2017 blog - księżyc

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Re: 2017 blog - księżyc

Postby kevin » 2017-11-06, 17:55

Ok, that makes sense. Go raibh maith agat!

księżycowy

Re: 2017 blog - księżyc

Postby księżycowy » 2017-11-06, 17:58

It does the same thing with "that," where it has both san and sin.

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Re: 2017 blog - księżyc

Postby kevin » 2017-11-06, 21:12

And siúd/súd as well, apparently. GnaG even mentions it, but I never took notice of it before.

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Re: 2017 blog - księżyc

Postby księżycowy » 2017-11-06, 21:15

I didn't know about the siúd/súd thing, but it follows. :P

Interestingly, TYI only has súd in the glossary in the back.

księżycowy

Re: 2017 blog - księżyc

Postby księżycowy » 2017-11-06, 23:08

I'm very tempted to add Hmong to my "fun languages" section....

Look at what you did, dEhiN!!!!!!

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Re: 2017 blog - księżyc

Postby dEhiN » 2017-11-06, 23:28

księżycowy wrote:I'm very tempted to add Hmong to my "fun languages" section....

Look at what you did, dEhiN!!!!!!

Do it!!! Eventually I'll get to the place where I can add Archi to my fun languages!
Native: (en-ca)
Active: (fr)(es)(pt-br)(ta-lk)(mi)(sq)(tl)
Inactive: (de)(ja)(yue)(oj)(id)(hu)(pl)(tr)(hi)(zh)(sv)(ko)(no)(it)(haw)(fy)(nl)(nah)(gl)(ro)(cy)(oc)(an)(sr)(en_old)(got)(sux)(grc)(la)(sgn-us)

księżycowy

Re: 2017 blog - księżyc

Postby księżycowy » 2017-11-06, 23:54

I don't want to spread myself too thin, but then again, a few phrases or words here and there won't kill anything.

Archi?

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Re: 2017 blog - księżyc

Postby vijayjohn » 2017-11-07, 1:14

Wait, you mean to tell me you've never heard of Archi?? :shock:

księżycowy

Re: 2017 blog - księżyc

Postby księżycowy » 2017-11-07, 1:36

Of course I have. I was just surprised that dEhiN wants to learn it some day.

Also, for sanity's sake, I think I'll cap my fun languages to two. For now at least. Sorry, Hmong.

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Re: 2017 blog - księżyc

Postby vijayjohn » 2017-11-07, 1:45

księżycowy wrote:Of course I have. I was just surprised that dEhiN wants to learn it some day.

Oh, that's because I infected him with my panglossophilia. :whistle:

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Re: 2017 blog - księżyc

Postby dEhiN » 2017-11-08, 4:26

vijayjohn wrote:
księżycowy wrote:Of course I have. I was just surprised that dEhiN wants to learn it some day.

Oh, that's because I infected him with my panglossophilia. :whistle:

Plus how can you not be enamoured by the consonant range in Archi?!

I'm pretty sure I was wanderlusting for languages as a child long before I even knew what wanderlusting was! Now, as I think about it, some of the earliest ones I can recall are Pictish, Philistine (or whatever language the Philistines of the Bible were supposed to have spoken), Hittite (due to Biblical references, particularly King David and Uriah), and Akkadian (which at the time I just thought of as the language the Assyrians of the Bible spoke; although funnily enough I was never interested in the language the Babylonians of the Bible spoke!).

I also was interested in French but then again, I was learning it in grade school. I don't quite remember if I had a wanderlust for Tamil until I was about 15/16, which is when I started to learn it. From what I recall now, until then I knew a few words and knew that my parents spoke it, but that was about it.

I have a vague memory of being at some meeting (seminar ?) where two linguists from SIL (or whatever Christian organization it is that helps small language communities develop writing so that they could translate the Bible) were talking of the intricacies of translation. They mentioned something about how the part in the Bible where it says to not build your foundation on sand but on rock was tricky to translate for one people group that lived in huts on sticks in the sand. And I remember wanting to find out what people group that was, what language they spoke, and learn a bit about that.

I think what Unilang did for me was normalize my language nerdery and tell me that it's ok - there are others like me! :D Prior to that, it was something I, for whatever reason, kept hidden and never pursued, even though the interests and desires existed in me.
Native: (en-ca)
Active: (fr)(es)(pt-br)(ta-lk)(mi)(sq)(tl)
Inactive: (de)(ja)(yue)(oj)(id)(hu)(pl)(tr)(hi)(zh)(sv)(ko)(no)(it)(haw)(fy)(nl)(nah)(gl)(ro)(cy)(oc)(an)(sr)(en_old)(got)(sux)(grc)(la)(sgn-us)

księżycowy

Re: 2017 blog - księżyc

Postby księżycowy » 2017-11-08, 11:12

dEhiN wrote:Plus how can you not be enamoured by the consonant range in Archi?!

I think Georgian and Chechen are strong enough for my blood. I'd love to add Adyghe/Kabardian and Abkhaz to that list, but because of lack of non-Russian resources.

Though I would like to learn Russian anyway, but I don't know when, or how far I'll get

Is Archive got enough in English (or any other languages you know) to learn? I'm curious.

I'm pretty sure I was wanderlusting for languages as a child long before I even knew what wanderlusting was! Now, as I think about it, some of the earliest ones I can recall are Pictish, Philistine (or whatever language the Philistines of the Bible were supposed to have spoken), Hittite (due to Biblical references, particularly King David and Uriah), and Akkadian (which at the time I just thought of as the language the Assyrians of the Bible spoke; although funnily enough I was never interested in the language the Babylonians of the Bible spoke!).

Pictish?
I've wanted to learn Gaulish before. :P I think I've also already expressed my interest in Old Irish, Cornish, and Manx. Celtic languages are fun!

*whispers* learn Irish with me. :doggy:

As for the Biblical languages, they were such a wanderlust to me that I made them my core of study. :silly:

Even though my school barely taught Greek and Hebrew. I'd love to learn quite a few Near Eastern languages. Egyptian, Akkadian, Aramaic and Sumerian were always of interest to me. Especially Egyptian for some reason. I've recently become aquatinted with Ugaritic (recently as in somewhere around 5-10 years ago :P ).

I think Greek (Classical, not Biblical), Latin and several other Classical/ancient/medieval languages fall into this category. I've always been interested (at least as a hobby) in ancient and medieval history and in how people lived back then. I think this is in part that's to the Bible and the history of Christianity in all honesty. Things spiraled from there.

I have a vague memory of being at some meeting (seminar ?) where two linguists from SIL (or whatever Christian organization it is that helps small language communities develop writing so that they could translate the Bible) were talking of the intricacies of translation. They mentioned something about how the part in the Bible where it says to not build your foundation on sand but on rock was tricky to translate for one people group that lived in huts on sticks in the sand. And I remember wanting to find out what people group that was, what language they spoke, and learn a bit about that.


Where as, I would have been more interested in the ramifications of the various translations and their effect on the culture. :P

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Re: 2017 blog - księżyc

Postby kevin » 2017-11-08, 11:32

księżycowy wrote:Pictish?
I've wanted to learn Gaulish before. :P I think I've also already expressed my interest in Old Irish, Cornish, and Manx. Celtic languages are fun!

I would love to learn a bit about the Celtic language that once was spoken around here. Unfortunately, nothing seems to be known about it. :(

*whispers* learn Irish with me. :doggy:

Learn Irish with us!

As for the Biblical languages, they were such a wanderlust to me that I made them my core of study. :silly:

I've been wanting to get back to Greek for a long time. And Hebrew I'd really like to do some more, too. Bu well, not now...

księżycowy

Re: 2017 blog - księżyc

Postby księżycowy » 2017-11-08, 14:34

kevin wrote:Learn Irish with us!

Tá brón an domhain orm!
(Not sure if that's how it would be said in Munster, but I don't have time to puzzle that out at the moment.)

I've been wanting to get back to Greek for a long time. And Hebrew I'd really like to do some more, too. Bu well, not now...

Greek was fun, and I hope to get back to it eventually. I've always dreamed of reading the classics (in Greek and Latin for that matter), as boring as they probably are. :P

Hebrew is just a fun ass challenge.

Do them both! Like, right now!

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Re: 2017 blog - księżyc

Postby dEhiN » 2017-11-08, 14:51

księżycowy wrote:Is Archive got enough in English (or any other languages you know) to learn? I'm curious.

Apart from the Wikipedia page, there is also a dictionary and a small language tutorial, both put up by the University of Surrey. But I think you basically have to look at linguistic resources in English.

księżycowy wrote:I've wanted to learn Gaulish before. :P I think I've also already expressed my interest in Old Irish, Cornish, and Manx. Celtic languages are fun!

I'm pretty sure I also wanted to learn Gaulish when I first read Asterix and Obelix. I've definitely been interested in Manx, Cornish, Welsh, Breton, Scottish, Old Irish, and a little bit in Irish.

księżycowy wrote:As for the Biblical languages, they were such a wanderlust to me that I made them my core of study.

I've also wanted to learn the two main ones - Greek and Hebrew. I did take an NT Greek course in uni, and did quite well. I went to take the second one as well, but didn't do so well due to mental health struggles. But I still have all the resources. I never had as strong a desire for Hebrew as Greek. Actually, I think it's more that for the longest while Semitic languages scared me. I'm not sure why, but the idea of learning a new script that's written from left to right threw me off. Plus I'm pretty sure most pastors I knew who had learned both would say something about Hebrew being harder than Greek. And I assumed Arabic was hard, so I think by extension I figured all Semitic languages were very hard!

księżycowy wrote:Egyptian, Akkadian, Aramaic and Sumerian were always of interest to me. Especially Egyptian for some reason. I've recently become aquatinted with Ugaritic (recently as in somewhere around 5-10 years ago :P ).

*googles Ugaritic* *falls in lust right away* *makes plans to learn the cuneiform and phonology* If I remember correctly, Assimil has a book for learning Middle Egyptian, and the book+cd combo is only 69.90 €.

kevin wrote:I would love to learn a bit about the Celtic language that once was spoken around here. Unfortunately, nothing seems to be known about it. :(

Do you know what the language was? I don't know whereabouts you live. Do you know if this language would fall under Transalpine or Cisalpine Celtic?

kevin wrote:
księżycowy wrote:*whispers* learn Irish with me. :doggy:

Learn Irish with us!

You guys, stop tempting me! If I start Irish, not only will I be starting 3 new languages in close proximity to each other (and also just on the heels of starting to relearn Korean), but my two TY Welsh resources will be saddened. :D

kevin wrote:I've been wanting to get back to Greek for a long time.

Ancient or Koine?
Native: (en-ca)
Active: (fr)(es)(pt-br)(ta-lk)(mi)(sq)(tl)
Inactive: (de)(ja)(yue)(oj)(id)(hu)(pl)(tr)(hi)(zh)(sv)(ko)(no)(it)(haw)(fy)(nl)(nah)(gl)(ro)(cy)(oc)(an)(sr)(en_old)(got)(sux)(grc)(la)(sgn-us)

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Re: 2017 blog - księżyc

Postby kevin » 2017-11-08, 16:43

dEhiN wrote:Do you know what the language was? I don't know whereabouts you live. Do you know if this language would fall under Transalpine or Cisalpine Celtic?

I'm living in South-West Germany near Stuttgart. The archaeological sites I know are from the Hallstatt era, and apparently there aren't any written texts, so nothing definite is known about the language.

To be honest, I don't even know at which time the area became Germanic and the Celts disappeared, though I'm sure there must be some information on that somewhere. When the Romans came and conquered it, it was already controlled by Germanic tribes.

You guys, stop tempting me! If I start Irish, not only will I be starting 3 new languages in close proximity to each other (and also just on the heels of starting to relearn Korean), but my two TY Welsh resources will be saddened. :D

Well, what do you prefer between saddening two TY Welsh resources and saddening two fellow Unilangers? ;)

kevin wrote:I've been wanting to get back to Greek for a long time.

Ancient or Koine?

At school I learned Classical, but I have forgotten enough of it that it probably shouldn't make a big difference... I'm more interested in Koine now, actually.

księżycowy wrote:Greek was fun, and I hope to get back to it eventually. I've always dreamed of reading the classics (in Greek and Latin for that matter), as boring as they probably are. :P

Hebrew is just a fun ass challenge.

Getting back to Greek shouldn't actually be that difficult. The script is not a problem, some theoretical knowledge about the grammar should be more or less there (quite rusty, but probably good enough for the start), I'd just need to start and actually (re-)learn some vocabulary and attack some text.

Hebrew, on the other hand... I attended that Modern Hebrew course that was fun, but didn't really move forward and was mostly just spoken, or written in German orthography. With the Hebrew script, I still feel like I'm a first grader again, sounding out words letter by letter. :D And of course very small vocabulary and almost no grammar. I'm not sure if I can find the motivation to work on a language by myself from this level.

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Re: 2017 blog - księżyc

Postby linguoboy » 2017-11-08, 17:57

księżycowy wrote:
kevin wrote:Learn Irish with us!

Tá brón an domhain orm!

Ní mheasaim gur fiú mórán é ach "ana-bhrón" a déarfainn féin,
"Richmond is a real scholar; Owen just learns languages because he can't bear not to know what other people are saying."--Margaret Lattimore on her two sons

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Re: 2017 blog - księżyc

Postby vijayjohn » 2017-11-08, 18:12

kevin wrote:Well, what do you prefer between saddening two TY Welsh resources and saddening two fellow Unilangers? ;)

I often prefer saddening two fellow UniLangers to saddening resources. :whistle: Resources can never get over it! :P

księżycowy

Re: 2017 blog - księżyc

Postby księżycowy » 2017-11-08, 18:16

Neither can I! *Goes and cries in a corner*

księżycowy

Re: 2017 blog - księżyc

Postby księżycowy » 2017-11-08, 20:53

I'm finally back homw from work, and can (theoretically at least) properly address all this:

dEhiN wrote:Apart from the Wikipedia page, there is also a dictionary and a small language tutorial, both put up by the University of Surrey. But I think you basically have to look at linguistic resources in English.

That's just about what I thought. I remember the dictionary and "tutorial", but wasn't sure if there was some secret material(s) I had missed.

I've also wanted to learn the two main ones - Greek and Hebrew. I did take an NT Greek course in uni, and did quite well. I went to take the second one as well, but didn't do so well due to mental health struggles. But I still have all the resources. I never had as strong a desire for Hebrew as Greek. Actually, I think it's more that for the longest while Semitic languages scared me. I'm not sure why, but the idea of learning a new script that's written from left to right threw me off. Plus I'm pretty sure most pastors I knew who had learned both would say something about Hebrew being harder than Greek. And I assumed Arabic was hard, so I think by extension I figured all Semitic languages were very hard!

I think the difficulty is often over rated for Biblical Hebrew. It was my first ever Semitic language, and I did just fine. I mean, I've studied enough of it now that hardly anything surprises me anymore, but the difficulty is not as bad as, say, Arabic. It's a simple enough language. I mean, as far as any actual language is simple. :P

*googles Ugaritic* *falls in lust right away* *makes plans to learn the cuneiform and phonology*

Cuneiform is awesome period. *drools*

If I remember correctly, Assimil has a book for learning Middle Egyptian, and the book+cd combo is only 69.90 €.

Too bad I don't remember French to save my life, and at least at the moment, I've cast it aside like the cheap whore it is.

You guys, stop tempting me! If I start Irish, not only will I be starting 3 new languages in close proximity to each other (and also just on the heels of starting to relearn Korean), but my two TY Welsh resources will be saddened. :D

https://archive.org/details/TeachYourselfIrish
http://www.iu.edu/~celtie/irish_archive.html
*puts it on the table in front of dEhiN*
It's all right there, you know you want it.....Just take it......


linguoboy wrote:Ní mheasaim gur fiú mórán é ach "ana-bhrón" a déarfainn féin,

Ní thuigim leat faoi sin. Ba fiú mórán é! :P

kevin wrote:At school I learned Classical, but I have forgotten enough of it that it probably shouldn't make a big difference... I'm more interested in Koine now, actually.
[...]
Getting back to Greek shouldn't actually be that difficult. The script is not a problem, some theoretical knowledge about the grammar should be more or less there (quite rusty, but probably good enough for the start), I'd just need to start and actually (re-)learn some vocabulary and attack some text.

Hebrew, on the other hand... I attended that Modern Hebrew course that was fun, but didn't really move forward and was mostly just spoken, or written in German orthography. With the Hebrew script, I still feel like I'm a first grader again, sounding out words letter by letter. :D And of course very small vocabulary and almost no grammar. I'm not sure if I can find the motivation to work on a language by myself from this level.

Do them both!

Hebrew script isn't that hard. Sure it takes a little bit to get used to it, but it's almost on par with the Greek alphabet. At least in my opinion. If you're motivated enough, you can learn it in an afternoon.
See my comments above for the rest.

Honestly, the hardest part is learning the vocabulary, because obviously it isn't Indo-European, let alone Germanic. But it's certainly not insurmountable.


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