księżycowy wrote:I could have sworn that you also had a link to a Turkish site that had Avar lessons, or was that something else?
probably something else. though a quick websearch turned up this page:
http://avarlar.awardspace.com/dil.html
UniLang Language Community • Forum
Avar (МагIарул мацI)
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zhiguli
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Alcadras
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zhiguli wrote:księżycowy wrote:I could have sworn that you also had a link to a Turkish site that had Avar lessons, or was that something else?
probably something else. though a quick websearch turned up this page:
http://avarlar.awardspace.com/dil.html
I read this website, and it's quite depressing.
I thought it's written in cyrillic. I think, the verb conjugations are easier than any cyrillic languages.
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zhiguli
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keep in mind that what's being taught there is dialect
(i'm also a bit wary of the latin transcription they are using..)
Yukarıda yazılı olan tanımlar Türkiye'deki Avar köylerinden Kireç köyündeki İngiş ve Metlhel klanlarına ait olan lehçe göz önüne alınarak yazılmıştır. Bu lehçe İngiş ve Metlhel klanlarına aittir.
(i'm also a bit wary of the latin transcription they are using..)
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zhiguli
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some more avar music (will be deleted within a week):
http://rapidshare.de/files/37121016/San ... e.zip.html
http://rapidshare.de/files/37121016/San ... e.zip.html
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Sisyphe
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On the back burner but in love with:
A life-long endeavor: 
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zhiguli
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"Archaic" vs "living" features of avar
in literature about avar so-called "archaic" features of the language are contrasted with modern (or "living" «живой») ones.
the archaic features are so-called because they are like fossilized forms of a more ancient language. the archaic words in avar are far fewer in number, tend to be restricted to more elementary categories, and as befits an archaic language, they are more irregular. the modern ones, by contrast, constitute the greater part of the avar lexicon; they are more regular in their declension/conjugation, and unlike the archaic forms they are productive - they can be used to form new words; loan words from other languages are conjugated or declined as modern. in some spoken dialects the archaic forms have been completely supplanted by modern ones.
noun cases in avar
there are 24 of them - 4 cardinal cases and 5 sets of 4 locative endings. like other languages (hungarian, finnish) that have many locative cases they are not used solely to show spatial relationships but also have grammatical functions. for example:
дуда цIар щиб? what is your name? literally translates as - in-you name what?
дида лъала. i know = in-me know (and not the ergative дица as one might expect)
and sometimes even when they do show a spatial relation, they don't literally mean what they say:
ахикь кIудияб гъветI буго. in the garden (literally = under the garden) is a big tree.
to form all the other cases, one needs to know the oblique form, which in the first and second declensions is also the ergative case.
there are 3 categories:
1st declension - suffix -ас - applies to all nouns denoting male humans (в class):
вехь shepherd вехьас
вас boy/son васас
хIалтIухъан worker хIалтIухъанас
in russian loans with a soft sign the soft sign is dropped:
учитель teacher учителас
2nd declension - suffix -алъ - applies to й and and most б class nouns:
эбел mother эбелалъ
яс girl/daughter ясалъ
most nouns that can be either male or female can also take second declension suffixes if they refer to females:
хIалтIухъаналъ (female) worker
in words ending in a vowel the buffer consonant й comes between the suffix and the root:
чи man чияс
чIужу woman чIужуялъ
3rd declension - suffix -ца - applies to words belonging to the "archaic" group. nouns in this group are irregular and add an extension before the suffix, which, just like the plural ending, can also trigger vowel shifts and other changes.
here are a few of them:
-и- (this one usually causes a root vowel е, and more rarely o, to change into а)
квен food кваница
туманкI rifle тункIица
хъазан cauldron хъазни
-о- (which causes the root vowel to turn into о)
гъветI tree гъотIоца
мугь grain могьоца
-у-
эмен father инсуца
гIор river гIоруца
рагъ war рагъуца
this suffix is also typical of verbal nouns ending in и:
хIалтIи work (from хIалтIизе to work) хIалтIуца
-да- (which causes the final vowel and, more rarely, a nasal consonant, to drop off)
росу village росдаца
гIака cow гIакдаца
the ergative case of first names is also formed with the suffix ца, with the extension -и- after consonants:
гIали ali (male name) гIалица
асма asma (female name) асмаца
шарип sharip/sharif (m.) шарипица
патIимат patimat/fatima (f.) патIиматица
plurals of all nouns form their ergative/oblique case by replacing the plural ending with -(а)з.
the ergative case has two main functions
1. it marks the subject of a transitive verb
инсуца гъветI къотIана father cut the tree
2. it marks the agent - an object by which something is accomplished.
гьес *гIощтIоца* гъветI къотIана he cut the tree *with an axe*
in literature about avar so-called "archaic" features of the language are contrasted with modern (or "living" «живой») ones.
the archaic features are so-called because they are like fossilized forms of a more ancient language. the archaic words in avar are far fewer in number, tend to be restricted to more elementary categories, and as befits an archaic language, they are more irregular. the modern ones, by contrast, constitute the greater part of the avar lexicon; they are more regular in their declension/conjugation, and unlike the archaic forms they are productive - they can be used to form new words; loan words from other languages are conjugated or declined as modern. in some spoken dialects the archaic forms have been completely supplanted by modern ones.
noun cases in avar
there are 24 of them - 4 cardinal cases and 5 sets of 4 locative endings. like other languages (hungarian, finnish) that have many locative cases they are not used solely to show spatial relationships but also have grammatical functions. for example:
дуда цIар щиб? what is your name? literally translates as - in-you name what?
дида лъала. i know = in-me know (and not the ergative дица as one might expect)
and sometimes even when they do show a spatial relation, they don't literally mean what they say:
ахикь кIудияб гъветI буго. in the garden (literally = under the garden) is a big tree.
to form all the other cases, one needs to know the oblique form, which in the first and second declensions is also the ergative case.
there are 3 categories:
1st declension - suffix -ас - applies to all nouns denoting male humans (в class):
вехь shepherd вехьас
вас boy/son васас
хIалтIухъан worker хIалтIухъанас
in russian loans with a soft sign the soft sign is dropped:
учитель teacher учителас
2nd declension - suffix -алъ - applies to й and and most б class nouns:
эбел mother эбелалъ
яс girl/daughter ясалъ
most nouns that can be either male or female can also take second declension suffixes if they refer to females:
хIалтIухъаналъ (female) worker
in words ending in a vowel the buffer consonant й comes between the suffix and the root:
чи man чияс
чIужу woman чIужуялъ
3rd declension - suffix -ца - applies to words belonging to the "archaic" group. nouns in this group are irregular and add an extension before the suffix, which, just like the plural ending, can also trigger vowel shifts and other changes.
here are a few of them:
-и- (this one usually causes a root vowel е, and more rarely o, to change into а)
квен food кваница
туманкI rifle тункIица
хъазан cauldron хъазни
-о- (which causes the root vowel to turn into о)
гъветI tree гъотIоца
мугь grain могьоца
-у-
эмен father инсуца
гIор river гIоруца
рагъ war рагъуца
this suffix is also typical of verbal nouns ending in и:
хIалтIи work (from хIалтIизе to work) хIалтIуца
-да- (which causes the final vowel and, more rarely, a nasal consonant, to drop off)
росу village росдаца
гIака cow гIакдаца
the ergative case of first names is also formed with the suffix ца, with the extension -и- after consonants:
гIали ali (male name) гIалица
асма asma (female name) асмаца
шарип sharip/sharif (m.) шарипица
патIимат patimat/fatima (f.) патIиматица
plurals of all nouns form their ergative/oblique case by replacing the plural ending with -(а)з.
the ergative case has two main functions
1. it marks the subject of a transitive verb
инсуца гъветI къотIана father cut the tree
2. it marks the agent - an object by which something is accomplished.
гьес *гIощтIоца* гъветI къотIана he cut the tree *with an axe*
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Sisyphe
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zhiguli
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zhiguli
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- Real Name:zhiguli zhiguli
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салам гIали, вац
лъикI щварав форумалде
very nice site you have. i am planning to set up my own site (about the language) but i'll try to help you with yours as i am able.
unfortunately i can't find a lot of pages with pictures of avar clothing, but you may find something at these sites:
http://www.kunstkamera.ru/exhibition/kavkaz/xxc_all.htm
http://www.rustrana.ru/article.php?nid=112
http://www.lezginka.net/
as for the names, there is a short list at the back of my avar phrasebook which i will post here later.
лъикI щварав форумалде
very nice site you have. i am planning to set up my own site (about the language) but i'll try to help you with yours as i am able.
unfortunately i can't find a lot of pages with pictures of avar clothing, but you may find something at these sites:
http://www.kunstkamera.ru/exhibition/kavkaz/xxc_all.htm
http://www.rustrana.ru/article.php?nid=112
http://www.lezginka.net/
as for the names, there is a short list at the back of my avar phrasebook which i will post here later.
Last edited by zhiguli on 2007-05-13, 17:59, edited 1 time in total.
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zhiguli
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then excuse me for the mistake)) it's been a long time since i studied turkish. and thanks for the short "lesson". i was actually able to understand most of it.
i found this book during my searches. only 400 copies were prinetd but if you can find one it should prove to be a very useful resource.
here is the list of men's names:
Абу, Абумуслим, Абус, АбутIалиб, Айтбер, Анвар, Арсланбег, Асадулагь, АсхIаб, АхIмад, Багьадур, Басир, Батир, БатIал, БацIал, Бегав, Булат, Булач, Бутай, Вагьаб, Вакил, Гирай, Гулла, Гунаш, Гъази, Гъазияв, ГъалбацI, ГIабас, ГIабдулгъапур, ГIабдулагь, ГIабдулатIип, ГIабдулвахIид, ГIабдуразакъ, ГIабдурахIман, ГIадил, ГIаду, ГIали, ГIалиасхIаб, ГIалибег, ГIалихан, ГIалихIажи, ГIамир, ГIамирхан, ГIиса, ГIумар, ГIумарасхIаб, ГIумардибир, ГIумархIажи, ГIусман, Гьимат, ГьитIихI, ГьитIинавас, Давуд, Дайтбег, Даку, Даниял, Дибир, ЖабрагIил, Жаватхан, Жалил, Жамирза, Загьид, Заирбег, Залумхан, Зану, Зияудин, Зубайир, Зулпукъар, Ибрагьим, Ильяс, ИманшапигI, ИмахIу, Ислам, ИсмагIил, Исрапил, ИсхIакъ, Камал, Каримулагь, КIудияв, Къади, Къадир, Къасум, Къебед, Къурбан, Лабазан, Мажид, Малачи, Малик, Мансур, Марат, МахсутI, МахIакIу, МахIач, МахIмуд, МахIсуд, Мирза, Музапир, Мурад, Муртуз, Муса, Мухтар, МухIамад, МухIамадрасул, МухIамадхан, МухIу, МухIудада, МухIуч, Наби, Насрулагь, Насу, Ниязбег, НугIман, НурухIума, НухIбег, Нуцал, Нуцалхан, Пайзудин, Парухъ, ПатахI, Пахрудин, Пирбудагъ, Ражаб, Расул, Рашид, Ризван, Руслан, Сабигулагь, Сабу, СагIаду, СагIид, СагIу, Сайгид, Сайпулагь, СалахI, Салим, Салимхан, СалихI, Самад, Саху, Сиражудин, Сулиман, Султан, Сурхай, Тажудин, Таймасхан, Темирбег, Темирбулат, Темирхан, Тимур, ТIагьир, ТIалхIат, Умалат, Устар, Устархан, Хайрулагь, Халид, Халил, Хасай, Хизри, ХирамухIамад, Хирач, Хочбар, Хъазами, Хъара, Хъарачу, ХIабиб, ХIабу, ХIадис, ХIажимурад, ХIажияв, ХIайдар, ХIаким, ХIамзат, ХIасан, ХIасанбег, ХIасрат, ХIащтIих, ХIизихIума, ХIусен, ЦIаху, ЦIарлъикI, ЦIодор, Чаран, Шагьидав, Шамил, ШапигI, Шарапудин, Шигьавудин, Элдар, Юнус, Якъуб, Ярагъи, ЯхIия.
i found this book during my searches. only 400 copies were prinetd but if you can find one it should prove to be a very useful resource.
here is the list of men's names:
Абу, Абумуслим, Абус, АбутIалиб, Айтбер, Анвар, Арсланбег, Асадулагь, АсхIаб, АхIмад, Багьадур, Басир, Батир, БатIал, БацIал, Бегав, Булат, Булач, Бутай, Вагьаб, Вакил, Гирай, Гулла, Гунаш, Гъази, Гъазияв, ГъалбацI, ГIабас, ГIабдулгъапур, ГIабдулагь, ГIабдулатIип, ГIабдулвахIид, ГIабдуразакъ, ГIабдурахIман, ГIадил, ГIаду, ГIали, ГIалиасхIаб, ГIалибег, ГIалихан, ГIалихIажи, ГIамир, ГIамирхан, ГIиса, ГIумар, ГIумарасхIаб, ГIумардибир, ГIумархIажи, ГIусман, Гьимат, ГьитIихI, ГьитIинавас, Давуд, Дайтбег, Даку, Даниял, Дибир, ЖабрагIил, Жаватхан, Жалил, Жамирза, Загьид, Заирбег, Залумхан, Зану, Зияудин, Зубайир, Зулпукъар, Ибрагьим, Ильяс, ИманшапигI, ИмахIу, Ислам, ИсмагIил, Исрапил, ИсхIакъ, Камал, Каримулагь, КIудияв, Къади, Къадир, Къасум, Къебед, Къурбан, Лабазан, Мажид, Малачи, Малик, Мансур, Марат, МахсутI, МахIакIу, МахIач, МахIмуд, МахIсуд, Мирза, Музапир, Мурад, Муртуз, Муса, Мухтар, МухIамад, МухIамадрасул, МухIамадхан, МухIу, МухIудада, МухIуч, Наби, Насрулагь, Насу, Ниязбег, НугIман, НурухIума, НухIбег, Нуцал, Нуцалхан, Пайзудин, Парухъ, ПатахI, Пахрудин, Пирбудагъ, Ражаб, Расул, Рашид, Ризван, Руслан, Сабигулагь, Сабу, СагIаду, СагIид, СагIу, Сайгид, Сайпулагь, СалахI, Салим, Салимхан, СалихI, Самад, Саху, Сиражудин, Сулиман, Султан, Сурхай, Тажудин, Таймасхан, Темирбег, Темирбулат, Темирхан, Тимур, ТIагьир, ТIалхIат, Умалат, Устар, Устархан, Хайрулагь, Халид, Халил, Хасай, Хизри, ХирамухIамад, Хирач, Хочбар, Хъазами, Хъара, Хъарачу, ХIабиб, ХIабу, ХIадис, ХIажимурад, ХIажияв, ХIайдар, ХIаким, ХIамзат, ХIасан, ХIасанбег, ХIасрат, ХIащтIих, ХIизихIума, ХIусен, ЦIаху, ЦIарлъикI, ЦIодор, Чаран, Шагьидав, Шамил, ШапигI, Шарапудин, Шигьавудин, Элдар, Юнус, Якъуб, Ярагъи, ЯхIия.
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zhiguli
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Women's names:
Абсират, Ажайбика, Аза, Айбика, Айзанат, Аймеседо, Аймисай, Алжанат, Алипат, Аминат, Асват, Асият, Баги, Багьжат, Байзат, Бахтика, Баху, Бахумеседу, БахIарай, Берцинай, Бика, Бурлият, Вазипат, Гулжанат, Гулизар, Гулишат, Гуржанат, ГьитIинай, Гьумай, ГIабидат, ГIайишат, ГIарацай, ГIарцулай, ГIашура, Жавагьир, Жавзанат, Жами, Жамилат, Жарият, Завжанат, Завжат, Загьидат, Загьра, Загьрат, Зада, Заира, Зайбат, Зайнаб, Залму, Зарема, Зарипат, Зубайжат, Зубаржат, Зугьра, Зулайха, ЗулхIижат, ИзахIат, Кавсарат, Калимат, Камилат, Каримат, Катурай, Кумсият, Къурбанай, Лаюза, Лейла, Мадина, Маймунат, Майсарат, Манарша, Маржанат, Мариян, Махружат, Меседу, Мисай, Мокъокъ, Муслимат, Муъминат, Нажават, Назипат, Наида, Насират, Наида, Насират, Нупайсат, Нурият, Нуцалай, Пайнусат, Парзилат, Пари, Парида, Париза, ПарсихIат, Парханисай, ПатIимат, ПатIина, Пирдавус, Равзанат, Разият, Раисат, Райгьанат, Рашидат, Рисалат, Рукъижат, Савдат, Савадат, Саврат, СагIа, СагIадат, Сайгибат, Сакинат, Салимат, СалихIат, Саният, Сапият, Сарат, Сидрат, Симисхан, Сиядат, Супайнат, Султанат, Супия, Тайибат, ТIавус, ТIинай, ТIинаяс, Узлипат, Умагьани, Умай, Уму, Умужат, Умукусум, Хадижат, Хажа, Халисат, Халун, Хамиз, Ханика, Ханум, Хасайбат, Хасбика, Хатимат, Хумай, Хъандулай, Хъанича, ХъистIаман, ХIурулгIин, Чакар, Чамасдак, ЧIухIай, Шагьидат, Шагьрият, Шагьрузат, Шамай, Шамалай, Шамсият, ШугIайнат, Шумайсат, Эбечо, Элбика, Элмира, Язбика.
Абсират, Ажайбика, Аза, Айбика, Айзанат, Аймеседо, Аймисай, Алжанат, Алипат, Аминат, Асват, Асият, Баги, Багьжат, Байзат, Бахтика, Баху, Бахумеседу, БахIарай, Берцинай, Бика, Бурлият, Вазипат, Гулжанат, Гулизар, Гулишат, Гуржанат, ГьитIинай, Гьумай, ГIабидат, ГIайишат, ГIарацай, ГIарцулай, ГIашура, Жавагьир, Жавзанат, Жами, Жамилат, Жарият, Завжанат, Завжат, Загьидат, Загьра, Загьрат, Зада, Заира, Зайбат, Зайнаб, Залму, Зарема, Зарипат, Зубайжат, Зубаржат, Зугьра, Зулайха, ЗулхIижат, ИзахIат, Кавсарат, Калимат, Камилат, Каримат, Катурай, Кумсият, Къурбанай, Лаюза, Лейла, Мадина, Маймунат, Майсарат, Манарша, Маржанат, Мариян, Махружат, Меседу, Мисай, Мокъокъ, Муслимат, Муъминат, Нажават, Назипат, Наида, Насират, Наида, Насират, Нупайсат, Нурият, Нуцалай, Пайнусат, Парзилат, Пари, Парида, Париза, ПарсихIат, Парханисай, ПатIимат, ПатIина, Пирдавус, Равзанат, Разият, Раисат, Райгьанат, Рашидат, Рисалат, Рукъижат, Савдат, Савадат, Саврат, СагIа, СагIадат, Сайгибат, Сакинат, Салимат, СалихIат, Саният, Сапият, Сарат, Сидрат, Симисхан, Сиядат, Супайнат, Султанат, Супия, Тайибат, ТIавус, ТIинай, ТIинаяс, Узлипат, Умагьани, Умай, Уму, Умужат, Умукусум, Хадижат, Хажа, Халисат, Халун, Хамиз, Ханика, Ханум, Хасайбат, Хасбика, Хатимат, Хумай, Хъандулай, Хъанича, ХъистIаман, ХIурулгIин, Чакар, Чамасдак, ЧIухIай, Шагьидат, Шагьрият, Шагьрузат, Шамай, Шамалай, Шамсият, ШугIайнат, Шумайсат, Эбечо, Элбика, Элмира, Язбика.
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avarabrek
- Posts:6
- Joined:2006-10-22, 16:51
- Real Name:LORD OF AVAR'S
- Gender:male
- Location: 46100
- Country:Turkey (Türkiye)
transcript of what ? ı don't understand what
you meant... not important , 7 billion people
meant billion things , but nobody understand
anything
İn Turkei someone is writing Arabic Alphabet
which was edit for Avar Language in the time of İmam Shamil... but they are very little group...
or only reading in old "Avarian Ajam Book" -
this books are in Arabian Alphabet - so old...
someone is using cyrillic , but I hate Russian ,
and all of things they have... cyrillic alphabet
is not usufel for our language... every cyrillic
is injures our language , I think like that...
but lots of them using...
you must know , in Turkey , Avar's commonly only speaks Ma'arul Mats , some little groups are
writing - poems - stories - old legends - letters
to their relatives in Daghestan...
big and terrible enemy is in front of the door : ASİMİLATİON !
I defend arabian alphabet , or creating new
alphabet , why musn't it ? but ı use latin ,
only for this times... tomorrow will show
what will ı do...
______ your web site , if you want I can help
your designes or what you need for this...
Selam Again ! to the Daghestan's Children ,
where they are...
you meant... not important , 7 billion people
meant billion things , but nobody understand
anything
İn Turkei someone is writing Arabic Alphabet
which was edit for Avar Language in the time of İmam Shamil... but they are very little group...
or only reading in old "Avarian Ajam Book" -
this books are in Arabian Alphabet - so old...
someone is using cyrillic , but I hate Russian ,
and all of things they have... cyrillic alphabet
is not usufel for our language... every cyrillic
is injures our language , I think like that...
but lots of them using...
you must know , in Turkey , Avar's commonly only speaks Ma'arul Mats , some little groups are
writing - poems - stories - old legends - letters
to their relatives in Daghestan...
big and terrible enemy is in front of the door : ASİMİLATİON !
I defend arabian alphabet , or creating new
alphabet , why musn't it ? but ı use latin ,
only for this times... tomorrow will show
what will ı do...
______ your web site , if you want I can help
your designes or what you need for this...
Selam Again ! to the Daghestan's Children ,
where they are...
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zhiguli
- Posts:688
- Joined:2003-12-13, 8:36
- Real Name:zhiguli zhiguli
- Gender:male
- Country:Canada (Canada)
avarabrek wrote:transcript of what ? ı don't understand what
you meant... not important , 7 billion people
meant billion things , but nobody understand
anything
i mean written versions of the dialogues in your flash lessons. or are you planning to put them on your site when the lessons are finished?
avarabrek wrote:İn Turkei someone is writing Arabic Alphabet
which was edit for Avar Language in the time of İmam Shamil... but they are very little group...
or only reading in old "Avarian Ajam Book" -
this books are in Arabian Alphabet - so old...
very interesting. as you know most of these books were destroyed in russia. i wonder how many of them still exist in turkey?
avarabrek wrote:someone is using cyrillic , but I hate Russian ,
and all of things they have... cyrillic alphabet
is not usufel for our language... every cyrillic
is injures our language , I think like that...
but lots of them using...
i can understand why you feel this way. but the fact is that cyrillic is the only official alphabet for avar, it has been used for over 70 years and most avars nowadays don't know the ajam. i think it is worth learning if only to be able to read all the literature that has been produced in the last century.
avarabrek wrote:you must know , in Turkey , Avar's commonly only speaks Ma'arul Mats , some little groups are
writing - poems - stories - old legends - letters
to their relatives in Daghestan...
big and terrible enemy is in front of the door : ASİMİLATİON !
also interesting is how avars in turkey have been able to maintain ties with avars in azerbaijan/dagestan behind the iron curtain. are there big differences between your dialects?
avarabrek wrote:I defend arabian alphabet , or creating new
alphabet , why musn't it ? but ı use latin ,
only for this times... tomorrow will show
what will ı do...
look forward to it. i'd also be very interested in any information you have about the ajam.
avarabrek wrote:______ your web site , if you want I can help
your designes or what you need for this...
thanks again. i'll let you know when it goes online.
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