Bespreking // Discussion

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Bespreking // Discussion

Postby Shiba » 2012-05-18, 15:41

Ek besef nou eers dat hierdie forum nog nie so 'n onderwerp het nie! Nou ja, hier is hy.

Die doel van hierdie onderwerp is om probleme onder ander se aandag te bring, gesegdes uit te ruil, gedagtes uit te ruil, oor die taal en miskien selfs oor 'n bietjie letterkunde te gesels.
'n Mens kan hier eintlik enigiets wat direk met die Afrikaanse taal verband hou, bespreek.

Almal wat in Afrikaans belangstel, is hier welkom, ongeag watter taal hulle praat (solank die res van ons dit net kan verstaan, hehe). Met ander woorde, boodskappe hoef nie net Afrikaans te wees nie.

Ek is nie heeltemal seker hoe om die gesprek nou aan die gang te skop nie, dus sê ek maar net: geniet dit!

I've only just realised that this forum doesn't have a topic like this one! Well, here it is.

The goal of this topic is to bring problems to others' attention, to exchange expressions, to exchange thoughts, to speak about the language and perhaps even about a bit of literature.
Here one can really discuss anything directly related to the Afrikaans language.

Everyone interested in Afrikaans is welcome here, regardless of what language they speak (as long as the rest of us can understand it, hehe). In other words, posts don't have to be in Afrikaans.

I'm not quite sure how to get the discussion going now, so I'll only say: enjoy!
Native: Afrikaans (af) English (en) || Intermediate: German (South African variant, Springbokdeutsch) (de) || Beginner: Some odd combination of Riksmål and Bokmål and whatever (no) || Learning on-and-off: Russian (ru) || Curious: Breton (br) Welsh (cy) Finnish (fi)
Korrigere feilene mine, vær så snill!

Die HERE is my herder; niks sal my ontbreek nie. ~ Psalm 23:1

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Re: Bespreking // Discussion

Postby Brus » 2012-05-19, 17:39

Could a native speaker critique my pronunciation? I've recorded the first two paragraphs of the first posting in this thread.

http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?gd8ufw37ft0ult6

(I find the Afrikaans vowel sounds to be difficult .. )

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Re: Bespreking // Discussion

Postby Shiba » 2012-05-19, 21:55

Wow. I'm impressed. You're really good!

All I really can say is, remember that "bietjie" is just pronounced like "biekie" (there's no word like that, it's just to illustrate) - the last "ie" sounds the same as any other "ie" in Afrikaans. You should also work on your r's a bit to roll them more (the ones you did roll are fine).

Do you listen to much Afrikaans? If yes - don't stop; if no - try listening to Afrikaans songs and maybe an Afrikaans radio station (I can't really recommend one, as I don't listen to much radio. RSG is quite famous, but the content of their shows ... often leaves much to be desired :P ).

Keep up the good work!
Native: Afrikaans (af) English (en) || Intermediate: German (South African variant, Springbokdeutsch) (de) || Beginner: Some odd combination of Riksmål and Bokmål and whatever (no) || Learning on-and-off: Russian (ru) || Curious: Breton (br) Welsh (cy) Finnish (fi)
Korrigere feilene mine, vær så snill!

Die HERE is my herder; niks sal my ontbreek nie. ~ Psalm 23:1

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Re: Bespreking // Discussion

Postby Brus » 2012-05-20, 9:38

Shiba wrote:Do you listen to much Afrikaans? If yes - don't stop; if no - try listening to Afrikaans songs and maybe an Afrikaans radio station (I can't really recommend one, as I don't listen to much radio. RSG is quite famous, but the content of their shows ... often leaves much to be desired :P ).


Glad to hear I'm doing well. I'll work on those r's.

I've been listening to a lot of music on youtube - Bok van Blerk, Rea Le Roux, Kurt Darren, Laurika Rauch, Steve Hofmeyr, Lianie May. Anything else there you can recommend?

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Re: Bespreking // Discussion

Postby Shiba » 2012-05-20, 13:14

Aha.
Hmm - I don't know if there's any of his stuff on YouTube at all, but try looking for Jannie du Toit. He pronounces everything very clearly, not to mention his lyrics are excellent. Matthys Roets sings well too.

I know Weerwolf listens to AB de Villiers, so you could check him out too.

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE STAY AWAY FROM JACK PAROW

*ahem*.

Seriously, that guy's pronunciation is *terrible*, and his lyrics and whiny tone almost make his pronunciation look good...
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Re: Bespreking // Discussion

Postby Weerwolf » 2012-05-20, 14:43

Shiba wrote:PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE STAY AWAY FROM JACK PAROW

*ahem*.

Seriously, that guy's pronunciation is *terrible*, and his lyrics and whiny tone almost make his pronunciation look good...

Jack Parrow se musiek vind ek vieslik, maar ek moet erken dat ek heeltemaal nie van kletsrym hou nie. :D

Brus, ek kan jou nog Albert de Wet aanbeveel. Volgens my sing hy heel mooi en verstaanbaar.

Trouens, dis heel goed dat der so 'n topic ook in Afrikaans beskikbaar is. Ons het groot behoefte aan mense wat Afrikaans wil leer om hierdie onderwerp op die duur aan die gang te hou.
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Re: Bespreking // Discussion

Postby Leviwosc » 2012-06-07, 23:06

Image

Miskien kan ek julle vertel oor hierdie boek wat ek het gelees. Dit heet "Pieternella van die Kaap" en is geskryf deur Dalene Matthee gepubliseer in 2000.

Eva-Krotoa is 'n inheems Afrikaander wat lewe in die tyd van die Verenigde Oos-Indiese Kompanjie. Sy verkeer in die kringe van blankes as 'n tolk en het 'n dogter; Pieternella genoem, van 'n Deens chirurg. Eva raak egter aan die alkohol en word na Robbeneiland verban; waar sy al spoedig sterf. Pieternella word na die strafeiland, Mauritius gestuur, 'n jeughuwelik sal haar spaar. Langsaam word sy sig bewus van die bloedband met haar moeder omdat sy 'n halfbloed is en sy vra sig af watter velkleur haar kinders sal hê.
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Re: Bespreking // Discussion

Postby Shiba » 2012-06-09, 16:24

Leviwosc wrote:Miskien kan ek julle vertel oor hierdie boek wat ek gelees het. Dit heet "Pieternella van die Kaap" en is geskryf deur Dalene Matthee en gepubliseer in 2000 / in 2000 gepubliseer.

Eva-Krotoa is 'n inheemse Afrikaan wat lewe in die tyd van die Verenigde Oos-Indiese Kompanjie. Sy verkeer in die kringe van blankes as 'n tolk en het 'n dogter, Pieternella genoem, van 'n Deense chirurg. Eva raak egter aan die alkohol en word na Robbeneiland verban, waar sy al spoedig sterf. Pieternella word na die strafeiland, Mauritius, gestuur en net 'n jeughuwelik sal haar spaar*. Langsaam word sy self bewus van die bloedband met haar moeder omdat sy 'n halfbloed is en sy vra haarself af watter velkleur haar kinders sal hê.


*Dis as ek reg verstaan: sy sou net van Mauritius af kon wegbly indien sy op 'n jong ouderdom sou trou. Is dit reg?
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Die HERE is my herder; niks sal my ontbreek nie. ~ Psalm 23:1

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Re: Bespreking // Discussion

Postby Leviwosc » 2012-06-11, 22:30

Nee sy sou enkel blyf lewe as sy trou.
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Re: Bespreking // Discussion

Postby Shiba » 2012-06-12, 10:45

O, ek verstaan. Bly lewe op Mauritius, dan?
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Die HERE is my herder; niks sal my ontbreek nie. ~ Psalm 23:1

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Re: Bespreking // Discussion

Postby Reinder » 2012-06-12, 14:33

Shiba wrote:O, ek verstaan. Bly lewe op Mauritius, dan?
As ek het goed begryp is Pieternella na Mauritius gestuur en is sy verplig jong te gaan trou, indien sy wil bly lewe. Ek hoop dat ek dit goed begrepe en verwoord het.
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Re: Bespreking // Discussion

Postby Lauren » 2012-07-30, 6:34

To any speaker of Afrikaans, is there any dialect of the language that uses /ɹ/ for "r", like in Dutch? Thank you to anyone for an answer!
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Re: Bespreking // Discussion

Postby Weerwolf » 2012-07-30, 8:12

Hildakojon wrote:To any speaker of Afrikaans, is there any dialect of the language that uses /ɹ/ for "r", like in Dutch? Thank you to anyone for an answer!

I'm afraid, there isn't. The rolled r is the standard in Afrikaans, but I remember reading somewhere that a guttural r (just like used in French) is being used in some rural regions around Cape Town.
What about learning the rolled r, so you can make use of it in Afrikaans and in Dutch as well? :)
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Re: Bespreking // Discussion

Postby Shiba » 2012-07-30, 11:24

There is at least one dialect that makes use of the guttural r. :) It's the Malmesbury dialect. We say, "Dis die Malmesburrry-boerrre wat brrrei" ("brei" means using the guttural r. ... It also means knitting, but in a different context :P ).

In the Cape it's probably more normal to use the guttural r, but up here (and in most of the country), the only people who use it are people from Malmesbury, Germany or the Netherlands. :P

I agree with Weerwolf - try to learn the rolled r, if you don't use it already, because not only is it more common in Afrikaans, it's also the standard pronunciation of "r" in most languages. :)
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Re: Bespreking // Discussion

Postby Lauren » 2012-07-30, 17:18

Thank you both very much for the answers. Well, I can make both the guttural and trilled R, but my fiancee can do neither. :P Maybe I can teach her how to do the guttural R, but I've tried teaching her to trill and I don't think she can do it. She may have an issue with the tongue muscle which makes her unable to do it. The trill, along with the guttural G, are the biggest obstacles for us learning Afrikaans together, so I was hoping she could get away with an approximant R.
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Re: Bespreking // Discussion

Postby Shiba » 2012-07-30, 17:58

Well, if she really can't do the trill R, then try to teach her the guttural one. And if she can't do that one either, she can use the soft R. People will understand her, she just won't sound like a native Afrikaner. But very few foreigners do - even many local people still have accents if their mother tongue isn't Afrikaans.

After all, my mother tongue is Afrikaans, but if I speak German a lot, I start speaking Afrikaans with a German accent.

Basically, sounding 100% like a Boer isn't something you need to feel you absolutely have to aim for. :P
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Re: Bespreking // Discussion

Postby Weerwolf » 2012-07-30, 18:00

Shiba wrote:I agree with Weerwolf - try to learn the guttural r, if you don't use it already, because not only is it more common in Afrikaans, it's also the standard pronunciation of "r" in most languages. :)

Jy bedoel beslis 'n tongpunt-r (=alveolaire tril) wat in Afrikaans en ook in my moedertaal gebruik word, aangesien 'n guttural r die Franse r is.[/quote]
Agggg ja, dankie. ^^;
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Re: Bespreking // Discussion

Postby Weerwolf » 2012-08-02, 16:53

Hoe is dit moontlik dat jy in my bydrag kon antwoord? :D Baie interessant, vind ek. Ek dink dat dele van my bydrag verdwyn het.

Ek het 'n vraag: Op die radio het ek gehoor dat die 'Midde-Ooste' as mirre-ooste uitgespreek word. Kom dit dikwels voor dat mense -dd- as -rr- uitspreek?
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Re: Bespreking // Discussion

Postby Shiba » 2012-08-03, 19:35

Ek is jammer. :P Ek het per ongeluk op "Edit" geklik eerder as "Quote" en dit nooooit opgetel nie. Verskoon my rye en reekse foute! Ek kan darem sê dis eksamentyd. >.>

Ja, dit is algemeen dat "dd" as "rr" uitgespreek word. :)
Native: Afrikaans (af) English (en) || Intermediate: German (South African variant, Springbokdeutsch) (de) || Beginner: Some odd combination of Riksmål and Bokmål and whatever (no) || Learning on-and-off: Russian (ru) || Curious: Breton (br) Welsh (cy) Finnish (fi)
Korrigere feilene mine, vær så snill!

Die HERE is my herder; niks sal my ontbreek nie. ~ Psalm 23:1

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Re: Bespreking // Discussion

Postby Weerwolf » 2012-08-03, 20:18

Shiba wrote:Ek is jammer. :P Ek het per ongeluk op "Edit" geklik eerder as "Quote" en dit nooooit opgetel nie. Versoon my rye en reekse foute! Ek kan darem sê dis eksamentyd. >.>

Ja, dit is algemeen dat "dd" as "rr" uitgespreek word. :)

Kyk wat gebeur sedert jy moderator is. Jy het 'n nuwe mag gekry om boodskape nie alleen te aanhaal nie maar teselfdertyd hulle ook te wysig. :D
Wees nie bang nie, nie die woede spreek vanuit my (en ek maak jou ook geen verwyt nie), ek het dit alleen raar gevond dat iets met my boodskap gebeur het.
Trouens, gelukwensing met jou bevordering tot 'n moderator. :D

Baie dankie vir jou antwoord!

P.S.: Sterkte met die eksamens!!
In het middelpunt staan:  (nl)  (nl-BE)  (af)  (de) (hr)  (sr)  (ru)  (pl)
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