Algic/Algonquin Languages

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Algic/Algonquin Languages

Postby księżycowy » 2010-10-18, 18:55

Figured I'd start a thread for the Algonquin languages, such as Mi'kmaq, Cree, Mohegan, Lenape/Deleware, Abenaki, ect.
Last edited by księżycowy on 2010-10-31, 14:36, edited 3 times in total.

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Re: Algic Languages (Algonquin)

Postby Formiko » 2010-10-19, 18:49

You forgot Cheyenne! I helped with translation of the Cheyenne New Testament as my internship as an undergrad.

They lived on Sioux land, but they spoke Algonquin! An anomaly indeed. I learned Mohawk during this period. (one of the Cheyenne translators was Canadian Mohawk)

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*Edited by ksiezycowy*
Moved the links to Learning Resources.
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Re: Algic Languages (Algonquin)

Postby księżycowy » 2010-10-19, 20:30

I didn't exactly forget Cheyenne, I was actually trying to remember the link to the Let's Talk Cheyenne audio course. Thanks for the links.

If anyone can't tell by now, I'm a Native American Language nut!

Interesting indeed that you learned Mohawk while working on a Cheyenne translation of the NT!

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Re: Algic Languages (Algonquin)

Postby Formiko » 2010-10-20, 1:55

księżycowy wrote:Interesting indeed that you learned Mohawk while working on a Cheyenne translation of the NT!


I was more of a gofer, I didn't do any real cool stuff, but it was pretty wild that I learned Mohawk from a Cheyenne translator ;)
You're just like me. I've taken over 300 classes in NDN languages, and I taught a Native Language Awareness class, but not enough people care about Native languages anymore. The Pama-Nyungan languages are getting all the love now, and I know not one thing about them. They never interested me.
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Re: Algic Languages (Algonquin)

Postby księżycowy » 2010-10-20, 9:30

Formiko wrote:I was more of a gofer, I didn't do any real cool stuff, but it was pretty wild that I learned Mohawk from a Cheyenne translator ;)
You're just like me. I've taken over 300 classes in NDN languages, and I taught a Native Language Awareness class, but not enough people care about Native languages anymore. The Pama-Nyungan languages are getting all the love now, and I know not one thing about them. They never interested me.

Not exactly sure what you mean by NDN languages, but I do find it appalling that Native American languages tend to get over looked. I guess from a practical stand point many non-Indians don't see the point of learning such a language as apposed to learning something like say French, Chinese, or Arabic. And Indians I would guess give into to the encroachment of English into their territories for much the same reasons. I think this is a terrible tragedy. Especially seeing as the N. Amer. languages are just as fascinating (if not more fascinating) then any other language of the world!

Though I do have to disagree with one point you made, I do find Pama-Nyungan languages interesting. Though not quite as interesting as Native American languages!

Oh, and I've never formally studied any N/ Amer. language, but I would find that interesting! (Not that I'm saying you're implying that I have.) I should wonder how many are taught at say a university level. Probably not many.

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Re: Algic Languages (Algonquin)

Postby księżycowy » 2010-10-20, 9:41

Mi'kmaq here I come!

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Re: Algic Languages (Algonquin)

Postby księżycowy » 2010-10-20, 11:35

After some more research, I've found that the orthography used in the Micmac Teaching Grammar is actually quite similar to the orthography (-ies) used. There appear to be two main systems that are used.
One that uses accents for the long vowels (the Francis-Smith system) and one that uses an apostrophe to do the same (the Listuguj system). [Edit: the Francis-Smith system also uses the apostrophe for long vowels in addition to an accent, thus a long 'a' could be written either way. See chart.] And the one uses a 'k' for the [k~g] sound, and the other uses the 'g'. Neither uses ĝ, ê, or the 'p/'k/'t ect. The apostrophe in the book that is used before a consonant is supposed to let you know that said consonant is voiced. This is dropped all together in the other orthographies. seeing as there is no audio with the book though, it is helpful!
Thus we have:








BookFrancis-SmithListuguj
êɨɨ (or) '
ĝqq
'ppp
à (long a)á (or) a'a'
gkg
ayay (or) aiai
awaw (or) auau
eyey (or) eiei

Other then that, all the other letters are the same for the three systems (as far as I can tell).

So, how does that affect the spelling in the book? Depends on the orthography you want to use. I've seen both used online (mostly with the long vowels represented with an apostrophe).
Thus we get:
Book->Francis-Smith->Listuguj
peyĝisingês -> peykisinkɨs -> peygisingɨs/peygising's (he/she gets/got here)
welèg -> welék/wele'k -> wele'g (he/she is fine)
I guess I'm more partial to the Francis-Smith system, but either is good. Plus it's not hard to change between them.
Last edited by księżycowy on 2010-10-20, 12:04, edited 4 times in total.

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Re: Algic Languages (Algonquin)

Postby Formiko » 2010-10-20, 21:25

księżycowy wrote:Not exactly sure what you mean by NDN languages,

NDN is what native shorthand for Indian. Say the letters out loud. :)
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Re: Algic Languages (Algonquin)

Postby księżycowy » 2010-10-20, 23:58

Ah! That was a 'duh' moment :lol: !

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Re: Algic Languages (Algonquin)

Postby limoneneis » 2010-10-21, 19:52

Do you know if any of the algic languages actually has a "real" textbook, I mean with dialogs, audio and exercises, not just a phrasebook?
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Re: Algic Languages (Algonquin)

Postby księżycowy » 2010-10-21, 20:58

limoneneis wrote:Do you know if any of the algic languages actually has a "real" textbook, I mean with dialogs, audio and exercises, not just a phrasebook?

The only two languages that I know of that have actual textbooks for them, are Micmac (the textbook I linked to above; sorry, but no audio), and Cree (via the Spoken Cree 1&2 by C. D. Ellis)
I have the Spoken Cree books, and they're pretty good. They did also got partially posted on Google Books.
As for buying them, as far as I know you can find them at most online bookstores, like amazon.
And the audio for Spoken Cree (for Vol 1 only) can be found on Lulu, just search for 'Spoken Cree.'

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Re: Algic Languages (Algonquin)

Postby księżycowy » 2010-10-21, 21:02

Speaking of which, did they ever come out with Level III for Spoken Cree?

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Re: Algic Languages (Algonquin)

Postby limoneneis » 2010-10-21, 21:32

Thank you, księżycowy! The Spoken Cree looks good :)
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Re: Algic Languages (Algonquin)

Postby księżycowy » 2010-10-21, 21:34

limoneneis wrote:Thank you, księżycowy! The Spoken Cree looks good :)

No problem!

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Re: Algic Languages (Algonquin)

Postby ILuvEire » 2010-10-21, 23:15

Do you know of a real Micmac textbook? I hate using PDFs ><
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Re: Algic Languages (Algonquin)

Postby księżycowy » 2010-10-21, 23:27

ILuvEire wrote:Do you know of a real Micmac textbook? I hate using PDFs ><

I know how you feel. Unfortunately no.
I was hoping that they would do something similar to the Mohawk textbook and bring back into print, but unfortunately no.

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Ojibwe

Postby lacustrine » 2010-10-24, 16:09

I didn't see an Ojibwe thread specifically so I thought I would start one and include all the links I have on the language. It's probable that some of these links refer to different dialects or varieties of what we call "Ojibwe".

I have not really found a good textbook for this language yet, which is surprising given the number of speakers in the US and Canada. If anyone knows of one please link it here.


*Edited by ksiezycowy*
Moved links to Learning Resources.

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Re: Algic Languages (Algonquin)

Postby lacustrine » 2010-10-24, 16:19

I didn't see an Ojibwe-specific thread so I created one and added my links http://www.unilang.org/viewtopic.php?f=99&t=31687.

*Edited by ksiezycowy*
Moved the links to Learning Resources.

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Re: Algic Languages (Algonquin)

Postby księżycowy » 2010-10-24, 16:36

lacustrine wrote:I didn't see an Ojibwe-specific thread so I created one and added my links http://www.unilang.org/viewtopic.php?f=99&t=31687.

I was a little skepitcal about making a thread for an individual Algonquin (or any other Native American language that doesn't already have one for that matter) because I wasn't sure of the turnout as far as people actively participating, but best of luck!

And thanks for the links!

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Re: Ojibwe

Postby księżycowy » 2010-10-24, 16:42

lacustrine wrote:I have not really found a good textbook for this language yet, which is surprising given the number of speakers in the US and Canada. If anyone knows of one please link it here.

I know, it's crazy! There are still tons of Algonquin language speakers (including Ojibwe), especially in Canada, and yet, the only textbooks I've come across are the one for Micmac [which isn't even in print anymore], and the two volume one for Cree!


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