I have some questions

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LifeDeath
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I have some questions

Postby LifeDeath » 2014-01-29, 21:52

Hi everebody! My name is Anton and I'm from Novosibirsk(Russia). My english is very bad and I think it'll make you laugh:) :D I prepared a few questions I wanted to ask:

1. I listened to song "It Must Have Been Love" and there was a line: "From the moment we touched till the time had run out", is there a simple way to explain me why they used past simple in the first part and past perfect in the second? I think the correct way to say is: "From the moment we had touched till the time ran out".

2. I had an argument with my friend about using "will" after "if". In my english courses I have been learnt that it's incorret, but in russian forum about english there was a man who proved that it's possible to say: "think about army if it will help you study better" because it is an advice. Is it true?

3.I heard a phrase from "Home Alone" it was "what else can we be forgetting?". What is it? Is there a rule about using Be+Ving? Can I say, for example: "I don't wanna be listenig to you right now"(I don't want to listen to you right now)? :ohwell:

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Re: I have some questions

Postby linguoboy » 2014-01-29, 22:27

LifeDeath wrote:Hi everybody! My name is Anton and I'm from Novosibirsk(Russia). My English is very bad and I think it'll make you laugh:) :D I prepared a few questions I wanted to ask:

Actually your English is very good. I have very few corrections to make.

LifeDeath wrote:1. I listened to the song "It Must Have Been Love" and there was a line: "From the moment we touched till the time had run out". Is there a simple way to explain me why they used the simple past in the first part and past perfect in the second? I think the correct way to say is: "From the moment we had touched till the time ran out".

The past perfect is like the present perfect, only further in the past. The present perfect puts the focus on a state arising from an action rather than the action itself. You wouldn't say *"the moment we have touched" because touching is instantaneous. But you do say "the time has run out" when you're emphasising the resulting state.

So the original version sounds perfectly natural to me: There was a point in time when we touched. After this, there was a period when were in love ("it must have been love"), then that period ended and we entred a period where "the time had run out". (From the perspective of the lyrics, that period is over and done with, too. This is why past perfect is used rather than simple past.)

LifeDeath wrote:2. I had an argument with my friend about using "will" after "if". In my english courses I have been learnt that it's incorrect, but in a Russian forum about English there was a man who proved that it's possible to say: "think about army if it will help you study better" because it is an advice. Is it true?

Yes, it's possible to say that. "if it helps" is possible here, too. The difference is whether studying is being viewed as a habitual act (something you always do, and are only taking a break from at the moment of speaking) or as an act which will take place in the future. In general, though, the rule you learned is a sound one.

LifeDeath wrote:3.I heard a phrase from "Home Alone". It was "what else can we be forgetting?". What is it? Is there a rule about using Be+Ving? Can I say, for example: "I don't wanna be listening to you right now"(I don't want to listen to you right now)? :ohwell:

Again, it's a question of emphasis. The progressive draws attention to the fact that the action is happening right at the moment of speaking. "Forget" is usually thought of a punctual verb. Saying "What can we be forgetting?" frames it as a process that is taking place at the moment of speaking: We haven't completely forgotten (because there's still time to remember what it was and take care of it), but pretty soon we will have and it will be too late to do anything.

"Listen", on the other hand, is already processive. So it's not really necessary to draw attention to the ongoing nature of it unless you really want to stress this for some reason. For that reason "I don't wanna be listening to you right now" sounds both emphatic and very colloquial.
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Re: I have some questions

Postby LifeDeath » 2014-01-30, 9:01

Thank you very much :D :D

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Re: I have some questions

Postby LifeDeath » 2014-01-30, 16:00

Could anybody answer my another question? :)
Are there "future perfect continuous passive voice" and "perfect continuous future in the past passive voice"? For example: "The iphones will have been being sent for two hours already before you come" and "...the stories should not have been being forgotten...". :D :D

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Re: I have some questions

Postby linguoboy » 2014-01-30, 16:28

LifeDeath wrote:Could anybody answer my another question of mine? :)
Are there "future perfect continuous passive voice" and "perfect continuous future in the past passive voice"? For example: "The iphones will have been being sent for two hours already before you come" and "...the stories should not have been being forgotten...". :D :D

These both exist in theory. I learned them as part of secondary school grammar instruction. (The example in our textbooks was "I will have been being shot".) I think I once spotted an example "in the wild", but I can't remember now what it was. As linguist Mark Liberman points out in this Language Log post "[P]hrases like "you will have been being disappointed" are present in English only in a somewhat ethereal form. Checking the first 10 pages of Google hits for "will have been being", I found only grammatical examples and (grammatical) jokes." There are some actual real-life usages in the comments.
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Re: I have some questions

Postby LifeDeath » 2014-01-30, 17:43

Thaaaank you.
I wrote the song, and I want you to find the mistakes there, so:

""And I remembered that your hair
Had always curled in the rain
I felt us belonging to that dreamland
And all the cold tears in my hand
Were being warmed by your love
And I would have flown like a dove

And I remembered that your eyes
Had always shined, but no lies
My clamped lips could make
And we forgot about ache
You were being hugged by my arms
And I still was under your charms

And I don’t wanna be forgotten by your beautiful eyes
And I cannot behold so much resemblance between our vices
If all the hopes had faded I would have forsaken that land
I would have taken you if there had been love in your hand""

May be you will not find the rhyme reading this, but I can imagine it sounds with a music and I dare to say it is a good stuff :D
So about mistakes, I have a lot of doubt about the second line and about this: "And I don’t wanna be forgotten by your beautiful eyes". The second line means something like "We was a part of that world(dreamland), I felt it " and the other means "I don't want you (your eyes) to forget me". I know in the songs sometimes it's possible to express the thoughts not as the books taught you. So, could you show me real mistakes, which won't be understood by the English speakers? :ohwell:

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Re: I have some questions

Postby PiotrR » 2014-01-30, 18:07

ABCDEFGHIJKLMNO
Last edited by PiotrR on 2014-04-01, 23:59, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: I have some questions

Postby LifeDeath » 2014-01-30, 18:19

Thank you for this information, I found it important for me. So, could anybody tell me about mistakes and grammar rules which I broke?

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Re: I have some questions

Postby linguoboy » 2014-01-30, 19:02

My comments are more about style than grammar stricto sensu.

LifeDeath wrote:I felt us belonging to that dreamland

Not incorrect but awkward. More idiomatic would be something like "I felt we were part of that dreamland".

LifeDeath wrote:And I remembered that your eyes
Had always shined, but no lies
My clamped lips could make

IMD, "shined" is the past tense of the transitive verb (e.g. "He shined shoes for a living") whereas the intransitive verb is strong (e.g. "Then sun shone that day".) I'm not sure how common this distinction is, but it's common enough that your sentence sounds off to me.

The second clause is awkward, perhaps because it's introduced by "but" which suggests a contrast.

LifeDeath wrote:And we forgot about ache

Ungrammatical. There has to be an article there in the singular.

And Piotr is spot on regarding the pronunciation of "eyes" and "vices". Also, "behold" is a rather poetic verb, but perhaps that's what you were going for. (If so, I would avoid spellings like "wanna" because these are characteristic of a more colloquial register.)
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Re: I have some questions

Postby LifeDeath » 2014-01-30, 19:17

I'm thank very much :wink: (I hope I can use to be with thank)
Are there any mistakes in my description under the song?

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Re: I have some questions

Postby LifeDeath » 2014-01-30, 19:19

oh, "we was" is the first :oops:

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Re: I have some questions

Postby linguoboy » 2014-01-30, 20:01

LifeDeath wrote:I'm thank very much :wink: (I hope I can use to be with thank)

Nope. You can thank someone or you can be thankful, but you cannot *"be thank".

LifeDeath wrote:May be you will not find the rhyme reading this, but I can imagine what it sounds like with a music and I dare to say it is a good stuff :D

I know in the songs sometimes it's possible to express the thoughts not as the books taught you. So, could you show me real mistakes, things which won't be understood by the English speakers?
"Richmond is a real scholar; Owen just learns languages because he can't bear not to know what other people are saying."--Margaret Lattimore on her two sons

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Re: I have some questions

Postby LifeDeath » 2014-02-01, 20:54

1. Can I add "do" in present simle tenses? For example: "I do love you", "He does study in university", "I do always remember dressing up before important meeting". Does adding of "do" change the sense of the sentence?

2.In past simple questions, can I use "do" instead of "did" but with changing the verbe in past form?
For example: "Why don't I used it?" instead of "Why didn't I use it" or "Does she forgot her speech?" instead of "Did she forget her speech?" Is it possible to say?

And please, correct the mistakes I've done writing this :D

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Re: I have some questions

Postby Lazar Taxon » 2014-02-01, 21:02

LifeDeath wrote:1. Can I add "do" in present simle tenses? For example: "I do love you", "He does study in university", "I do always remember dressing up before important meeting". Does adding of "do" change the sense of the sentence?
You can use "do" here, but it changes the meaning to an emphatic one. For example, if someone who I loved said "You don't love me!", I would contradict them by saying "I do love you!"

2.In past simple questions, can I use "do" instead of "did" but with changing the verbe in past form?
For example: "Why don't I used it?" instead of "Why didn't I use it" or "Does she forgot her speech?" instead of "Did she forget her speech?" Is it possible to say?
No, you can't use "don't" there. "Do/does" and "don't/doesn't" are auxiliaries which must always be followed by the base form of the verb.

And please, correct the mistakes I've done made writing this :D
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Re: I have some questions

Postby PiotrR » 2014-02-01, 21:14

ABCDEFGHIJKLMNO
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Re: I have some questions

Postby LifeDeath » 2014-02-01, 21:19

Thank you both!

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Re: I have some questions

Postby Viridzen » 2014-02-01, 22:32

LifeDeath wrote:1. Can I add "do" in present simle tenses? For example: "I do love you", "He does study in university", "I do always remember dressing up before important meeting". Does adding of "do" change the sense of the sentence?

If you are answering a question, yes: "Does he study in university?" you could answer with "He does study in university". It wouldn't sound right to me to say "He studies in university" to answer that.
Please, correct my errors. S'il vous plaît, corrigez mes erreurs.
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Re: I have some questions

Postby PiotrR » 2014-02-01, 22:38

ABCDEFGHIJKLMNO
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Re: I have some questions

Postby LifeDeath » 2014-02-03, 9:18

I have new questions :wink:

1. Can I say "I'm gonna have my problem done" if I mean "i'm gonna solve my problem"?

2. What's the difference between "manner" and "way"? For example: "It's a good way to do it better" and "It's a good manner to do it better" is there a difference?

3. What's difference between "always" and "forever"? :?:

4. What's difference between "let" and "allow"?

5. Song "Queen - Don't Stop Me Now" starts with lyrics "Tonight i'm gonna have myself a real good time"
What is it "have myself"? my fryend said it's a bad thing and we can't say that way.

Please, answer and correct my mistakes here :D

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Re: I have some questions

Postby linguoboy » 2014-02-03, 16:02

LifeDeath wrote:1. Can I say "I'm gonna have my problem done" if I mean "i'm gonna solve my problem"?

No.

LifeDeath wrote:2. What's the difference between "manner" and "way"? For example: "It's a good way to do it better" and "It's a good manner to do it better" is there a difference?

Neither of those sentences makes any sense to me, I'm afraid, so I can't really choose between them. In general, "way" has a broader range of meaning and gets more use. For instance, "You're doing it the wrong way" but not "You're doing it in the wrong manner."

LifeDeath wrote:3. What's the difference between "always" and "forever"?

Placement for one. "Always" tends to come before the main verb, like other sentence adverbs, whereas "forever" comes at the end, like other time expressions. Compare:

"I will always love you."
"I will love you forever."

LifeDeath wrote:4. What's the difference between "let" and "allow"?

"Let" has a wider range of meaning and gets more use.

LifeDeath wrote:5. The Queen song "Don't Stop Me Now" starts with the lyrics "Tonight i'm gonna have myself a real good time"
What is it "have myself"? My friend said it's a bad thing and we can't say it that way.

It's a colloquialism, so it's only appropriate for informal situations. In linguistic terms, this is an autobenefactive; it emphasises that the action was performed for the benefit of the subject. For instance, "I'm gonna have a cigarette" is neutral; perhaps you're only smoking a cigarette to feed an addiction. But "I'm gonna have myself a cigarette" implies that this cigarette is something you're really looking forward to.
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