Latviesi! Man vajag jusu palīdzību!

[Zorba]

Visiem Sveiki!

I'd like to get some more discussion going on this forum. Unfortunately as an elementary student of Latvian I don't have very much to offer, but I would be very glad to work with other learners / those interested in the language.

It would also be great if we could get some native speakers (or fluent speakers) on board... Personally, I will be leaving Latvia soon and will no longer have regular face-to-face contact with Latvian natives, so it would be very helpful to meet some people on here.

So, a few questions for anyone who can help...

(i) When writing the subject of the threat, I wasn't sure whether I should use "palīdzība" or "palīga" - what's the difference between these two types of help?

(ii) I've been working a bit with the dainas recently (the Barona Dainu skapis is a great resource) and the meanings aren't always obvious to me.

Velc, pelite, bērnam miegu,
Ka incitis neredzeja,
Caur namiņu, caur istabu,
Caur šūpuļa pagalviņu.

I presume the "pagalviņa" is the head part of the cradle. However, what verb does "velc" come from? And why do mice bring sleep anyway?

This one caused more problems:

Lien, pelite, caur zemiti,
Raugi manu mūža namu,
Vaj rūseja, vaj peleja
Mana mūža istabiņa.

Despite dictionary work, I couldn't really understand any of this - what are "raugi", "rūseja", "peleja" - is "vaj" an old form of "vai"?

And this one

Vīļu, vāļu, vālodzite
Kārklā kāra šūpoliti;
Citi putni slinki bija,
Savus bērnus brēcinaja.

I'm guessing the "vīļu, vāļu, vālodzite" are types of bird, but I couldn't find these in my dictionary.

I have translated the second line as "wanted their cradles (nests?) on the vine"? Is this correct? Kārkls = vine; kārot = to thirst for, desire.

And the other birds were lazy and howled (brēcinat) at their children?

===
If anyone has any suggestions of (easy) Latvian dainas, poetry, or even short stories that I could use to study from (I like learning through texts), please pass it on.

Paldies par uzmanību

Zorba

[mak]

Sveiki

(i) When writing the subject of the threat, I wasn't sure whether I should use "palīdzība" or "palīga" - what's the difference between these two types of help?

You chose the correct word, so the subject is OK.

palīdzība - help
palīgs - someone who helps
man vajag palīgu - I need somone who can help me

However, what verb does "velc" come from? And why do mice bring sleep anyway?

When mice bring sleep children fall asleep

vilkt: es velku, tu velc, viņa velk

Lien, pelite, caur zemiti,
Raugi manu mūža namu,
Vaj rūseja, vaj peleja
Mana mūža istabiņa.

Despite dictionary work, I couldn't really understand any of this - what are "raugi", "rūseja", "peleja" - is "vaj" an old form of "vai"?

I guess so. When pronounced vaj and vai should sound alike.

raudzīt - to look after
rūsēt - to rust
pelējums = mildew

Vīļu, vāļu, vālodzite
Kārklā kāra šūpoliti;
Citi putni slinki bija,
Savus bērnus brēcinaja.

I'm guessing the "vīļu, vāļu, vālodzite" are types of bird, but I couldn't find these in my dictionary.

I have translated the second line as "wanted their cradles (nests?) on the vine"? Is this correct? Kārkls = vine; kārot = to thirst for, desire.

kārt (viņi kāra) - to hang

And the other birds were lazy and howled (brēcinat) at their children?

Yes, that is right.

If anyone has any suggestions of (easy) Latvian dainas, poetry, or even short stories that I could use to study from (I like learning through texts), please pass it on.

Dainas contain archaisms and strange words which we do not use anymore. Do not study from them!

Lai veicas!

[Zorba]

Paldies

I know that dainas contain archaisms and are probably not the best way of studying the modern language, they are sometimes quite fun. Of course they are not the only texts that I use, I also go to lessons, listen to radio, read newspapers and visit chat rooms etc. It is good to get a variety of styles.

I'm a literature scholar and I guess it is quite likely that I might use Latvian texts at some point in the future in my research - so that's why I'm particularly interested in that.

Esiet Sveicināti Unilangā! Where are you from in Latvia; what languages are you learning?

[Mantaz]

Sveiki

Dainas contain archaisms and strange words which we do not use anymore. Do not study from them!

Lai veicas!

Sveiks,

Vai tu zini kādus resursus Internetā, kur es varētu atrast Dainu tekstus? Man archaizmi ir visinteresantāki

[mak]

the Barona Dainu skapis is a great resource

Also http://dainas.lanet.lv/

Esiet Sveicināti Unilangā! Where are you from in Latvia; what languages are you learning?

Paldies! Es dzīvoju Aizkraukles rajonā vietā, kur robežojas trīs Latvijas novadi. Pašlaik skolā mācos angļu un vācu valodu un cenšos apgūt spāņu valodu patstāvīgi.

[Zorba]

Es vēl nebiju Aizkraukles rajonā - vai tas ir Latgalē? Vai tur runāt latgaliešu valodu? Laikam tur dzivo daudzi krievi, vai ne? Bet es zinu, ka tagad ir labs vilciens no Rigas uz Aizkraukli un Daugavpili. Ļoti ērts

Me gusta mucho el espanol y hay muchos autores, particularmente de Latinoamérica, que valen la pena leer. Pero hace muchos años que no hablo en espanol...

Bet tagad es cenšos macīties latviešu valodu. Es dzirdēju par vienu grāmatu, ko es gribetu lasīt. Grāmatas tituls ir Šampinjonu derībā un autore ir Laima Muktupāvela. Tas ir romāns par latviešiem, kurš Īrijā strādā melnos darbos. Varbūt man būs interesanti, es nezinu... Īrija ir mana dzimtene un mums ir tagad pie mums dzivo latvieši, parasti ļoti grūti stāvoklī... bet varbūt būs draņķis.... Vai kāds zina kaut ko vairāk par šo rakstnieci?

Izlabosiet, lūdzu, manas kļūdas

[mak]

Very good!

Es vēl nebiju Aizkraukles rajonā - vai tas ir Latgalē? Vai tur runā latgaliešu valodā? Laikam tur dzivo daudzi krievi, vai ne? Bet es zinu, ka tagad ir labs vilciens no Rīgas uz Aizkraukli un Daugavpili. Ļoti ērts

These sentences are OK, but I'd say
es vēl nebiju -> es vēl neesmu bijusi
latgaliešu valodā -> latgaliski
daudzi krievi -> daudz krievu

Aizkraukles rajons nav Latgalē, bet ļoti tuvu tai gan. Cik es zinu, Latgalē (vairāk gan pie robežām) runā pārsvarā krieviski. Par Latgaliešu valodu gan nemācēšu teikt... Bet pašā Rīgā puse iedzīvotāju ir krievvalodīgie.

Bet tagad es cenšos mācīties latviešu valodu. Es dzirdēju par vienu grāmatu, ko es gribētu izlasīt. Grāmatas nosaukums ir "Šampinjonu derībā" un autore ir Laima Muktupāvela. Tas ir romāns par latviešiem, kuri Īrijā strādā melnos darbus. Varbūt man būs interesanti, es nezinu... Īrija ir mana dzimtene un [s]mums ir[/s] tagad pie mums dzivo latvieši, parasti ļoti grūtā stāvoklī... bet varbūt būs draņķis .... Vai kāds zina kaut ko vairāk par šo rakstnieci?

Izlabosiet, lūdzu, manas kļūdas

title is nosaukums and we put book titles in quotes.
And what did you mean by varbūt būs draņķis?

Es arī labprāt izlasītu šo grāmatu. Temats "Latvieši ārzemēs" man šķiet interesants. Es gan esmu lasījis, ka latviešiem Īrijā sokas visai labi - viņi tur varot dzīvot pa īstam (tas ir domāts, ka var iegādāties lietas, ko sirds vēlas, izklaidēties un kaut kas paliek arī pāri). Latviešiem, kas dzīvo krievu un poļu rajonos, gan laikam klājas smagi.

Kāda ir tava attieksme pret imigrantiem Īrijā?

[Zorba]

Paldies for your corrections, I'm afraid that I have been very busy over the past week or so and haven't had much time to work on my Latvian, so forgive me for writing in English.

Do you know how to explain the Latvian verbal system? I mean what is the difference between lasīt / izlasīt, pirkt/nopirkt and so on. I know Russian and am familiar with the aspect system in Russian, but in Latvian it seems to be more complicated.

"varbūt būs draņķis" - I meant "maybe the book is rubbish" draņķis = rubbish?

I am very much in favour of immigration. Ireland's economy is growing and the country has always been somewhat under-populated. Sadly many of the migrant workers from Eastern Europe are badly treated by their Irish employers. Another worry is that the migration could leave Latvia underpopulated, particularly when those emigrating are the young and economically active.

[Alcadras]

Zorba,will you continue studying Latvian,after you leave Riga ?

[Zorba]

I would like to, and I'll be packing my dictionary and verb tables into my suitcase to bring them home, but in reality there are so many languages that I want to learn that I don't know if I will continue studying it seriously. Svenska or Dansk is next on the agenda!!!

[Alcadras]

lol
But the memories in Riga?The days in Latvia ?
Is it easy to leave them?Can you escape from your memories?Latvian?Your students?
Do not stop Latvian.Don't forget,you had told me that "how beatiful Latvian ,is it?"

[Zorba]

I'm not going to forget them but I want to do something different.

I wish I had the capacity to learn nine or ten languages properly. But two or three is definitely the maximum. My Spanish and French used to be quite good but I have only passive knowledge now.

I'm not sure what Latvian is for, except it is very good fun and pleasant to the ear. Russian, French and Spanish all have a very rich literary heritage and are world languages. Swedish has a lot of beautiful music and literature. But I don't know how I will continue to develop my Latvian in the future, or what I will use it for, so I don't know if I will keep studying it.

If I had an amazing memory and enough time to study nine or ten languages, I would definitely keep Latvian on. But I have to be realistic - how many languages can you keep in your head at once?

[Alcadras]

When will you return back?

[Zorba]

At the end of the month

[Alcadras]

Zorba, vai tu esi aprimt Latvijā? Tu sacīji, kā "es atstāšu"

[Zorba]

Tagad es neesmu Latvijaa, es jau esmu Anglijaa Es gribetu maciities gruziinu valodu, mums buus bezmaksas klases universitaatee! Bet taa bus loti gruti, vai ne?

[Alcadras]

Tagad es neesmu Latvijaa, es jau esmu Anglijaa Es gribetu maciities gruziinu valodu, mums buus bezmaksas klases universitaatee! Bet taa bus loti gruti, vai ne?

Lol, tas ir droši, kā tu neesi Latvijā.

[Sol Invictus]

Vīļu, vāļu, vālodzite
Kārklā kāra šūpoliti;
Citi putni slinki bija,
Savus bērnus brēcinaja.

I'm guessing the "vīļu, vāļu, vālodzite" are types of bird, but I couldn't find these in my dictionary.

I have translated the second line as "wanted their cradles (nests?) on the vine"? Is this correct? Kārkls = vine; kārot = to thirst for, desire.

And the other birds were lazy and howled (brēcinat) at their children?

===
If anyone has any suggestions of (easy) Latvian dainas, poetry, or even short stories that I could use to study from (I like learning through texts), please pass it on.

Paldies par uzmanību

Zorba

You might not care about it anymore, but...
vīļu,vāļu=used as poetic figure
kārkli=type of willows /shrubs/ (though willows=vītoli)
brēcināja=made them cry (the children were howling not adult birds)
===
You must be out of your mind to learn Latvian using dainuskapis try to find dainas elsewere using google[/quote]
---
It's like this:

Tagad es neesmu Latvijaa, es jau esmu Anglijaa Es gribeetu maaciities gruziinu valodu, mums buus bezmaksas klases universitaatee! Bet taa buus ljoti gruuti, vai ne?

[Zorba]

I do care, though I'm not spending as much as time on Latvian now. Thanks for your post

You must be out of your mind to learn Latvian using dainuskapis Rolling Eyes try to find dainas elsewere using google

Bet ja, es esmu mazliet traks. Bet daudz lockeli foruma Unilanga ir mazliet traki.

Kapec tev ne patik 'Dainuskapis'? Do you have another source that I could use? Maybe you have some favourite dainas that you could post on here, and I could try to translate them?!

[kaspars]

Actually dainas is not as archaic as many think. Of course, they contain a lot of non-standard grammar, spellings and old words that are not used in newspapers or spoken language today. But unless they are written in some dialect (for example, I can barely understand 50% of modern Latgalian), they are are completely understandable by native speakers. They are not like Shakespeare works for native English speakers. In fact, dainas are big fun to everyone and certain elements and verses are often used in art, literature and public speeches.

For learners, however, the bigger problem would be that as with all poetry is that for the sake of euphony and rythm there often will be grammatical concessions that requires great linguiztic expertise to untangle the words. But for many, including native speakers, it can be big fun.

On the other hand, not all people like dainas because they invariably bring the image of a pathetic nationalist dressed in strange clothing with ribbons and kokle. So, not everybody will appreciate if you tell them that you mostly interested in dainas.