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Levente.Maier wrote:Very simple question with a hard answer: How old is Hungarian ?
I read the first written Hungarian text from 1190 ( Halotti beszéd és könyörgés )
and I think that it's almost like today's language with some notable differences.
So it's older than 1000 years.
I think he's asking "how old is Hungarian as we know it?" in which case the answer seems to be at least the 13th century whereas with English if you go that far back you end up with shit like this:JackFrost wrote:Pretty much like all languages spoken today because Hungarian has to come from a language and that language has to come from another language. And that chain goes all the way back to the time when humans developed languages.
Levente wrote:Ok, but I was interested in how old is the Hungarian that we could actually understand.
mōdgethanc wrote:I think he's asking "how old is Hungarian as we know it?" in which case the answer seems to be at least the 13th century
whereas with English if you go that far back you end up with shit like this:
Forrþrihht anan se time comm
þatt ure Drihhtin wollde
ben borenn i þiss middellærd
forr all mannkinne nede
he chæs himm sone kinnessmenn
all swillke summ he wollde
and whær he wollde borenn ben
he chæs all att hiss wille.
which translated word-for-word would be:
Forthright anon [the] time come that our [Lord] willed been born [in] this middle-yard for all mankind['s] need he chose him some kinsmen all such some he willed and where he willed born been he chose all at his will.
which to Joe Blow means "what the fuck is this shit?".
So Cantonese isn't a language, but Moldovan is?I would argue that a language becomes a language when it breaks off from its sister languages, i.e. after it and its siblings are seen as one big happy language.
Moldovan is NOT a language.mōdgethanc wrote:So Cantonese isn't a language, but Moldovan is?I would argue that a language becomes a language when it breaks off from its sister languages, i.e. after it and its siblings are seen as one big happy language.
Sol Invictus wrote:Levente, if you have read the very first text known to be in Hungarian how do you expect anything older not to be a hypothesis for which there is no written proof?
mōdgethanc wrote:So Cantonese isn't a language, but Moldovan is?I would argue that a language becomes a language when it breaks off from its sister languages, i.e. after it and its siblings are seen as one big happy language.
''' wrote:How did you come to that conclusion? I don't care about sociolinguistics or the opinions of language speakers when discussing linguistics. when I say a language is "seen" as as a separate language, I mean determined by linguists to be one, not viewed to be one by the laity and/or ministry of agit/prop.
linguoboy wrote:How do you determine that "linguists" have determined a variety to be a "separate language", given that there is no universally accepted objective definition of "language" in linguistics?
Levente wrote:Does a Moldovan understand a Romanian even if let's suppose he never went to school.
Levente wrote:Yes there are situations where it's questionable, but in these situations it quite clear.
For example I once watched Moldavian television and besides a slight accent,linguoboy wrote:Define "understand" in this context. What degree of comprehension under what conditions?Levente wrote:Does a Moldovan understand a Romanian even if let's suppose he never went to school.
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