Need help for Translation from English to old Futhark

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Thierdolbach
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Need help for Translation from English to old Futhark

Postby Thierdolbach » 2017-12-05, 0:54

Aye

I'm gonna set a tattoo soon and was wondering how "Sacrifice to Thor" would be in old Futhark. I tried searching around the web and piecing it together but, as I have no prior experience with the language, I was unable to find any (correct) information.

Therefore I was wondering if you guys could possibly help me?

I already thank you guys for at least taking the time to read the post.

Terence Black

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linguoboy
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Re: Need help for Translation from English to old Futhark

Postby linguoboy » 2017-12-05, 3:57

Thierdolbach wrote:I'm gonna set a tattoo soon and was wondering how "Sacrifice to Thor" would be in old Futhark. I tried searching around the web and piecing it together but, as I have no prior experience with the language, I was unable to find any (correct) information.

"Old Futhark" is a script. It's not a language of its own. You would still have to decide what language you want the phrase translated into.
"Richmond is a real scholar; Owen just learns languages because he can't bear not to know what other people are saying."--Margaret Lattimore on her two sons

Eril
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Re: Need help for Translation from English to old Futhark

Postby Eril » 2017-12-05, 12:52

The elder Futhark was used until about 800 CE I think, so that would include Germanic, its successors West, East and North Germanic, and those successors/sub-languages Old High German, Old English, Old Saxon, Old Frisian, Gothic and Proto Old Norse, among others. Not sure if in all those languages runes are preserved, though.

Or do you mean just a transliteration of the Latin letters into Elder Futhark letters? That wouldn't be too difficult. Considering that the Germanic languages in runes were spelt quite similar to how they were pronounced (unlike modern English), I'd suggest ᛊᛖᚲᚱᛁᚠᚨᛁᛊ ᛏᚢ ᚦᛟᚱ but no guarantee that I made no mistakes.

Thierdolbach
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Re: Need help for Translation from English to old Futhark

Postby Thierdolbach » 2017-12-06, 20:19

Aye

Linguoboy, as you can see I have no knowledge about the subject hahaha.

Eril, To be honest I am not sure myself, but a translation from the Latin letters to the Elder Futhark letters would work for sure. At least I'll be able to somehow understand it, and identify the different letters.

Thanks for both answers guys!

Terence Black

Eril
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Re: Need help for Translation from English to old Futhark

Postby Eril » 2017-12-06, 20:55

You're welcome.

Well, it's your decision and all, but if I were to get such a tattoo I'd spend a bit time studying the culture in question (including its languages) beforehand.

Especially if its done for spiritual reasons or similar (as one might suspect considering the text you want tattooed).

A letter-by-letter transliteration wouldn't really work as there is no "c" in runes (well, one could use the k-rune instead), and also it would be pretty strange, imo, that's why I personally would prefer the transliteration by pronunciation I posted above.
But best would of course be an actual translation - just, into which language?

It would be helpful to know more about your reasons for this tattoo.

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linguoboy
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Re: Need help for Translation from English to old Futhark

Postby linguoboy » 2017-12-06, 21:05

If I had to guess at an early Proto-Norse version, I might go with blōtą Þunrē, which differs from the Proto-Germanic version only in the last vowel (i.e. *ē rather than *ai). I'm especially unsure about the correct form of "Thor" (Proto-Germanic *Þunraz), since at some point the /n/ was assimilated and the vowel lengthened (i.e. Þūrē), which apparently existed side-by-side with analogical Þōrē. The final vowel had changed to i by the beginning of Old Norse and was later dropped completely. So there are a lot of possible variations depending on exactly what period you're aiming for.

In any case, the Old Futhark form of this would be ᛒᛚᛟᛏᚨ ᚦᚢᚾᚱᛖ. Do with that whatever you will.
"Richmond is a real scholar; Owen just learns languages because he can't bear not to know what other people are saying."--Margaret Lattimore on her two sons

Eril
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Re: Need help for Translation from English to old Futhark

Postby Eril » 2017-12-06, 21:11

Aren't nasals before other consonants often dropped in runes anyway? I thought I had read something like that, but I might be mistaken. Not sure whether it also applies before liquids like the r here anyway, though.

I'd have used the same words as you - but I can't really help with the inflection and exact spelling, my personal focus is more on later Old Norse and OHG/MHG.

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linguoboy
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Re: Need help for Translation from English to old Futhark

Postby linguoboy » 2017-12-06, 22:18

Eril wrote:I'd have used the same words as you - but I can't really help with the inflection and exact spelling, my personal focus is more on later Old Norse and OHG/MHG.

Yeah, that's more my focus, too, so I feel like I'm groping in the dark here. I thought there might be examples of the dative of *Þunraʀ in the extent Proto-Norse corpus to settle the question, but a cursory search hasn't turned any up.
"Richmond is a real scholar; Owen just learns languages because he can't bear not to know what other people are saying."--Margaret Lattimore on her two sons


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