Right peripheral pronouns in Frisian

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cataphor
Posts: 53
Joined: 2013-03-06, 9:48
Real Name: Andreas
Gender: male
Country: DE Germany (Deutschland)

Right peripheral pronouns in Frisian

Postby cataphor » 2013-08-12, 14:19

Dear native speakers of Frisian,

I'm doing some research on a structure which is pretty common in the world's languages, and it looks like the example in (1) to (6) which is from some dialect of English:

(1) [Talking about some sort of potatoes] They cook fast, them.
(2) She's a liar, her.
(3) I payed him, me.
(4) That's great, that!
(5) We met Lisa at the train station, her.
(6) Mary talked to Peter last saturday night, to him.

What I'd like to know is whether your language allows for a similiar construction. That is, do you - in colloquial conversation - place pronouns in the end of the sentence that correlate to some referent in the preceding clause? If so, I would be pleased if you could give an example. They don't need to fit the examples above regarding the content.

I would also like to know what form the pronoun takes. So, in (1) to (5), the pronouns at the end are all in accusative or "tonic" form. Moreover, if you change the role of the correlating element, e.g. make it an object, does the case of the pronoun change? The relevant examples would be (5), where the correlate is a direct object, and (6), where it is an indirect object.

Connected to this, how would the answers to the question in (7), (8), and (9) look like?

(7) Who wants some ice cream? --
(a) Me!
(b) Her!
(c) Him!
(d) Us!
(e) Them!

(8) Who did Mary see at the train station? --
(a) Me!
(b) Her!
(c) Him!
(d) Us!
(e) Them!

(9) Who did Peter give the money to? --
(a) To me!
(b) To her!
(c) To him!
(d) To us!
(e) To them!


I would be very happy if you could help me out with that. If you like, I could also acknowledge your contribution by naming you in the paper. For further questions, feel free to ask. You can also contact me under andrea06@uni-potsdam.de. Below, you can find a template for the answers since, I guess, it would be annoying to number them yourself.

Best regards,
Andreas Schmidt

(7)
(a)
(b)
(c)
(d)
(e)

(8)
(a)
(b)
(c)
(d)
(e)

(9)
(a)
(b)
(c)
(d)
(e)

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Reinder
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Re: Right peripheral pronouns in Frisian

Postby Reinder » 2013-08-16, 18:26

I'm afraid I don't fully understand you, but I'll be glad to answer your questions. I'm a native speaker of West Frisian. I'm not really an expert in grammar, but I'll be glad to answer your questions, I can also do some research for you on grammar if needed. :)

cataphor wrote:(1) [Talking about some sort of potatoes] They cook fast, them.
(2) She's a liar, her.
(3) I payed him, me.
(4) That's great, that!
(5) We met Lisa at the train station, her.
(6) Mary talked to Peter last saturday night, to him.
I don't think we have such constructions in West Frisian, I've never heard them and it would be weird to use them.

(7) Wa wol in iisko? --
(a) Ik! (nominative)
(b) Sy! (nominative)
(c) Hy! (nominative)
(d) Wy! (nominative)
(e) Sy! (nominative)

(8) Wa hat Mary sjoen op it treinstasjon? --
(a) My!
(b) Har!
(c) Him!
(d) Us!
(e) Har*!

(9) Oan wa hat Peter it jild jûn? --
(a) Oan my!
(b) Oan har!
(c) Oan him!
(d) Oan ús!
(e) Oan har*!

* 'harren' would be an alternative of 'har', but instead you'll hear 'hun' being used in daily life.
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cataphor
Posts: 53
Joined: 2013-03-06, 9:48
Real Name: Andreas
Gender: male
Country: DE Germany (Deutschland)

Re: Right peripheral pronouns in Frisian

Postby cataphor » 2013-08-17, 8:00

Thank you for your reply! I wondered whether Frisian has this construction because neither Dutch nor German allows it. But then again, standard English does not exhibit this structure as well but some if its dialects do. So I figured, it might very well occur in at least one of the German dialects. But I had no luck yet: several south German and middle German ones don't allow it - I guess it's banned from every German dialect. The relevant structure would then be something like in (3) and (4), maybe with a demonstrative instead of a non-demonstrative, like in (1). It is important that the pronoun to the right is not stressed, as it would be in (2)

(1) Der spinnt ja wohl, der!
(2) A: Peter hat da ja ne tolle Idee gehabt. --
B: ICH hatte diese Idee! ICH (und nicht er)!

(3) Hy wol en iisko, hy!
(4) Ik hat Mary sjoen op it treinstasjon, har.


However, when you're puzzled it's a sign that Frisian does not have the relevant structure. So, thanks for your reply!

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Re: Right peripheral pronouns in Frisian

Postby Reinder » 2013-08-21, 17:39

cataphor wrote:Thank you for your reply! I wondered whether Frisian has this construction because neither Dutch nor German allows it. But then again, standard English does not exhibit this structure as well but some if its dialects do. So I figured, it might very well occur in at least one of the German dialects. But I had no luck yet: several south German and middle German ones don't allow it - I guess it's banned from every German dialect. The relevant structure would then be something like in (3) and (4), maybe with a demonstrative instead of a non-demonstrative, like in (1). It is important that the pronoun to the right is not stressed, as it would be in (2)

(1) Der spinnt ja wohl, der!
(2) A: Peter hat da ja ne tolle Idee gehabt. --
B: ICH hatte diese Idee! ICH (und nicht er)!

(3) Hy wol en iisko, hy!
(4) Ik haw Mary sjoen op it treinstasjon, har.


However, when you're puzzled it's a sign that Frisian does not have the relevant structure. So, thanks for your reply!
Yeah, it appears Frisian doesn't have this kind of structure. It's the same as in German, option (2) would be possible, using "he there" (hy dêr) would be a good possibility, but the special structure which occurs in some English dialects is completely foreign to me. But it's possible that in some rare dialects it might be used or maybe in one of the other two Frisian languages.
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