Babel Babble

[wsz]

In this thread, you're welcome to discuss articles from Babel Babble. Any remarks can be sent here as well.

Here also, we will notify you of releasing a next issue of the magazine.

[wsz]

Ok, done. The second issue of Babel Babble has been finished and is available at: http://bb.unilang.org

Go and check it!

[Psi-Lord]

Great! But the sound samples of 'Sounding New' are missing.

[wsz]

Yes, I mistook writing extensions for two files Thank you, Psi-Lord, for that remark.

My only excuse could be the fact that I'd prepared this whole issue in just 3 days; I worked in a great hurry and finished it late at night, today.

The corrected page will be available tomorrow. I apologise everybody for the inconveniences...

[Luís]

Hmm... I suppose bb.unilang.org always point to the current month's edition. How can you see the past editions? Is there some sort of archive?

[wsz]

Hmm... I suppose bb.unilang.org always point to the current month's edition. How can you see the past editions? Is there some sort of archive?

I just remind: I suppose that some new members won't know it Yes, there'll be a page with previous issues, available from the BB site...

[Starian]

It's written there that the swedish and norwegian "y" is pronounced in the same way as the dutch "u" or german "ü"/"y", but I learned that the swedish and norwegian "y" is pronounced as something between the dutch 'u' and 'i'....

Marc (Axystos).

Hi thanks for your feedback. About your question: Swedish "y" is pronounced as German "y"/"ü" in "Synonym"/"fünf". Dutch "uu" is pronounced the same way (they all are [y]). From what I know, this "uu" sound can also be represented by a simple written "u" when it is in a open syllable. So, the "u" in "Muren" sounds like the "uu" in "Muur".

[Saaropean]

Swedish "y" is pronounced as German "y"/"ü" in "Synonym"/"fünf".

Being a little picky again: German Y and Ü is pronounced either [Y] (short and slightly more open) or [y:] (closed and long). "Synonym" is [zYnO"ny:m] or [zYno"ny:m], "fünf" is [fYnf].

Dutch "uu" is pronounced the same way (they all are [y]). From what I know, this "uu" sound can also be represented by a simple written "u" when it is in a open syllable. So, the "u" in "Muren" sounds like the "uu" in "Muur".

Dutch has clear rules saying when a vowel is pronounced short and when it is pronounced long. Long vowels are always long (thus UU [y:]), short vowels are long under certain circumstances, for example in the word "muren" ["my:r@(n)]...
I think a short Dutch U is [8] or so (between [o] and [ø], close to schwa).

In Québécois French, U is sometimes pronounced [Y], slightly more open and shorter than the usual [y].

[Axystos]

How about we ask someone from Sweden to try to explain how (s)he pronounces the y in, for example, the swedish word 'synonym'? Then we can compare that pronunciation with dutch and german.

Axystos.

[Psi-Lord]

I know this is still too theoretical, but here are some examples taken from the SAMPA website:

Swedish:
bytt [bYt]
syl [sy:l]

Norwegian:
lynne ["lyne]
lyn [ly:n]

Danish:
hylde ["hyl@]
hyle ["hy:l@]

German:
hübsch [hYpS]
süß [zy:s]

Dutch:
put [pYt]
vuur [vyr]

[Kubi]

[Dutch] short vowels are long under certain circumstances, for example in the word "muren" ["my:r@(n)]...

This circumstance is an open syllable, i.e. one that end in the vowel: vowels that end a syllable are always long, therefore they needn't be marked as long by doubling.

[Kubi]

In the BB2, it's said that "a" is a conjunction meaning "and, but" in Polish.

It's the same in Russian, and my guess is that the other Slavic languages have it as well. But that's to be confirmed...

[E}{pugnator]

Thanks for your feedback, Kubi.

In fact, I was aware of the Russian "a", and this was the one I actually mentioned in the beginning, but I decided to stick only to words that were "purely" "a", without diacritics, and in the latin alphabet. Wsz told me that conjunction existed in Polish, so I took the Russian one off and added the Polish one instead.

Next issue I'm going to change another letter/syllable, so, I have to take it easy and do it with some method.

If you know about other languages in which a solely "a" can have a meaning as a word, just say that.

Thanks!

Expug

[leppie]

In arabic 'a' is (one of the two particles) used as question marker:
a huwa huna?
ا هوهنا
is he here?

[Mara]

If you know about other languages in which a solely "a" can have a meaning as a word, just say that.

In Czech and Slovak, "a" means "and".

[Kubi]

If you know about other languages in which a solely "a" can have a meaning as a word, just say that.

In Breton, "a" is a preposition meaning "from" (direction).
In Cornish, "a" as preposition means "of". Furthermore, it's a question particle, mainly for negative questions, and a preverbal particle that marks objects that come before their verbs.
In Welsh, it is
- a question particle
- a preverbal particle
- a relative pronoun meaning "who", "which", "that"
- a conjunction meaning "and"

[leppie]

Hmm... I didn't read "just in latin alphabet"... sorry...

[Strigo]

Congratulations for the second issue!

It was very interesting! Specially the Maori's article!

[E}{pugnator]

Thanks for your examples, Kubi!

I'm gonna add them in BB#3...

[slovak1979]

In HUNGARIAN "A" is an article just like in English but pronounced differently.