Hungarian and Sumerian?

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Parasztember
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Re:

Postby Parasztember » 2012-05-22, 9:55

Kuba wrote:
renata wrote:Sumerian is related to Hungarian, please, acknowledge the truth dear Levo. You are a descent of Ur-Nammu, and there is no way you can deny it.

Of course! Don't you see the similarity between the Great Zikkurat of Ur and Buda Castle???


Not necessary to deal linguistics, and there are exclude any speculations, but many old sumerian city name have directly meaning in hungarian. I've never been nationalist, but it has been suspicious since my childhood.
Some example:

UR - hungarian- ÚR (mean Lord)
URUK hungarian URUK( Their Lord, ---plural, possesive)
KIS- Hungarian KIS (Little)
MARAD Hungarian MARAD (Stay)
HATRA Hungarian HÁTRA (Rearwards)
KUT Hungarian KÚT (Well "pump")
KUTHA Hungarian KUTYA (Dog)
LAGAS Hungarian LAKÁS (Apartment)
DēR- Hungarian DÉR (Frost)
NIMRUD Hungarian NIMRÓD (Hungarian male name)
ZABALA Hungarian ZABOLA (Village name in Transylvania) and ZABLA (Snaffle)
ARAD Hungarian ARAD (City name in Transylvania)
KES Hungarian KÉS (Knife, other meaning Delay)

And more
ASSUR- Hungarian AZ ÚR (The Lord)
ERIDU Hungarian ERŐD (Fortress)
NIPPUR (NÉP ÚR (People's Lord)

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Re: Re:

Postby Karavinka » 2012-05-22, 11:33

Parasztember wrote:UR - hungarian- ÚR (mean Lord)
URUK hungarian URUK( Their Lord, ---plural, possesive)
KIS- Hungarian KIS (Little)
MARAD Hungarian MARAD (Stay)
HATRA Hungarian HÁTRA (Rearwards)
KUT Hungarian KÚT (Well "pump")
KUTHA Hungarian KUTYA (Dog)
LAGAS Hungarian LAKÁS (Apartment)
DēR- Hungarian DÉR (Frost)
NIMRUD Hungarian NIMRÓD (Hungarian male name)
ZABALA Hungarian ZABOLA (Village name in Transylvania) and ZABLA (Snaffle)
ARAD Hungarian ARAD (City name in Transylvania)
KES Hungarian KÉS (Knife, other meaning Delay)

And more
ASSUR- Hungarian AZ ÚR (The Lord)
ERIDU Hungarian ERŐD (Fortress)
NIPPUR (NÉP ÚR (People's Lord)


Some of these city names in Sumerian are better known now than before. I'm not a Sumerologist, and my knowledge of Sumerian isn't particularly awesome, but anyways, here are just a few examples that come to my mind.

Just in case you're not familiar, the Sumerian "spellings" are always in capital letters, and they're not meant to be pronounced that way. Actually, they're like "pointers" to an actual sign, so, the transliterations like "ŠEŠ" or "KI" are like replacements to the actual signs, not phonetic renditions. (I wish I could use the signs here, but somehow I can't...the forum gives me an error)

UR : Sumerian "Urim." (Our name "Ur" comes from Akkadian, "Uru") In cuneiform, the city's name is spelt as : ŠEŠ.ABgunu.KI. The sign ABgunu is also used for the city Uruk, the name of which is increasingly replaced with a more historically probable "Unug." Electronic Pennsylvania Sumerian Dictionary (henceforth ePSD) gives different words for the sign, some of which include: erim5 "storeroom", iri11 "city", unu "dwelling." The Sumerian word for "lord" is usually en, ensi or lugal : the connection with the Hungarian is unlikely, since the Sumerian word probably reflects something about settlement.

URUK : Again, the Sumerian name is better reconstructed as "Unug" as the name "Uruk" is the Akkadian version of the name. Unug is written with ABgunu, there's no need to repeat.

KISH : Sumerian "Kish", written as KIŠ.KI. ePSD lists "KIŠ" as "totality," which sounds like a total opposite of "little."

LAGASH : Sumerian "Lagash," written as NU11.BUR.LA.KI If you think that doesn't have anything to do with the phonetics, you're correct. Based on the Akkadian glosses in the ancient wordlists, the meaning of the word "Lagash" is given as "storehouse" in ePSD.

NIPPUR : Sumerian "Nibru," written logographically as EN.LIL.KI, literally "Enlil City." ePSD doesn't answer what "Nibru" means, and the spelling has nothing to do with the sound. Our name Nippur comes from Akkadian "Nibbur", so the connection with the Hungarian seems to be broken already, unless you want an alternative cognate for "Nibru" as well...

ERIDU : Sumerian "Eridu", written as NUN.KI. The NUN sign can be read "Eridu", and ePSD translates it as "guidance" based on the Akkadian gosses.

That's just a few. If you want to dig up false cognates, you can probably do way more, but ultimately it's fruitless.
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Re: Hungarian and Sumerian?

Postby Parasztember » 2012-05-22, 15:32

Oh, use of yours kind of method, the accadian is more familiar with hungarian, unlike the sumerian is. It's possible. :)
But some thing is worth to consider. The ancient sumerian society was a semi-primitive slave-holder, and absolutistic commune. The first civilisation. More than probable, there weren't more sophisticated language, than the accadian was. But according to yours kind of method, the sumerian words is more complex, than accadian, so the sumerian was the more sophisticated language, not the the accadian. It's nonsense.
My examples suggest, that the sumerian include basic etimons only, that relate to hungarian, and these ethimons are simple words, not cisellated expressions.

Some sumerian ethimon, which have meaning in hungarian:

EN- Hungarian ÉN (means I- personal pronoun)
KI- Hungarian KI (Who)
UR-Hungarian UR (Lord)
IS- Hungarian IS(too, also)
NI- Hungarian NI (look!)
AR- Hungarian ÁR (flood,and in old hungarian: people)
VAN- Hungaran VAN (is)
LU- Hungarian LÓ, LÚ (horse, sacrificed animal)
GAL- Hungarian GÁL (king)
EG- Hungarian ÉG (sky)
IG- Hungarian IG (up)
AG- Hungarian ÁG (branch)
TI- Hungarian TI (means you- personal pronoun)
etc...

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Re: Hungarian and Sumerian?

Postby Karavinka » 2012-05-22, 16:00

Parasztember wrote:EN- Hungarian ÉN (means I- personal pronoun)
KI- Hungarian KI (Who)
UR-Hungarian UR (Lord)
IS- Hungarian IS(too, also)
NI- Hungarian NI (look!)
AR- Hungarian ÁR (flood,and in old hungarian: people)
VAN- Hungaran VAN (is)
LU- Hungarian LÓ, LÚ (horse, sacrificed animal)
GAL- Hungarian GÁL (king)
EG- Hungarian ÉG (sky)
IG- Hungarian IG (up)
AG- Hungarian ÁG (branch)
TI- Hungarian TI (means you- personal pronoun)
etc...


They're not.

EN: most often, "lord" or "governor." 1sg personal pronoun in Sumerian is "ĝae"

KI: this means "place", "earth" or "city" in Sumerian. Sumerian interrogative is "aba"

UR: this means either "dog" or "man." In most cases it means "dog", and it means "man" (apparently) only when it's a part of a personal name compound. "Lord" in Sumerian is again, "en", "ensi" or "nin."

NI: there are several homophones pronounced "ni" in Sumerian, none of which means "look." There are several words which mean "look" in Sumerian, most of which are compound verbs with the nominal element "igi" (eye).

AR: again, there are several homophones written/pronounced either as "ar" or "ara," meaning "praise, grind, ruin, official, times", etc. Sumerian word for "people" is "uĝ"

VAN: I don't even need to look this up. V doesn't exist in Sumerian.

LU: there are many homophones, but most common meaning is either "abundance" or "person." None of the homophones mean "horse", which is "dur", "kab" or "sisi" depending on the kind of horse.

GAL: this doesn't mean "king", it only means "big, large, great." I give you that, it could very well be a part of the word "lugal", which does mean "king." Some people believe "lugal" is "lu+gal", but it could very well be a Sumerian folk etymology.

IG/EG mean "door" and "reeve" in Sumerian. While it's tricky to find an exact equivalent of something like "up" in Sumerian, the word for "sky, heaven" is "an."

AG: this doesn't exist in Sumerian. "aga" means "axe" and "ak" means "to do." Pick what you want, but it doesn't mean "branch," which is "pa" or "il."

TI: "ti" or "til" in Sumerian means "life." 2nd person pronoun is "zae" in Sumerian.

Do a little bit of dictionary work, and you'll find out that none of your supposed cognates mean anything remotely close in Sumerian.

Neither Sumerian nor Akkadian was more complex or sophisticated than each other. Further, Sumerian was not the first human language, it was only the first "written" language. No ancient language is primitive compared to modern languages, and your remark on Sumerian civilization is actually fucking pissing me off....so why don't you just SHUT THE FUCK UP, FIND SOME SUMERIAN PORN AND GO WANK YOURSELF?
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Re: Hungarian and Sumerian?

Postby language learner » 2012-05-22, 16:12

Karavinka wrote:
Parasztember wrote:EN- Hungarian ÉN (means I- personal pronoun)
KI- Hungarian KI (Who)
UR-Hungarian UR (Lord)
IS- Hungarian IS(too, also)
NI- Hungarian NI (look!)
AR- Hungarian ÁR (flood,and in old hungarian: people)
VAN- Hungaran VAN (is)
LU- Hungarian LÓ, LÚ (horse, sacrificed animal)
GAL- Hungarian GÁL (king)
EG- Hungarian ÉG (sky)
IG- Hungarian IG (up)
AG- Hungarian ÁG (branch)
TI- Hungarian TI (means you- personal pronoun)
etc...


They're not.

EN: most often, "lord" or "governor." 1sg personal pronoun in Sumerian is "ĝae"

KI: this means "place", "earth" or "city" in Sumerian. Sumerian interrogative is "aba"

UR: this means either "dog" or "man." In most cases it means "dog", and it means "man" (apparently) only when it's a part of a personal name compound. "Lord" in Sumerian is again, "en", "ensi" or "nin."

NI: there are several homophones pronounced "ni" in Sumerian, none of which means "look." There are several words which mean "look" in Sumerian, most of which are compound verbs with the nominal element "igi" (eye).

AR: again, there are several homophones written/pronounced either as "ar" or "ara," meaning "praise, grind, ruin, official, times", etc. Sumerian word for "people" is "uĝ"

VAN: I don't even need to look this up. V doesn't exist in Sumerian.

LU: there are many homophones, but most common meaning is either "abundance" or "person." None of the homophones mean "horse", which is "dur", "kab" or "sisi" depending on the kind of horse.

GAL: this doesn't mean "king", it only means "big, large, great." I give you that, it could very well be a part of the word "lugal", which does mean "king." Some people believe "lugal" is "lu+gal", but it could very well be a Sumerian folk etymology.

IG/EG mean "door" and "reeve" in Sumerian. While it's tricky to find an exact equivalent of something like "up" in Sumerian, the word for "sky, heaven" is "an."

AG: this doesn't exist in Sumerian. "aga" means "axe" and "ak" means "to do." Pick what you want, but it doesn't mean "branch," which is "pa" or "il."

TI: "ti" or "til" in Sumerian means "life." 2nd person pronoun is "zae" in Sumerian.

good points :)

Hungarian TI - Bulgarian ТИ(means you- personal pronoun)

fixed that for you ;)

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Re: Hungarian and Sumerian?

Postby Parasztember » 2012-05-22, 16:45

Karavinka wrote:Neither Sumerian nor Akkadian was more complex or sophisticated than each other. Further, Sumerian was not the first human language, it was only the first "written" language. No ancient language is primitive compared to modern languages, and your remark on Sumerian civilization is actually fucking pissing me off....so why don't you just SHUT THE FUCK UP, FIND SOME SUMERIAN PORN AND GO WANK YOURSELF?


Why are you nervous?
I would say, that's why the difference existing, the sumerian had a lot of borrowed words from hungarian, and these become diverted. :rotfl: :rotfl:
But sorry, that I hurt your serious science, but I can't find two equal sumerian dictionary, and my manifestation was pure authentic now.
But yes, this was a slave-served society, what do you think who built the huge zikkurats, and who dig the canal's? Kind-hearted volunteers? :D

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Re: Hungarian and Sumerian?

Postby Karavinka » 2012-05-22, 17:14

I guess you don't understand English, let alone Sumerian. I initially thought you were just a moron, but now it seems that you're just an asshole with moronic sagesse.

1. I'm not nervous. I am just annoyed with your clearly-lower-than-human-average intelligence.

2. Loanwords do acquire divergent meanings over time, but they do not get completely unrelated meanings, even in cases of semantic deviation.

Hungarian ÉN - Korean "EN" (when)
Hungarian KI - Korean "KI" (height)
Hungarian UR - Korean "UL-" (to cry)
Hungarian IS - Korean "IS-" (to be)
Hungarian NI - Korean "NI" (you)
Hungarian ÁR - Korean AL (egg)
...etc.

Does this look plausible? If so, you need to have your mental health checked.

3. Even the simplest google search could give you Pennsylvania Sumerian Dictionary. http://psd.museum.upenn.edu/epsd/ Learn Sumerian before you make your idiotic statements.

4. "my manifestation was pure authentic now"? Where did you learn English? Stop making fun of your fellow Hungarians because I think I'm developing a prejudice.

5. Slavery did exist in Sumer, but so did everywhere in the World until a few centuries ago. The existence of slavery does not make a civilization "primitive"; in fact, slavery is one of the requisites in the ancient developments of the urban life with a central administration.
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Re: Hungarian and Sumerian?

Postby Parasztember » 2012-05-22, 17:31

Karavinka wrote:I guess you don't understand English, let alone Sumerian. I initially thought you were just a moron, but now it seems that you're just an asshole with moronic sagesse..


These words grade only you, but not me
I can't debate. You're right.

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Re: Hungarian and Sumerian?

Postby language learner » 2012-05-22, 18:05

Parasztember wrote:
Karavinka wrote:I guess you don't understand English, let alone Sumerian. I initially thought you were just a moron, but now it seems that you're just an asshole with moronic sagesse..


These words grade only you, but not me
I can't debate. You're right.

So you admit you are wrong in your assumption?

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Re: Hungarian and Sumerian?

Postby Parasztember » 2012-05-23, 7:41

имен wrote:These words grade only you, but not me
I can't debate. You're right.

So you admit you are wrong in your assumption?[/quote]

It's not an assumption, only a laic's remark to some strange phenomena...
But the upight guy's posts convince me, that he's very uncertain in his theories.

Śrāmaṇera

Re: Hungarian and Sumerian?

Postby Śrāmaṇera » 2012-05-23, 15:14

Wow you're allowed to use words such as 'asshole' in here and they forbid me to use the adjective 'dumb" just now in another thread... :para:

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Re: Hungarian and Sumerian?

Postby Mongol » 2012-05-27, 18:33

A connection between Hungarian and Sumerian sounds so far faetched . Sumerian was spoken in Mesopotamia, yet the Uralian languages are very northerly languages spoken all the way up into the arctic, as with the Samoyedic languages .
In addition, speakers of Uralian languages who live east of the Ural mountains tend to be racially mongoloid, such as the Khant and Mansi, and the Samoyedic peoples.
If the Uralian languages have an origin that far south, how did all of these languages end up so far north ? And if they have a northerly origin , which seems much more likely, how did Uralian speakers get as far south as Mesopotamia ? And so long ago ?
Hungarian is an exception, and is completely isolated geographically from the other Uralianlanguages, having been brought in by the Magyars , who reached what is now Hungary in the
late 9th century, after having mixed for a long time with Turkic peoples.

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Re: Hungarian and Sumerian?

Postby Jurgen Wullenwever » 2012-05-27, 20:37

Mongol wrote:A connection between Hungarian and Sumerian sounds so far faetched . Sumerian was spoken in Mesopotamia, yet the Uralian languages are very northerly languages spoken all the way up into the arctic, as with the Samoyedic languages .
In addition, speakers of Uralian languages who live east of the Ural mountains tend to be racially mongoloid, such as the Khant and Mansi, and the Samoyedic peoples.
If the Uralian languages have an origin that far south, how did all of these languages end up so far north ? And if they have a northerly origin , which seems much more likely, how did Uralian speakers get as far south as Mesopotamia ? And so long ago ?

Humans spread from Africa to everywhere in the world even longer ago, and the distance is not that far. Consider that languages all over the Soviet area and beyond show some similar traits (not that that necessarily means anything), and those distances are bigger than the distance from the southern Urals to southern Iraq.
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Re: Hungarian and Sumerian?

Postby Moniqiili » 2012-06-03, 15:27

I have a theory ,not good at explaining but that some peoples of different places and races of the world thousands of years ago left or were driven out by war or other reasons and they were mislead or misunderstood about the names and origins of other peoples they met and settled with .lets take for example a Japanese person asks me where I´m from, simple question but complex answer.He does not know the true history of peoples that came to Britain in the past 2,000 years. The Japanese often think of them selves as a pure race however Aino peoples were living in Northern Japan thousands of years and today The Japanese refute this because of racial purity claims and say the Ainoo invaded Honshoo from Sahqhalin They have similar looks to Altaic peoples but similar culture of North America natives most historians claim that Natives crossed from Siberia TO America but why not the opposite way we can see many types of Natives some have Asian European traits we all have our theories to fit into our racial purity claims how come Maori New zealanders travelled by sea so far from where ,South America or Asia ,Many cultures have similar traditions shaped by their environment and the fact that we share similar independent ideas a Tipii is similar to a Saami lavvoo we might say they are related but they share similar environments ,Scots used war paint so did many cultures ,Language and peoples or mixed up after thousands of years of war and migration to and from Afrika Euro -Asia and Americas many pieces of the puzzle are lost we can only guess some peoples lied to protect themselves from racial violence many Japanese Ainoo will not admit they have Ainoo blood because it meant death.
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Re: Hungarian and Sumerian?

Postby Parasztember » 2012-06-05, 16:58

The yakut language is part of the turkic family, moreover, the anatolian turks comprehend the yakut language, and vica versa, as fa as I now. But the distance between the two group is circa 8-10000 kilometre.
And for example the kyrgyz people come to north-eastern Sibereia, and they become turkic in the nearby past.
Why is it essential ? The cause is the nomadism in Asia was a complete mode of production. The people live their days nomdism mode, and this was the key of their survival. Why is it strange?
I think it not strange, but common.
If it strange, is the nomadism is shame some people...

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Re: Hungarian and Sumerian?

Postby linguoboy » 2012-06-05, 17:01

Parasztember wrote:The yakut language is part of the turkic family, moreover, the anatolian turks comprehend the yakut language, and vica versa, as fa as I now.

What is your source for this? Have you actually seen a Yakut speak to an Anatolian?
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Re: Hungarian and Sumerian?

Postby Ludwig Whitby » 2012-06-05, 17:33

Oh Hungarians, would you give it a rest, please.

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Re: Hungarian and Sumerian?

Postby Parasztember » 2012-06-05, 19:15

linguoboy wrote:What is your source for this? Have you actually seen a Yakut speak to an Anatolian?


My main source for this is hungarian language texts, but I tink it's meaningless to quote.
But the the english Wikipedia is write the same, for Sakha (yakut) language. it's worth to resemble the turkic and yakut figures there:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sakha_language

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Re: Hungarian and Sumerian?

Postby Parasztember » 2012-06-05, 19:40

Ludwig Whitby wrote:Oh Hungarians, would you give it a rest, please.


It's fun. I had a serbian acquaintance, who believed, the "heart of the earth" is in Pilis Mountains (Hungary) I just laughed for this, but he believed this honestly... :)
Nevermind, we had a good trip then.

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Re: Hungarian and Sumerian?

Postby Ludwig Whitby » 2012-06-05, 20:01

Parasztember wrote:
linguoboy wrote:What is your source for this? Have you actually seen a Yakut speak to an Anatolian?


My main source for this is hungarian language texts, but I tink it's meaningless to quote.
But the the english Wikipedia is write the same, for Sakha (yakut) language. it's worth to resemble the turkic and yakut figures there:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sakha_language

They are related, but one language is from the Siberian and the other from the Oghuz group, I doubt that they are so similar. Numbers don't really mean much, btw. Czech and Serbian have almost identical numbers, yet I wouldn't be able to have a meaningful conversation with a Czech.

Parasztember wrote:
Ludwig Whitby wrote:Oh Hungarians, would you give it a rest, please.

It's fun. I had a serbian acquaintance, who believed, the "heart of the earth" is in Pilis Mountains (Hungary) I just laughed for this, but he believed this honestly... :)
Nevermind, we had a good trip then.

Serbs believe all kinds of things, such as that we are the oldest people in the world and that we once had a great empire that stretched on 3 continents. The reason you don't know about it is because you have been taught the Germanic-school history supported by the serbophobic Vatican and the Jewish lobby.


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