There's this thing that occurred to me the other day as I read this articel on Vice:
I Love Wolf Whistles and Catcalls; Am I a Bad Feminist?You can probably all guess how much of a divide there can be between people who are calling for an end to catcalling (/street harrassment) and people who come out and openly say "I liked it, gimme sum more".
Now, personally I don't have much experience of catcalling or street harrassment because it was just not a very common thing when I was growing up, and now I'm a bit too old to be a prime target for that kind of stuff (yay!). However, I have numerous times vitnessed and experienced how some men try to control public space by intimidation.* And succeed in doing so as well. So for me that is something that happens, is a fact, and someone's personal account of how
they have never noticed it will not have a huge impact on that. But I do accept those kinds of accounts as genuine. And I totally accept that there are women who genuinely enjoy catcalls and would even want more of them.
(*Actually, just a couple of weeks ago I had one of these experiences. It surprised me a little -- I'm so old and grumpy that I don't blip on these kinds of men's radar much anymore and I had almost forgotten that it happens. I was waiting for my boyfriend outside a café in the busiest cente of Helsinki in broad daylight. In just a couple of minutes, I get a hoverer. He's a bit older and a lot bigger than me. Ostensibly strolling around smoking an electric cigarrette. But I can see him looking at me from sideways. He strolls closer, sort of, then further away again. I mentally shrug and decide to read the plaque of a statue that I've never bothered to read before. Suddenly he's standing there too, ostensibly reading it. Okay. I turn away from it. He starts doing fly-bys. He walks away, then walks past me real close. Ridiculously close because there's nobody else within a 10 m radius. He likes especially to approach from behind at an angle. I'm like "seriously?". Then he goes for the finale: he stops right in front of me. Still trying to look like he's just enjoying his cigarette. But at the same time he's broken a good handful of social scripts. Who goes stand right in front of another person in a street area where nobody else is immediately close? And then he breaks another few by staring me straight in the eyes. Now look, I'm old enough and feministically-aware enough and cis-privileged enough that I don't fear for my safety. In fact, I'm seconds away from bursting out laughing at the Kafka-essness of encountering entitled men. But also Finnish enough that it doesn't occur to me to say anything to him -- maybe I could have come up with something witty or absurd. Also, I'm aware of the remaining 1% chance that he's mentally retarded and it just doesn't show, and I don't want to be mean to people like that. But the moment passes, he smiles smugly and walks away, sits down on a bench further away. I know this wasn't love. This was "I'm going to make you feel uncomfortable alone in public space because I'm bored and bigger than you, volume 254.")Anyway, the thing that occurred to me is that the discussion between the two camps on this issue is actually remarkably similar to the discussion between the pro-spanking and anti-spanking camps of child rearing.
First of all, it can almost never avoid getting heated, and quickly. Second, there is a huge divide in scope of perspective between the two camps in both issues. Thirdly, there is a mistrust and contempt going both ways between the two camps in both issues. And I mean, consider these exchanges (that I have encountered, but am of course paraphrasing here):
SpankingPro: I was spanked as a child and it didn't do me any harm, in fact I benefitted from it.
Anti: Well good for you, I personally didn't enjoy being belted and slapped for no good reasons and hating my parents for it.
Pro: That's not what I mean by spanking.
CatcallingPro: I've been catcalled and it didn't make me feel threatened. In fact it flattered me.
Anti: Well good for you. I persoanlly didn't enjoy being followed around by men twice my size and in vans and being told "I'd hold a knife to that" or "I'd fuck you up the ass" even since I was 9.
Pro: That's not what I mean by catcalling.
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Spanking:Anti: Spanking is hitting and hitting is abuse. Spanking erodes confidence in children.
Pro: Spanking is not hitting and also not abuse. Spanking teaches right from wrong.
Catcalling:Anti: Catcalling is malevolent and harrassment. Catcalling makes public space unwelcoming to women.
Pro: Catcalling is neither malevolent or harrassment. Catcalling makes women feel more beautiful.
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Spanking:Pro: People who are anti like to make such victims of themselves. But we can all cope with a bit of spanking. And anyway, it's all in the mindset -- if you stop being such a special snowflake and take the attitude that spanking makes you better and stronger then you'd enjoy it more.
Anti: I can't believe you're dismissing my feelings of having been mistreated with a shrug. And your only advice seems to be for me to learn to enjoy my abuse, then it would all be better. It's the abuser's job to stop.
Then it would be better.
Catcalling:Pro: People who are anti like to make such victims of themselves. But we can all cope with a bit of catcalling. And anyway, it's all in the mindset -- if you stop being such a special snowflake and take the attitude that catcalling makes you prettier and more attractive then you'd enjoy it more.
Anti: I can't believe you're dismissing my feelings of having been mistreated with a shrug. And your only advice seems to be for me to learn to enjoy my abuse, then it would all be better. It's the abuser's job to stop.
Then it would be better.
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Spanking:Pro: If you say spanking is wrong, then you are saying my beloved parents are abusive.
Anti: A person can be doing abusive things without bad intention and out of cultural influence or ignorance.
Catcalling:Pro: If you say catcalling is wrong, then you are saying this man that I knew who catcalled was abusive, even if I knew him and liked him.
Anti: A person can be doing abusive things without bad intention and out of cultural influence or ignorance.
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Spanking:Pro: If spanking is done with good intentions, without anger and without causing pain or damage by good level-headed parents, then there's nothing wrong with it. This is what I call spanking.
Anti: If all those conditions were met, there would be no need to actually follow through with the spanking in the first place. A parent like that could just use some other method that didn't involve hitting.
Catcalling:Pro: If catcalling is done with good intentions, without the intent to threaten and without causing fear or insult by a non-misogynistic man, then there's nothing wrong with it. This is what I call catcalling.
Anti: If a man had those intentions, there would be no need to actually follow through with the catcalling in the first place. A man like that could just use some other method that didn't involve demanding women's attention in public space.
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Spanking: Pro: What the hell is the problem with a spank here or there!? It's no big deal...! Jesus!
Anti: We see the issue as much bigger than a spank here or there in individual parent-child relationships. We see in play here a whole history and culture of non-recognision of children's rights, of a refusal to afford them the same protection from hitting that adults have, a refusal to recognise children as having valid feelings. Parents have been shown by studies, experience and testimony to be unable to exercise their right to hit responsibly, and the practice causes clear psychological damage that isn't counterweighted by an improved sense of discipline, life skills or knowledge of right and wrong in the children, because such effects are nonexistent. There is no defensible reason that parents should have an automatic right to hit.
Catcalling: Pro: What the hell is the problem with a catcall here or there!? It's no big deal...! Jesus!
Anti: We see the issue as much bigger than a catcall here or there in individual cases of women passing men on the street. We see in play here a whole history and culture of men controlling women through intimidation, of our cultural baggage of sexism and misogyny. We see this as a non-recognision of women's right to have equal presense in public space, as a refusal to afford them the same right to be left alone that men have, and as a refusal to recognise the effect catcalling has. Men have been shown by studies, experience and testimony to be unable to exercise their right to catcall responsibly, and the practice causes clear psychological damage that isn't counterweighted by an improved sense of confidence or a feeling of being pretty or attractive or appreciated as a human being in girls and women. Some women report an improvement in these areas but most women don't. There is no defensible reason that men should have an automatic right to catcall.
EDIT: Oh my god, I forgot the funny one:
Spanking:Pro: Like, omg I can't talk to you anti people without you going all extreme! If you call spanking abusive one more time...
Anti: We're trying to explain that we see spanking as abusive and violent and
that is why it is wrong.
Pro: Taliban! Fundamentalist! Creationist!
Catcalling: Pro: Like, omg I can't talk to you anti people without you going all extreme! I you call catcalling harrassment one more time...
Anti: We're trying to explain that we see catcalling as a subset of street harrassment, which is abusive, and
that is why it is wrong.
Pro: Fundamentalist! Patronising anti-feminist! Taliban!