Questions about Finnish / Kysymyksiä suomen kielestä

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Re: Questions about Finnish / Kysymyksiä suomen kielestä

Postby Iván » 2015-01-27, 15:01

0:56: Kädet ylös! (Literally means "Hands up")

4:24: Kiitos, Noora. Tota, Linda..."Tota" is used as a filler in Finnish. It would be like erm or so in English.

00:00-00:25: "Bald man: biisestä. Miks sust tää biisi? Noora Louhimo: No, siis, vaikka, siis noi biisit tossa levyllä on mun iän suosikkea, ja, mutta, tässä nimenomaan se biisi sen niinku minun mielestä ilmenee hyvän, hyvän biisin aina...siinä on hyvä melodia, tarttuvat riifit semmonen klassinen heavy metaliä rock kuuluu sitä"

I'm not a native speaker, so I migth have misunderstood some parts of her speech. I hope Finnish native speakers can do it better.
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Re: Questions about Finnish / Kysymyksiä suomen kielestä

Postby Kristjan » 2015-01-27, 16:29

Kiitos paljon, Iván!
That's very good for a start actually. It looks like I need my ears checked by a doctor, because I misheard a lot of words, I heard 'va(h)kka' instead of 'vaikka'. :) But I'm not even a beginner... so it is understandable that I can't really follow what is being said and they speak really fast.

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Re: Questions about Finnish / Kysymyksiä suomen kielestä

Postby Varislintu » 2015-01-27, 19:19

Iván wrote:0:56: Kädet ylös! (Literally means "Hands up")

4:24: Kiitos, Noora. Tota, Linda..."Tota" is used as a filler in Finnish. It would be like erm or so in English.

00:00-00:25: "Bald man: biisestä. Miks sust tää biisi? Noora Louhimo: No, siis, vaikka, siis noi biisit tossa levyllä on mun iän suosikkea, ja, mutta, tässä nimenomaan se biisi sen niinku minun mielestä ilmenee hyvän, hyvän biisin aina...siinä on hyvä melodia, tarttuvat riifit semmonen klassinen heavy metaliä rock kuuluu sitä"

I'm not a native speaker, so I migth have misunderstood some parts of her speech. I hope Finnish native speakers can do it better.


Very good, Iván! :) This is how I would transcribe all the Finnish:

-----
([Kaikista?] biiseistä) miks just tä biisi?

No, siis, vaikka siis kaikki noi biisit tossa levyllä on mun ihan suosikkeja,
ja, mutta, tässä nimenomaisessa biisissä, niinku minun mielestä ilmenee
hyvän, hyvän biisin ainekset ja siin on hyvä melodia, tarttuvat riffit ja semmonen
klassinen hevimetalli ja rock kuuluu siitä.

Kädet ylös!

Kiitos paljon!

Kiitos Noora. Tota, Linda, sun ekan sinkun videota "Wink, wink" on...
-----


Kristjan wrote: I heard 'va(h)kka' instead of 'vaikka'. :)


Don't be too hard on yourself, she does say it pretty much "vakka". :P In spoken Finnish you can with moderation take shortcuts in diphtongs and drop 'i' sounds, like the i in 'vaikka'. It's a bit unusual with this word, though -- at least I would say it's more often shortened to "vaik". :)

A good clip, she sang that song well, I think. :)
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Re: Questions about Finnish / Kysymyksiä suomen kielestä

Postby Kristjan » 2015-01-27, 22:19

Kiitos Varislintu!
Varislintu wrote:Don't be too hard on yourself, she does say it pretty much "vakka". :P In spoken Finnish you can with moderation take shortcuts in diphtongs and drop 'i' sounds, like the i in 'vaikka'. It's a bit unusual with this word, though -- at least I would say it's more often shortened to "vaik". :)

Haha, true. After having listened to some news in Finnish I thought I could hear out unknown words and write them down more or less correctly. With spoken (informal) Finnish it is simply not the case. :D

A good clip, she sang that song well, I think. :)

Without a doubt she's an amazing singer. Her singing puts lot of her male colleagues in the industry to shame. :mrgreen:

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Re: Questions about Finnish / Kysymyksiä suomen kielestä

Postby Kristjan » 2015-01-28, 16:00

One thing I forgot to ask was the kinship between Finnish and Hungarian. Is this linguistical Finno-Ugrian kinship being taught in schools or not?
I learnt about it in secondary school, mostly about the sound changes. The teacher showed us how we get from the Hungarian egér to the Finnish hiiri. It wasn't that plausible to me. :)
Origin of word roots in Hungarian
Uncertain 30%
Uralic 21%
Slavic 20%
German 11%
Turkic 9.5%
Latin and Greek 6%
Romance 2.5%
Other know 1%

However, there are some funny mondegreens that show the indisputable kinship between Finnish and Hungarian. :D I'm afraid it's only funny to us.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sw8O8u1C41w
The lyrics are crazy and absurd:
Vihar! Villany-vihar! – Storm, light-storm!
Bújj be orromba, szívem- Sneak into my nose, my heart


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=27TxCQz8kRY
Engem csak kúrt a dán – The Dane was only f***ing me.
A turha ollókon – The snot is on the scissors
Na gyere ottomán, nem vagy te afrikán – Now, come Ottoman, you’re not African

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Re: Questions about Finnish / Kysymyksiä suomen kielestä

Postby Varislintu » 2015-01-29, 14:17

Kristjan wrote:One thing I forgot to ask was the kinship between Finnish and Hungarian. Is this linguistical Finno-Ugrian kinship being taught in schools or not?


Yes, I did learn about Finnish's relative languages in Finnish class in school, and Hungarian was mentioned. :) However, I don't think we looked at Hungarian as a language in any way.

My boyfriend is Hungarian, and I've consequently spent many weeks in Hungary, and I think that as time has passed and I've gotten more familiar with the sound of Hungarian, I find it harder to say what it sounds like to me (if that makes any sense). I mean that I'm so used to its sound that it kind of washes over me as something familiar, I don't even notice. But in the beginning, I did find that it had a very similar rhythm as Finnish does. Muffled Hungarian could sound like Finnish to me.

But nowadays there is much less cultural exchange between Hungary and Finland than there used to be. My grandmother, when meeting my boyfirend, said warmly that "Hungarians are a relative people to Finns". There was much more of that sentiment around when she grew up than now.
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Re: Questions about Finnish / Kysymyksiä suomen kielestä

Postby Kristjan » 2015-01-29, 17:56

Varislintu wrote:My boyfriend is Hungarian, and I've consequently spent many weeks in Hungary, and I think that as time has passed and I've gotten more familiar with the sound of Hungarian, I find it harder to say what it sounds like to me (if that makes any sense). I mean that I'm so used to its sound that it kind of washes over me as something familiar, I don't even notice. But in the beginning, I did find that it had a very similar rhythm as Finnish does. Muffled Hungarian could sound like Finnish to me.

How good can he speak Finnish? Is having Hungarian as a mother tongue a big help in learning Finnish? Was it easy to learn? :D

But nowadays there is much less cultural exchange between Hungary and Finland than there used to be. My grandmother, when meeting my boyfirend, said warmly that "Hungarians are a relative people to Finns". There was much more of that sentiment around when she grew up than now.

I don't hear much about Finnish cultural programmes (not counting Lordi and HIM [coming back to Hungary after 12 years, and Ville Valo's mother is of Hungarian origin] concerts last year :D ) in Hungary, and I've never met a Finn in my life, so I guess Hungary isn't an attractive tourist destination (unless when they come to see their F1-drivers on Hungaroring :mrgreen: ) for Finns.

I don't want to speak in the name of all Hungarians, but I do have to make a generalisation, because most Hungarian (if they still remember it from school) see Finns as very distant relatives, and only linguistically kindred people.

Polish people are more likely to seen as brothers due to our long friendship and shared history and so far I have very positive experiences with Poles. We can get on well right from the beginning. We share some common vocabulary.

Turks call us their brothers too and our history showed that Turks can be our allies and their country a safe haven for Hungarians who fought against the Habsburgs. Although, the Ottoman rule which lasted more than 150 years was not a good example of brotherly love. :P Their language looks to me similar to ours, especially the grammar. I was at a language expo last year and got to know some basic Turkish grammar and it was pretty logical when I did the excercises.

A clichéd sentence of Turkish-Hungarian kinship:
Cebimde çok küçük sarı elma var.
Zsebemben sok kicsi sárga alma van.

There are lot of yellow apples in my pocket.

I prefer red or green apples. :) I would not give this theory too much credit, but as 30% of our vocabulary is still of uncertain origin, people tend to make up theories about relationship with other languages. There is enough room for speculations. :)

Logical similarity:
ház = ev (house)
házasodik = evlenmek (get married). Clearly these two words both meaning ’house’ are not related, but the logic to form a verb meaning ’get married’ is interesting.

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Re: Questions about Finnish / Kysymyksiä suomen kielestä

Postby Varislintu » 2015-01-30, 10:07

Kristjan wrote:How good can he speak Finnish? Is having Hungarian as a mother tongue a big help in learning Finnish? Was it easy to learn? :D


He understands Finnish pretty fluently, and speaks it almost fluently. I think he's said that the similarities in grammar were helpful.

Kristjan wrote:and I've never met a Finn in my life, so I guess Hungary isn't an attractive tourist destination (unless when they come to see their F1-drivers on Hungaroring :mrgreen: ) for Finns.


Oh no, that's not so, it's very popular nowadays. :yep: Especially since there's a cheap Wizzair connection to Budapest from Turku in the summer season. And I think almost all my boyfriends' colleagues turned out to have visited Budapest, when it came up in conversation.

I think Budapest is popular among the people who don't want to go on a beach resort holiday. It's a big city with prices that seem very affordable to Finns, and it's something "new" for people who are tired of Paris, London, etc. :)
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Re: Questions about Finnish / Kysymyksiä suomen kielestä

Postby Kristjan » 2015-01-30, 19:34

Varislintu wrote:He understands Finnish pretty fluently, and speaks it almost fluently. I think he's said that the similarities in grammar were helpful.

Thanks for asking him. :) I think, for me, the biggest hurdle would be the vocabulary. Apart from a few well-known cognates the rest of the Finnish words look almost alien.


Oh no, that's not so, it's very popular nowadays. :yep: Especially since there's a cheap Wizzair connection to Budapest from Turku in the summer season. And I think almost all my boyfriends' colleagues turned out to have visited Budapest, when it came up in conversation.

I think Budapest is popular among the people who don't want to go on a beach resort holiday. It's a big city with prices that seem very affordable to Finns, and it's something "new" for people who are tired of Paris, London, etc. :)

I usually travel a lot with public transportation, but I've never heard Finnish so far. Languages that I hear almost every day are Danish, Dutch, English (mostly American - they are pretty loud), German, Russian, Swedish.

Budapest is better than Paris or London. The city has a long history of spas and thermal baths, they're worth checking out after a sightseeing tour. :yep:

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Re: Questions about Finnish / Kysymyksiä suomen kielestä

Postby Iván » 2015-01-30, 23:04

Kristjan wrote:Thanks for asking him. :) I think, for me, the biggest hurdle would be the vocabulary. Apart from a few well-known cognates the rest of the Finnish words look almost alien.

While Finnish vocabulary is rather difficult to remember, it is a very logical language once you get used to its usage. I highly recommend that you start learning Finnish, provided you're interested in the language or in the country!
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Re: Questions about Finnish / Kysymyksiä suomen kielestä

Postby Kristjan » 2015-01-31, 23:23

Iván wrote:
Kristjan wrote:Thanks for asking him. :) I think, for me, the biggest hurdle would be the vocabulary. Apart from a few well-known cognates the rest of the Finnish words look almost alien.

While Finnish vocabulary is rather difficult to remember, it is a very logical language once you get used to its usage. I highly recommend that you start learning Finnish, provided you're interested in the language or in the country!

Thanks!
I might give it a go sometime in the future, but right now I don't want to bite off more than I can chew. :wink: My English and German need more practice.

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Re: Questions about Finnish / Kysymyksiä suomen kielestä

Postby hreru » 2015-02-21, 18:42

Kreikan velat ovan niin suuret, että...
Why is it not suuria?

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Re: Questions about Finnish / Kysymyksiä suomen kielestä

Postby Varislintu » 2015-02-26, 8:21

hreru wrote:Kreikan velat ovan niin suuret, että...
Why is it not suuria?


Because here the reference is to a specific group of debts. It could be said as "velat ovat niin suuria", too, and then the reference would be to an undefined mass of unspecific loans. :P
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Re: Questions about Finnish / Kysymyksiä suomen kielestä

Postby Helmi » 2015-03-29, 18:24

Hei guys and girls!

I need some help with translation of these words.
Vitun pelle
Olet nolo
What those words could mean if you say them about the person? Could it be offensive?

Also I could not understand this construction: Ootpas kaunis tänään/Ootpas ruma koulussa.

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Re: Questions about Finnish / Kysymyksiä suomen kielestä

Postby Varislintu » 2015-03-29, 21:34

Helmi wrote:Hei guys and girls!

I need some help with translation of these words.
Vitun pelle
Olet nolo
What those words could mean if you say them about the person? Could it be offensive?

Also I could not understand this construction: Ootpas kaunis tänään/Ootpas ruma koulussa.


Vitun pelle = You f-ing clown/moron.
Olet nolo = You're ambarrassing.

Ootpas kaunis tänään/Ootpas ruma koulussa = Well, aren't you pretty today! / Wow, how ugly you are at school.
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Re: Questions about Finnish / Kysymyksiä suomen kielestä

Postby Helmi » 2015-03-30, 22:06

Thank you!

So this ootpas or oletpas could be the same as olet, expecially in the second sentence "Ootpas ruma koulussa"?
And in the first sentence "Ootpas kaunis tänään", is it the same as "Et ole kaunis tänään"?
Aslso how would you translate "Oletpas/Ootpas kuollut". You should be dead or aren't you dead?

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Re: Questions about Finnish / Kysymyksiä suomen kielestä

Postby Varislintu » 2015-03-31, 19:12

Helmi wrote:Thank you!

So this ootpas or oletpas could be the same as olet, expecially in the second sentence "Ootpas ruma koulussa"?
And in the first sentence "Ootpas kaunis tänään", is it the same as "Et ole kaunis tänään"?
Aslso how would you translate "Oletpas/Ootpas kuollut". You should be dead or aren't you dead?


-pas is a suffix to verbs in Finnish which basically makes the sentence more of an exclamation than it would be otherwise. You could say it conveys surprise or mock-surprise -- a kind of dismay in negative contexts and delight in positive contexts.
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Re: Questions about Finnish / Kysymyksiä suomen kielestä

Postby Gavril » 2015-04-11, 0:14

hreru wrote:Kreikan velat ovan niin suuret, että...
Why is it not suuria?


Finnish is not my native language, but I think that this has something to do with the fact that velka "debt" refers to an abstraction, rather than a concrete object (a rock, a person, etc.). There is a tendency in Finnish to use the t-plural after the verb olla when the subject is the plural of an abstract noun (or at least a certain kind of abstract noun).

For example, in this quote (source), the abstract noun ero "difference, separation" shows the same agreement pattern as velat above:

Kalajokilaaksossa erot ovat suuret myös Kalajoen sekä Alavieskan ja Ylivieskan välillä.


"In the Kalajokilaakso region, the differences [in taxation] are also large between Kalajoki on the one hand, and Alavieska and Ylivieska on the other."

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Re: Questions about Finnish / Kysymyksiä suomen kielestä

Postby Qing » 2015-05-04, 10:42

Hi, can someone explain what means "" ei kurjuutta kummempaa". Thank you!

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Re: Questions about Finnish / Kysymyksiä suomen kielestä

Postby Varislintu » 2015-05-04, 11:11

Qing wrote:Hi, can someone explain what means "" ei kurjuutta kummempaa". Thank you!


I'd translate it as: "There's nothing strange about it, it's just misery."
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