed wrongly: ek'lesia (the "i" was missing") and "tragedia" (first "a" was missing). You might have confused some letters.

ეკლესია
გაზეთი
ჟურნალი
კლასი
ტრიგედია


Now I'm gonna show up some letters that are usually confused. Hope this helps us not to do this anymore. Most times the letters look close but have different settings at the line: One goes fairly above and the other goes fairly under the line. This happens with b and g. Lemme first type the whole alphabet once again, so that we have means of looking and comparing:

აბგდევზთიკლმნოპჟრსტუფქღყშჩცწჭხძჯჰ

Now, we have

b and dz
e, k' and v, but p' and h
zh and u
n and ts', but sh .
Learning Georgian, Mandarin Chinese, Russian and Papiamentu from scratch. Trying to brush up my Norwegian up to an advanced level.

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Postby E}{pugnator » 2003-05-26, 17:02

STRESS (from Irina's translations)
In Georgian not only separate words are stressed but also more or less stable phrases if pronounced without a semantic accentuation of one of their components

The first syllable (of a word or a stable phrase) is always stressed, the second is always unstressed. The third syllable is stressed if followed by one or more syllables, otherwise it is also unstressed. The forth syllable is always unstressed. The fifth syllable is stressed if followed by one or more syllables, otherwise it is also unstressed, etc. Thus, in each pair of syllables (starting with the first one) the first syllable is stressed, the second is unstressed, but if the number of syllables is odd - the last syllable is unstressed.


There are many examples for practicing stress at the Russian textbook, but I think it's time to actually face the grammar and leave alphabet and pronunciation for a while, because only when we start making short sentences we'll feel like we're learning something.
Learning Georgian, Mandarin Chinese, Russian and Papiamentu from scratch. Trying to brush up my Norwegian up to an advanced level.


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