Moderator:kevin
Chekhov wrote:I don't know about naive worldviews, but Jurgen Wullenwhatever pisses me off to no end because of his extreme pessimism and cynicism. You'd think the world was going to end imminently when talking to that guy.
Jurgen Wullenwever wrote:So you have Gaeltacht teachers in school, but they do not teach you Gaeltacht Irish?
So you have Swedish teachers who don't teach their rural dialects?Jurgen Wullenwever wrote:So you have Gaeltacht teachers in school, but they do not teach you Gaeltacht Irish?
mōdgethanc wrote:So you have Swedish teachers who don't teach their rural dialects?Jurgen Wullenwever wrote:So you have Gaeltacht teachers in school, but they do not teach you Gaeltacht Irish?
Chekhov wrote:I don't know about naive worldviews, but Jurgen Wullenwhatever pisses me off to no end because of his extreme pessimism and cynicism. You'd think the world was going to end imminently when talking to that guy.
Jurgen Wullenwever wrote:mōdgethanc wrote:So you have Swedish teachers who don't teach their rural dialects?Jurgen Wullenwever wrote:So you have Gaeltacht teachers in school, but they do not teach you Gaeltacht Irish?
But in this case the rural dialects are the only remnants left of the language, so if you learn the language, you should have to learn a rural dialect.
Is my reasoning wrong in some way?
Ciarán12 wrote:Anyway, I don't think many people in school got fluent enough for it to matter what kind of Iris they were learning.
Chekhov wrote:I don't know about naive worldviews, but Jurgen Wullenwhatever pisses me off to no end because of his extreme pessimism and cynicism. You'd think the world was going to end imminently when talking to that guy.
Levike wrote:Is there a big difference between dialects?
Is it like American & British English
where you can't really see the differences in writing, grammar
only when it comes to pronunciation.
Is it like Spanish where you also have some grammar differences.
Or maybe like Portuguese?
Jurgen Wullenwever wrote:But why have teachers specifically from the Gaeltacht if Gaeltacht speech is not taught? However, most foreign language teachers in the world teach their own L2 language to their own L1 pupils, I think.
Jurgen Wullenwever wrote:Ciarán12 wrote:Anyway, I don't think many people in school got fluent enough for it to matter what kind of Iris they were learning.
Yes, there seems to be an abundance of complaints on Irish teaching.
Jurgen Wullenwever wrote:But in this case the rural dialects are the only remnants left of the language, so if you learn the language, you should have to learn a rural dialect.
Is my reasoning wrong in some way?
linguoboy wrote: IIRC, every major dialect area was represented among the teachers Ciarán had during his time at school. Imagine if each had taught not just using their native accent but in their native variety as well. It would be like learning Scouse one year, Strine the next, and Yat the year after that.
Chekhov wrote:I don't know about naive worldviews, but Jurgen Wullenwhatever pisses me off to no end because of his extreme pessimism and cynicism. You'd think the world was going to end imminently when talking to that guy.
Jurgen Wullenwever wrote:linguoboy wrote: IIRC, every major dialect area was represented among the teachers Ciarán had during his time at school. Imagine if each had taught not just using their native accent but in their native variety as well. It would be like learning Scouse one year, Strine the next, and Yat the year after that.
They should rather have one local dialect teached per region, so if the entire island has, say twelve basic varieties that can be defined from what is known today (some now dead but partially known), then each of these twelve should get its own historically based region where it is the variety taught. (Twelve was an arbitrary number, but it should be something similar.)
Jurgen Wullenwever wrote:linguoboy wrote: IIRC, every major dialect area was represented among the teachers Ciarán had during his time at school. Imagine if each had taught not just using their native accent but in their native variety as well. It would be like learning Scouse one year, Strine the next, and Yat the year after that.
They should rather have one local dialect teachedtaught per region, so if the entire island has, say twelve basic varieties that can be defined from what is known today (some now dead but partially known), then each of these twelve should get its own historically based region where it is the variety taught. (Twelve was an arbitrary number, but it should be something similar.)
linguoboy wrote:That's a tall order. As I said, most of Ireland's population lives in Leinster, whose historic varieties are the least well-known, having been the first to go extinct. So what you're advocating is that the majority of teachers of Irish learn an artificial revived variety based on very incomplete information in order to teach it to learners. That doesn't sound to me like a winning strategy.
Chekhov wrote:I don't know about naive worldviews, but Jurgen Wullenwhatever pisses me off to no end because of his extreme pessimism and cynicism. You'd think the world was going to end imminently when talking to that guy.
Jurgen Wullenwever wrote:But the majority of teachers today have to learn the artificial standard, and teach that all over the country. In my suggestion this would not be the case everywhere, as it is today, if I understand things correctly (only semi-informed and has forgotten much). This new Leinster Irish might be less artificial than the one in use today.
linguoboy wrote:I don't see how it could be "less artificial" when the current standard is based on actually existing spoken varieties which can be learned completely
kevin wrote:In other countries, it is taken for granted that a standard is taught that is either the prestigious local dialect of one specific city/region or completely artificial and not a local dialect anywhere.
Chekhov wrote:I don't know about naive worldviews, but Jurgen Wullenwhatever pisses me off to no end because of his extreme pessimism and cynicism. You'd think the world was going to end imminently when talking to that guy.
kevin wrote:Not sure about Sweden, but in Germany people started giving up their dialects and speaking as written long ago, especially in the North. This puts dialect speakers in a similar position as you describe. Yes, this can be a real problem for dialects, but as I understand it, it's by no means specific to Ireland.
Chekhov wrote:I don't know about naive worldviews, but Jurgen Wullenwhatever pisses me off to no end because of his extreme pessimism and cynicism. You'd think the world was going to end imminently when talking to that guy.
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 6 guests