Moderator:voron
Mert wrote:After 6th class, the Ottoman Turkish lesson should be added into the curriculum.
neutral wrote:Sadly after this reform,majority of our peoples dont even understand speech to Turkish youth of the great Mustafa Kemal,whereas Persians can read and understand 10 th century Ferdowssi's shahname and Arabes can read and undestand 5th century mulleqat al sab3(7 poems)and also 7 th century coran.
Mert wrote:After 6th class, the Ottoman Turkish lesson should be added into the curriculum.
Hypocrisy wrote:
It's mosty likely to encounter an aggressive resistance coming from the secular segment of society.
utku wrote:Hypocrisy wrote:
It's mosty likely to encounter an aggressive resistance coming from the secular segment of society.
that was paranoic, you know...
utku wrote:
writing turkish with arabic alphabet was really ridiculus if you consider the wovel harmony. although all roots of words were written with their consonants mainly, without proper wovels and with strange suffixes words were like egyptian hieroglyphs or chinese words. then why did turks adopted it at first hand? the answer is the power of islam only. like christian turks adopted greek alphabet in anatolia and cyrillic in gagauzia. with new turkish alphabet, it wouldn't had been reasonable to keep all those persian and arabic words. it is also true that officials went to the extremes in the reform sometimes.
although all roots of words were written with their consonants mainly, without proper wovels and with strange suffixes words were like egyptian hieroglyphs or chinese words.
Mert wrote:although all roots of words were written with their consonants mainly, without proper wovels and with strange suffixes words were like egyptian hieroglyphs or chinese words.
That''s totally wrong! All wovels are written in Turkish with the Arabic script, but "e" wovel. "E" wovel is only used in the capital and the end of the word.
utku wrote:consequently, turkish is from venus arabic is from mars... arabic alpabet is useful for the languages in which conjugations and derivations are realized by inserting sounds into the roots and adding prefixes and suffixes at the same time. turkish alphabet suits my language the best and it is for synthetic languages (doesn't mean sentetik in turkish by the way, it doesn't mean made-up), for syllables and for vowel harmony.
Mert wrote:utku wrote:
writing turkish with arabic alphabet was really ridiculus if you consider the wovel harmony. although all roots of words were written with their consonants mainly, without proper wovels and with strange suffixes words were like egyptian hieroglyphs or chinese words. then why did turks adopted it at first hand? the answer is the power of islam only. like christian turks adopted greek alphabet in anatolia and cyrillic in gagauzia. with new turkish alphabet, it wouldn't had been reasonable to keep all those persian and arabic words. it is also true that officials went to the extremes in the reform sometimes.
Iranian Azeris, Uyghurs write Turkish in Arabic script. Turks used the Arabic script during 1000 years over. It's nonsense to think that the Arabic alphabet works in Iran, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Uyghuristan, Arab countries, but Turkey .
The Arabic alphabet isn't so pratic as the Latin one for Turkish, but every language can be written in every alphabet. Did no Turks understand the texts in Turkish before the alphabet revolution in 1928?
Removing the alphabet was an operation which was realised to keep away Turks from the middle east.
neutral wrote:Quran is understood by Arabs or at least by the ones who went to secondary schools.
Yunus Emre is from 13 th century not 11 th century(in 11 th century Turkish was most likely not even spoken in Turkey).
Yunus Emre's Turkish is distinct from modern Istanbul Turkish,and of course Turkish used by villagers will be most logically simpler and poorer than the Turkish used by litterate peoples,this is true for all languages(french,english,german etc...)and not only Turkish,but still Turkish used by villagers contained many foreign words.
Here a poem from Yunus Emre and I will mark foreign words with red color:
Aşk Bezirganı
Aşk bezirganı
Sermaye canı
Bahadır gördüm
Cana kıyanı
Zehi bahadır
Can terkin urur
Kılıç mı keser
Himmet giyeni
Kamusun bir gör
Kemterin er gör
Alu görmegil
Palas giyeni
Tez çıkarırlar
Fevkal'ulaya
Şol isa gibi
Dünya koyanı
Tez indirirler
Tahtesseraya Bir karun gibi
Dünya kovanı
Aşık olanın
Nişanı vardır
Melamet olur
Belli beyanı
kalemiye wrote: Unfortunately, that is so true.
utku wrote:kalemiye wrote: Unfortunately, that is so true.
what's true?
hypocrisy wrote:It's mosty likely to encounter an aggressive resistance coming from the secular segment of society.
kalemiye wrote:Late Ottoman Turkish is as artificial as you can get, having a more Turkish grammar in use and the Latin alphabet I think was good, but I don't quite see the point of changing the vocabulary.
Ottoman Turkish was the richer and most versatile language in the Middle East and it's a pity it is not used as such anymore, but let's not decry the language reform. I think it made Turkish easier to write and read and in general it helped raising the country's literacy level, along with other measures.
kalemiye wrote:utku wrote:kalemiye wrote: Unfortunately, that is so true.
what's true?
This:hypocrisy wrote:It's mosty likely to encounter an aggressive resistance coming from the secular segment of society.
utku wrote:kalemiye wrote:Late Ottoman Turkish is as artificial as you can get, having a more Turkish grammar in use and the Latin alphabet I think was good, but I don't quite see the point of changing the vocabulary.
Ottoman Turkish was the richer and most versatile language in the Middle East and it's a pity it is not used as such anymore, but let's not decry the language reform. I think it made Turkish easier to write and read and in general it helped raising the country's literacy level, along with other measures.
nobody is hanged because of using bombastic ottoman jargon, hence anyone preferring to use it is free to use it. and be sure that a notable number of people who were developed themselves in rhetoric somehow adopts such a high language. i don't understand how can people claim that they are not permitted to use a high language. it depends on person whether they adopt it. of course it requires spending time on reading, thinking writing. some people grow lazy and do nothing about their language skills and then blame language reform as if it was the only reason of their dim language skills. what are they copmlaining about in fact? no language reform is powerful enough to regulate the words to be used. so called language reform was not the action of changing the vocabulary. it was a project conducted by türk dil kurumu who suggested new words, revived ancient turkish words and revised the grammar rules based on new alphabet as a result of this project. it was not such a big deal like banning words.
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