Words that just won't stick

[Koko]

Oh~~, Grazie! Ha più senso di quello che ho scritto

[linguoboy]

[flag=]ga[/flag] toirneach thunder

The word that always comes to mind when I try to remember what "thunder" is in Irish is torann (probably because of the resemblance to Welsh taran). But torann is obsolete in that sense in modern Irish; now it means just "loud noise".

[flag=]ga[/flag] acmhainn capacity

I don't know what my problem is with this one, but I found myself having to look it up again today. ARRRGH!

[vijayjohn]

കൊട്ട [kɔˈʈa] 'basket'

For some reason, I rarely encounter this word. Then again, what do Malayalees even use baskets for carrying? All I can seem to think of is tea leaves (but only in plantations) and maybe fish sometimes.

Oh, I guess also shallots. But then I never even see any of those things in baskets anyway, so...

[eskandar]

For the life of me I can't get Spanish concurso to stick. I think of "concourse" and from there "path, direction" for some reason and thus never remember the meaning I want to recall: "contest, competition".

[vijayjohn]

Really? Do you know concours in French? If so, doesn't that help?

cours = curso
concours = concurso (in the sense of 'competition', anyway)

[TheStrayCat]

A few Spanish verbs like estregar, estragar, arrastrar, arrancar, arrojar. They just all look very similar to my brain.

[eskandar]

Really? Do you know concours in French? If so, doesn't that help?

I don't think I knew the French word, no. Just made a flashcard for that as well in hopes that the one will help reinforce the other.

[linguoboy]

For some reason, I just can't recall the Spanish word acera ("pavement/sidewalk") when I need it. Andén (a term I probably picked up from reading García Márquez) is the first word to come to mind followed by--if I take a moment to think about it--banqueta (due to its resemblance to LA French banquette). Somehow I got it into my head that acera means "corner", which it doesn't, and it effectively blocks retrieval.

[IpseDixit]

There are a few words/phrases that I know in English but can never remember their Italian equivalent, e.g:

[flag=]en[/flag] cleft palate - [flag=]it[/flag] palatoschisi

[flag=]en[/flag] glottal stop - [flag=]it[/flag] occlusiva glottidale sorda

[flag=]en[/flag] speaking in tongues - [flag=]it[/flag] glossolalia

Also some Italian kinship terms drive me mad, in English many of them are so easy and intuitive, like brother-in-law, daughter-in-law etc etc, whereas I think I'll never remember what cognato, cognata, nuora and genero are. :\ I also have problems with biscugino/a (are they my parents' cousins or my parents' cousins' sons? ), not to mention prozio/a and cugino di terzo grado, I have no fucking idea what those are.

[uzferry]

Tons of words in French. Pourtant, partout, autant, and actually most of words with a similar form

[Koko]

[flag=]en[/flag] speaking in tongues - [flag=]it[/flag] glossolalia

It might help to remember that "glossolalia" is also the word in English too ^^

cugino di terzo grado, I have no fucking idea what those are.

Is that like cousin third-times removed? I don't think anybody really understands those kinds of relations and either just call 'em cousins or don't even know they exist (or at least describe how they're related which is oddly easier than the #-times-removed convention).

[voron]

cugino di terzo grado

It sounds similar to what we have in Russian:
двоюродный брат/сестра (brother/sister of 2nd degree) - it simply means a cousin
троюродный брат/сестра (brother/sister of 3rd degree)
etc

The degree shows how many generations ago these 2 persons had common parents.

Degree 1 stands for your own siblings (you have common parents)
Degree 2 - your parents are siblings (you have common grandparents)
Degree 3 - your grandparents are siblings (you have common greatgrandparents)
etc

[Dormouse559]

cousin third-times removed?

For the record, there's "third cousin" and "cousin three times removed", and the terms can be put together, like in "third cousin three times removed" (technically, the great-great-great-great grandchild of your great-great uncle or aunt ).

But I agree with Koko that the distinction is unknown to most people, me included. I generally call the children of my first cousins my "second cousins" even though strictly speaking they're my "first cousins once removed".

[IpseDixit]

@Koko, I have no idea whether "cousin three times removed" is the same as cugino di terzo grado, can't be arsed to check, it would seem quite likely though.

Anyway, yep cugino di terzo grado was quite extreme, but damn, I never remember which word is for brother-in-law / sister-in-law / daughter-in-law / son-in-law.

[linguoboy]

But I agree with Koko that the distinction is unknown to most people, me included. I generally call the children of my first cousins my "second cousins" even though strictly speaking they're my "first cousins once removed".

I found it pretty easy to grasp once it was explained to me: the ordinal refers to how many generations back you need to go from your parents to find a common ancestor. My first cousins share a grandparent with me, my second cousins share a great-grandparent, my third cousins a great-great-grandparent and so forth. "Removes" then count how many generations off you are from that. My first cousin's children are my first cousins "once removed", their children would be "twice removed", and so forth.

One distinction which causes a lot of confusion because it's so rare in this day-and-age is "double first cousins". This is when two sets of siblings marry, so your natural uncle/aunt is also your aunt/uncle' in-law. My husband has a set of double first cousins, and whenever he mentions this he finds himself having to explain what it means.

[vijayjohn]

I found it pretty easy to grasp once it was explained to me: the ordinal refers to how many generations back you need to go from your parents to find a common ancestor. My first cousins share a grandparent with me, my second cousins share a great-grandparent, my third cousins a great-great-grandparent and so forth. "Removes" then count how many generations off you are from that. My first cousin's children are my first cousins "once removed", their children would be "twice removed", and so forth.

Wait, really? I thought first cousins once removed were the parents or children of second cousins, and thus the first cousins of either your parents or your children if you had any.

OK, I'm probably just confused because I'm misremembering things.

Wait, no, there's this online family tree thingy that I'm part of, and according to that, my grandfather's brother's son is my "first cousin once removed," his son is my "second cousin," and his son is my "second cousin once removed." Pfft, they're probably wrong.

One distinction which causes a lot of confusion because it's so rare in this day-and-age is "double first cousins". This is when two sets of siblings marry, so your natural uncle/aunt is also your aunt/uncle' in-law. My husband has a set of double first cousins, and whenever he mentions this he finds himself having to explain what it means.

So would the children of a cousin marriage also be double first cousins?

[Levike]

I'll never learn the names for the grammatical cases in Hungarian.

Even in English I only know the ones that appear in German and Romanian, plus the Instrumental case and Ablative.

Nominative = Alany
Accusative = Tárgyas
Dative = Részes

These are the only ones I know and I'm not even sure about the third...

[Dormouse559]

Wait, really? I thought first cousins once removed were the parents or children of second cousins, and thus the first cousins of either your parents or your children if you had any.

first cousin = child of your parent's sibling

first cousin once removed = child of your first cousin / your parent's first cousin (depending on which side of relationship you're on)

This page on cousin terms may help: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cousin

Wait, no, there's this online family tree thingy that I'm part of, and according to that, my grandfather's brother's son is my "first cousin once removed," his son is my "second cousin," and his son is my "second cousin once removed." Pfft, they're probably wrong.

I agree that the first is your first cousin once removed. But his son would just be your second cousin. You're both of the same generation, so there's no removal.

[vijayjohn]

Yeah, that's what they're saying - his son would be my second cousin, and my second cousin's son would be my second cousin once removed, so then I guess they're right after all.

Sorry for the confusion, and thanks!

[OldBoring]

Maybe IpseDixit doesn't have big family reunions like South Italians do.

I'm not an expert in Italian kinship term either (for obvious reasons: Italian is not spoken in my family) but from my understanding:

genero: marito della figlia (son-in-law)
nuora: moglie del figlio (daughter-in-law)

cognato means both(!):
1. fratello del coniuge (spouse's brother)
2. marito della sorella (sister's husband)

and so cognata means both:
1. sorella del coniuge (spouse's sister)
2. moglie del fratello (brother's wife)

I'm not sure if brother-in-law and sister-in-law mean both.

prozio is your parent's uncle. Grand-uncle?
prozia your parent's aunt. Grand-aunt?
The confusing part is that when addressing their prozio/a, Italians just call them "zio/a" (uncle/aunt).

I think cugino di secondo/terzo/etc. grado is the same as second/third/etc. cousin.
E.g. if you meet your second cousin you can tell him: "Your dad and my dad are cousins" or "Your grandpa and my grandpa are brothers".