Turkish and Turkic languages

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Aymeric
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Turkish and Turkic languages

Postby Aymeric » 2005-05-17, 20:39

Hi

I've heard that Turkish is spoken from the Black Sea to the West of China, with minor geographical variations.

Is it true that these variations are really "minor" ?
Is it possible for a Turkish to speak to an Ouigur ?

I'm asking, because I heard a conversation between a Turkish and a Kurdish, and they seemed to have trouble understanding each other sometimes...
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Postby alois » 2005-05-17, 22:09

Aymeric wrote:Is it true that these variations are really "minor" ?


Not at all, many of these languages are spoken by millions of people. :wink:

Aymeric wrote:Is it possible for a Turkish to speak to an Ouigur ?


I don't think so. :)

I'm asking, because I heard a conversation between a Turkish and a Kurdish, and they seemed to have trouble understanding each other sometimes...


Of course, because Turkish is an Altaic language while Kurdish is an Indo-European (Indo-Aryan) one, related to languages such as Persian, Tajik and Ossetian. :wink: Perhaps they were using another language.

By the way, here is a map of the Turkic languages:

http://titus.uni-frankfurt.de/didact/ka ... urklfa.jpg
Last edited by alois on 2005-05-17, 22:35, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby alois » 2005-05-17, 22:22

Here is the first article of the Declaration of Human Rights in three of them if you want to make a comparison (Turkish, Kazakh, Uyghur): :wink:

Turkish
Bütün insanlar hür, haysiyet ve haklar bakımından eşit doğarlar. Akıl ve vicdana sahiptirler ve birbirlerine karşı kardeşlik zihniyeti ile hareket etmelidirler.

Kazakh
Barlyq adamdar tumysynan azat ǧäne qadîr-qasietî men kûqyqtary teŋ bolyp düniege keledî. Adamdarġa aqyl-parasat, ar-oǧdan berîlgen, sondyqtan olar bîr-bîrîmen tuystyq, bauyrmaldyq qarym-qatynas ǧasaulary tiîs.

Uyghur
Hemme adem zanidinla erkin, izzet-hörmet we hoquqta bapbarawer bolup tughulghan. Ular eqilge we wijdan'gha ige hemde bir-birige qérindashliq munasiwitige xas roh bilen muamile qilishi kérek.

Alper

Postby Alper » 2005-05-21, 7:41

That sucks.
I can't understand what the other two are saying. Just can pick up words like men or free but the rest is incomprehensible.
I've always thought we would be able to communicate somehow.
Obviously I was wrong.
Anyone has any first hand experiences on this issue?

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Postby alois » 2005-05-21, 16:11

I've always thought we would be able to communicate somehow.
Obviously I was wrong.


That's like expecting a Scots speaker to understand a Swede or a Hebrew to understand a Moroccan Arab, no point in that.

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Postby Rex » 2005-09-10, 12:29

The closest to Anatolian turkish is azeri and they are sometimes upto 95% mutually intelligible. Crimean tatar and turcoman also seem to be close but I don't understand them as well as I would understand azeri. Although I can decipher some texts if written in the latin script.

Kazakh as far as I heard is the furthest from turkish. I met at least one kazakh and did not understand a word he said. The same goes for Uygur and Uzbek.

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Postby zhiguli » 2005-10-03, 16:18

This could be a useful tool for comparison:
http://www.turan.tc/klavuz/
This is a phrasebook with parallel phrases in 8 Turkic languages (all written in Turkish transcription).
I think, as already shown, it's largely a myth that all Turkic languages are mutually intelligible. But, like Romance or Slavic languages, knowing one helps a great deal in learning another.
Another thing that helps, interestingly enough, is a knowledge of Persian/Arabic. Persian/Arabic loans that were purged from Turkish long ago still exist in great number in languages like Azeri, Turkmen, Uzbek, etc.
I'm looking at some grammars of Yakut and Chuvash (said to be the most divergent of the Turkic languages) and while it's not hard to see the connections between Turkish and Yakut, Chuvash is way out there, even the Turkic roots of words are cleverly disguised.

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Postby neslihan » 2005-12-04, 1:04

well I understand half of the texts in the other two languages. The words are similar but mainly the synonyms are used for example in turkish text insanlar is used meaning people. Adamlar is also Turkish (adamdar, adem in the other two texts)

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Postby zhiguli » 2005-12-06, 13:23

insan انسان and adam آدم are arabic
خاصیت haysiyet/qasiet قدیر qadir حق\حقوق hak/hoquq/kuqyq
عقل aqyl/akıl/eqil
دنیا dünie
ذهنیت zihniyet
etc
all arabic words
and some persian ones like همه hemme برابر barawer آزاد azat...
almost half the words are arabic/persian.

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Postby arwenmarcos » 2006-02-24, 10:00

it's true that turkish has arabic words, after turkish poeple became muslim, it happened.

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Turcoman

Postby 0stsee » 2007-08-16, 14:43

Rex wrote:The closest to Anatolian turkish is azeri and they are sometimes upto 95% mutually intelligible. Crimean tatar and turcoman also seem to be close but I don't understand them as well as I would understand azeri. Although I can decipher some texts if written in the latin script.

Kazakh as far as I heard is the furthest from turkish. I met at least one kazakh and did not understand a word he said. The same goes for Uygur and Uzbek.


Where is Turcoman spoken?

Azeri is the language of Azerbaijan, isn't it?


MarK

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Re: Turcoman

Postby Alcadras » 2007-08-16, 14:57

0stsee wrote:
Rex wrote:The closest to Anatolian turkish is azeri and they are sometimes upto 95% mutually intelligible. Crimean tatar and turcoman also seem to be close but I don't understand them as well as I would understand azeri. Although I can decipher some texts if written in the latin script.

Kazakh as far as I heard is the furthest from turkish. I met at least one kazakh and did not understand a word he said. The same goes for Uygur and Uzbek.



Azeri is the language of Azerbaijan, isn't it?


MarK


Yes.

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Re: Turcoman

Postby loqu » 2007-08-16, 15:04

0stsee wrote:Where is Turcoman spoken?


Turcoman is also known as Turkmen, it's the official language of Turkmenistan.
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Postby kalemiye » 2007-08-16, 20:14

are kyrgiz and anatolian turkish intelligible? My teacher of turkish has a kyrgiz student and they speak in turkish, each on in their language and can understand each other almost perfectly. My teacher told me that, to him, kyrgiz sounds like old turkish.
"Demə Məcnuna dəli, bəlkədə Leyla dəlidir
Eşq olan yerdə bütün aqilü dana dəlidir.
"

Not available
"Düşdü yenə dəli könlüm gözlərinin xəyalinə,
Kim nə bilir bu könlümün fikri nədir, xəyalini.
"

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Postby Mert » 2007-08-16, 20:40

we can understand Kyrgiz, Turkmen, Uzbek, Kazakh Turkish; but not well.

we can understand Azeri Turkish better than the other ones.
ه ه
ل
پ

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Wow

Postby 0stsee » 2007-08-16, 21:18

Mert wrote:we can understand Kyrgiz, Turkmen, Uzbek, Kazakh Turkish; but not well.

we can understand Azeri Turkish better than the other ones.


Wow, that's a bunch of good reasons to learn Turkish. :)

I thought Kyrgyz, Uzbek and Kazakh were unintelligible to Turkey Turks..


MarK
Last edited by 0stsee on 2007-08-16, 21:39, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Wow

Postby Alcadras » 2007-08-16, 21:30

0stsee wrote:
Mert wrote:we can understand Kyrgiz, Turkmen, Uzbek, Kazakh Turkish; but not well.

we can understand Azeri Turkish better than the other ones.




I thought Kyrgyz, Uzbek and Kazakh were unintelligible to Turkey Turks..


MarK

I think they are. :roll: I can't understand Kazakh,Ozbek and Kyrgiz. But we can understand %90 of Azeri.

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Turkmen

Postby 0stsee » 2007-08-17, 12:33

If a Turkish Turk can understand 90% od Azeri, how much Turkmen would s/he understand?

I think I read a Kazakh saying that he understood about 40% of Turkish.


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Postby Alcadras » 2007-08-17, 12:58

Kazakh is written in Cyrillic. Maybe that's why we can't understand. :lol:
I actually can't understand Turkhmen.

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Postby ego » 2007-08-17, 15:08

I think there is a continuum between Turkish and Azeri.. that means that Azeri could be classified as an eastern Turkish dialect. Let me tell you however, as a foreigner who has studied Turkish, that you have to be more than fluent in Turkish in order to understand its similar languages. To me, central Asian languages are unintelligible except for small sentences. And don't forget that most of them are spelled in the Cyrillic alphabet which makes understanding even harder. Actually I think Turks too don't understand Kazakh or Uzbek..


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