"Tämjts"

Moderator:Johanna

User avatar
Prosper_Youplaboum
Posts:263
Joined:2010-12-21, 19:33
Gender:male
Country:BEBelgium (België / Belgique)
Re: "Tämjts"

Postby Prosper_Youplaboum » 2011-10-20, 21:07

I'd like to hear recordings of all of you, pronouncing that word :)
Agur Xibe’ua,
Bazter güzietako xokho’ik eijerrena,
Agur sor lekhia,
Zu’i ditit ene ametsik goxuenak.

User avatar
Hunef
Posts:9532
Joined:2004-01-21, 20:55
Gender:male
Country:SESweden (Sverige)

Re: "Tämjts"

Postby Hunef » 2011-10-20, 21:35

Dingbats wrote:Says who? It doesn't for me, obviously.
OK, when thinking about it I've noticed that Mälardalen Swedish is somewhat suffused with a tendency of general consonant palatalisation, similar (but not to the same extent as) Russian. This may explain why [mʲ] is possible in your speech in positions where it's not possible for me.

Prosper_Youplaboum wrote:I'd like to hear recordings of all of you, pronouncing that word :)
When I'm trying to pronounce tämjts with a non-silent j it turns out like [ˈtʰɛmʲːjəts], [ˈtʰɛmːəjts] and - most often - [ˈtʰɛjmts]. :?
Last edited by Hunef on 2011-10-20, 21:42, edited 1 time in total.
But the fact that some geniuses were laughed at does not imply that all who are laughed at are geniuses. They laughed at Columbus, they laughed at Fulton, they laughed at the Wright Brothers. But they also laughed at Bozo the Clown.
Carl Sagan

User avatar
Jurgen Wullenwever
Posts:2876
Joined:2009-04-10, 19:32
Gender:male
Country:SESweden (Sverige)

Re: "Tämjts"

Postby Jurgen Wullenwever » 2011-10-21, 15:52

I speak Western Maelardalian, so I do not know whether that palatalisation has something to do with me, but back to the verb now, we do have a modern tendency to create a new supine out of the infinitive and present, which in this case would be "tämjits", where the last t is silent in Sweonic speech, while the i is silent in Geatic, resulting in either tämjis and tämjts.
Chekhov wrote:I don't know about naive worldviews, but Jurgen Wullenwhatever pisses me off to no end because of his extreme pessimism and cynicism. You'd think the world was going to end imminently when talking to that guy.

Jag är rebell: jag sockrar teet, saltar maten, cyklar utan hjälm, och tänder glödlampor.
(Ovanstående var förut, nu försöker jag minska sockret och saltet, och har gett upp mejeriprodukter.)

User avatar
Johanna
Language Forum Moderator
Posts:6679
Joined:2006-09-17, 18:05
Real Name:Johanna
Gender:female
Location:Lidköping, Westrogothia
Country:SESweden (Sverige)

Re: "Tämjts"

Postby Johanna » 2011-10-21, 16:19

As I've already said, in this word, I wouldn't pronounce the j when it's followed by a consonant, it might be palatlised, but i doubt it. Accent + dialect btw.
Swedish (sv) native; English (en) good; Norwegian (no) read fluently, understand well, speak badly; Danish (dk) read fluently, understand badly, can't speak; Faroese (fo) read some, understand a bit, speak a few sentences; German (de) French (fr) Spanish (es) forgetting; heritage language.

User avatar
Hunef
Posts:9532
Joined:2004-01-21, 20:55
Gender:male
Country:SESweden (Sverige)

Re: "Tämjts"

Postby Hunef » 2011-10-21, 20:40

Jurgen Wullenwever wrote:I speak Western Maelardalian,
I thought it was Middle Swedish (mellansvenska). To me Western Mälardalian is more like what they speak in Västerås and Eskilstuna, i.e., the transitional area between Up-Swedish (uppsvenska) and Middle Swedish.

Jurgen Wullenwever wrote:so I do not know whether that palatalisation has something to do with me,
If you have that palatalised r ("böckej" instead of böcker) sound so typical for stockholmers you probably have the kind of generalized palatalisation I refer to.
But the fact that some geniuses were laughed at does not imply that all who are laughed at are geniuses. They laughed at Columbus, they laughed at Fulton, they laughed at the Wright Brothers. But they also laughed at Bozo the Clown.
Carl Sagan

User avatar
Jurgen Wullenwever
Posts:2876
Joined:2009-04-10, 19:32
Gender:male
Country:SESweden (Sverige)

Re: "Tämjts"

Postby Jurgen Wullenwever » 2011-10-21, 21:32

Hunef wrote:I thought it was Middle Swedish (mellansvenska). To me Western Mälardalian is more like what they speak in Västerås and Eskilstuna, i.e., the transitional area between Up-Swedish (uppsvenska) and Middle Swedish.

Those places seems to be part of the Gnellbeltian region as well. The Hielmer lake is part of the Maelardale. (How fun to invent Latino-English versions of Swedish placenames. :D )

Hunef wrote:If you have that palatalised r ("böckej" instead of böcker) sound so typical for stockholmers you probably have the kind of generalized palatalisation I refer to.

In that case I probably do not have it.
Chekhov wrote:I don't know about naive worldviews, but Jurgen Wullenwhatever pisses me off to no end because of his extreme pessimism and cynicism. You'd think the world was going to end imminently when talking to that guy.

Jag är rebell: jag sockrar teet, saltar maten, cyklar utan hjälm, och tänder glödlampor.
(Ovanstående var förut, nu försöker jag minska sockret och saltet, och har gett upp mejeriprodukter.)

User avatar
Hunef
Posts:9532
Joined:2004-01-21, 20:55
Gender:male
Country:SESweden (Sverige)

Re: "Tämjts"

Postby Hunef » 2011-10-21, 21:48

Jurgen Wullenwever wrote:Those places seems to be part of the Gnellbeltian region as well. The Hielmer lake is part of the Maelardale.
Maybe you're right. I just think Örebro is situated too close to Värmland (which is almost Southeastern Norway!) to be part of Mälardalen.
But the fact that some geniuses were laughed at does not imply that all who are laughed at are geniuses. They laughed at Columbus, they laughed at Fulton, they laughed at the Wright Brothers. But they also laughed at Bozo the Clown.
Carl Sagan

derevon
Posts:785
Joined:2008-07-20, 23:16
Real Name:Per Eriksson
Gender:male
Location:Wrocław
Country:PLPoland (Polska)
Contact:

Re: "Tämjts"

Postby derevon » 2011-10-22, 9:59

Try going to this page: http://www.acapela-group.com/text-to-sp ... -demo.html

Choose "Sweden - Erik", paste the line below into the text field and click on "SAY IT!".

"tämjts ... tämts"

In my opinion some degree of palatalization is necessary here for this word to sound good.
Proszę poprawiać moje błędy [flag]pl[/flag]

User avatar
Hunef
Posts:9532
Joined:2004-01-21, 20:55
Gender:male
Country:SESweden (Sverige)

Re: "Tämjts"

Postby Hunef » 2011-10-22, 16:54

derevon wrote:In my opinion some degree of palatalization is necessary here for this word to sound good.
I beg to differ. :hmm:
But the fact that some geniuses were laughed at does not imply that all who are laughed at are geniuses. They laughed at Columbus, they laughed at Fulton, they laughed at the Wright Brothers. But they also laughed at Bozo the Clown.
Carl Sagan

User avatar
Dingbats
Posts:3497
Joined:2005-01-22, 10:17
Gender:male
Location:Lund (född i Stockholm)
Country:SESweden (Sverige)
Contact:

Re: "Tämjts"

Postby Dingbats » 2011-10-22, 17:20

Hunef wrote:
derevon wrote:In my opinion some degree of palatalization is necessary here for this word to sound good.
I beg to differ. :hmm:

Fine! It's nice to have dialectal/idiolectal/whateverlectal differences.

User avatar
Hunef
Posts:9532
Joined:2004-01-21, 20:55
Gender:male
Country:SESweden (Sverige)

Re: "Tämjts"

Postby Hunef » 2011-10-22, 17:54

Dingbats wrote:Fine! It's nice to have dialectal/idiolectal/whateverlectal differences.
The artificialness in "tämjts" hurts my eyes (when read) and ears (when pronounced), though. :?
But the fact that some geniuses were laughed at does not imply that all who are laughed at are geniuses. They laughed at Columbus, they laughed at Fulton, they laughed at the Wright Brothers. But they also laughed at Bozo the Clown.
Carl Sagan

User avatar
Prosper_Youplaboum
Posts:263
Joined:2010-12-21, 19:33
Gender:male
Country:BEBelgium (België / Belgique)

Re: "Tämjts"

Postby Prosper_Youplaboum » 2011-10-22, 17:59

I tried what you said, I typed tämjts ici
http://www.acapela-group.com/text-to-sp ... -demo.html

and the pronunciation you get, is rather [tʰɛmits]...
Agur Xibe’ua,
Bazter güzietako xokho’ik eijerrena,
Agur sor lekhia,
Zu’i ditit ene ametsik goxuenak.

derevon
Posts:785
Joined:2008-07-20, 23:16
Real Name:Per Eriksson
Gender:male
Location:Wrocław
Country:PLPoland (Polska)
Contact:

Re: "Tämjts"

Postby derevon » 2011-10-22, 19:10

Prosper_Youplaboum wrote:I tried what you said, I typed tämjts ici
http://www.acapela-group.com/text-to-sp ... -demo.html

and the pronunciation you get, is rather [tʰɛmits]...


Did you choose the speaker "Erik"? I agree that "Elin" and "Emma" pretty much sound like that there. This is synthetic speech after all, but for single words it's usually flawless if you ask me. With "Erik" "tämjts" sounds to me like [tʰɛmʲts] whereas "tämits" sounds like [tʰɛmits].

Try "Erik" and copy this line below and you should hear a clear difference between the two:

tämjts ... tämits

Hunef wrote:The artificialness in "tämjts" hurts my eyes (when read) and ears (when pronounced), though.


I can agree that it doesn't look very good, but it sounds just natural to me.
Proszę poprawiać moje błędy [flag]pl[/flag]


Return to “Swedish (Svenska)”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 10 guests