Please identify the language

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IpseDixit
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Re: Please identify the language

Postby IpseDixit » 2016-11-16, 23:12

il voltoro wrote:ʃuntʰu xɑtʃi kʰørydɛʃ dʒɑbɛ ryntʃy fɑn dɑrɛ kʰɑ bɛrizɑ kʰɑ tʰørø tʃɛlɛ dʒɑŋ ʃɑmɑ dɛdɛdɛ biri zɑn xɑtʃobɑn buʃ kʰɑpʰotʃɛdɑ bɛtʰi xɛboro ʃili xɑkʰɑridʒɑ mɑtʰɑ pʰotʃɛŋkʰɑ bɑlɑzɑdɛ dʒurɑ dʒurɑ kʰɛpʰitʰi nɑʃokʰu zɑtɑ xɑbɑrɑtʰɛ ørøsɛn ʃɑbuli mɑdʒirɑ dɛ ʃili kʰɑ kytʰɛŋ tʃøpʰitʰɛ gørymɛn nørynøry biritʃɑtʰɑrɛŋ gɑ dʒɑlɛpʰɑʃ bitʰukʰudu xɑkʰtʰɑrɑn dɑrɑm pʰurɑniŋ giriŋ kʰurɑ tʃɑlɑl mɑxɑtʃi bɛrɛtʰɛpʰu dʒørøkʰ fɑn dʒɑkɑʃ zɑn tʰymylybyrɛŋ kʰɛrɛl ibɑrɡɑn tʃor udokʰu dɑrɑdɑrɑdɑrɑ kʰɑbu gɑ ørødɛn lɑrɑrɑŋ tʃibɑ dorobu kʰoru xɑtʰi buluʃ tʃɑkʰu gorudʒɛ nɛ bɑdɛrɛpʰu tʃɛry xɑlibɛ zoru fɑrɛm lɑdʒikʰɑ


Those words with a lot of front rounded vowels (i.e: tʰymylybyrɛŋ, nørynøry, ørødɛn, tʰørø) remind me of Turkish, I doubt it's Turkish though, but maybe it could be another Turkic language like Kazakh*, Turkmen or Uighur, after all you said that the two men were Asian, and the people from those places are quite Asian-looking.

*According to Wikipedia, Kazakh has /ʉ/, not /y/, but I guess the two can be easily confused if your ears are not trained to distinguishing them.

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Re: Please identify the language

Postby vijayjohn » 2016-11-17, 0:45

Mongolian?

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Re: Please identify the language

Postby Vlürch » 2016-11-17, 19:22

IpseDixit wrote:Those words with a lot of front rounded vowels (i.e: tʰymylybyrɛŋ, nørynøry, ørødɛn, tʰørø) remind me of Turkish, I doubt it's Turkish though, but maybe it could be another Turkic language like Kazakh*, Turkmen or Uighur

Now that you said it, it does seem like some Turkic language! I don't think it's Kazakh, no idea about Turkmen or Uyghur, but for some reason I feel like it could be Kyrgyz or Khakas or something; maybe even Tuvan, Yakut or Altai?

kʰørydɛʃ =  (ky) көрүү - to see; something to do with vision?
dʒɑbɛ =  (ky) жабуу - to close; something about closing?
dʒɑŋ =  (ky) жаңы /  (kk) жаңа - new

I can't be arsed more, since the words that seem familiar don't really make sense together in the context, and that's only a few words to begin with; I mean, some of the words seem like Turkish or another western Turkic language, like [xɑtʃi] ( (tr) haç - cross) and [gørymɛn] ( (tr) görmek - to see; I don't know what kind of conjugation "görümen" is, but googling it does give a bunch of results, so apparently it exists even in Turkish), but what language would have some features of western/southern Turkic languages while otherwise seeming more like an eastern/northern Turkic language? Is either Turkmen or Uyghur like that?
vijayjohn wrote:Mongolian?

But isn't Mongolian /l/ pretty much always [ɮ~ɬ]?

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Re: Please identify the language

Postby vijayjohn » 2016-11-18, 0:50

Vlürch wrote:Now that you said it, it does seem like some Turkic language!

I speak one, and it doesn't to me.
vijayjohn wrote:Mongolian?

But isn't Mongolian /l/ pretty much always [ɮ~ɬ]?

Yeah, apparently, but that doesn't necessarily mean you'd notice it if you heard it.

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Re: Please identify the language

Postby mōdgethanc » 2016-11-19, 7:47

Mongolian doesn't have front rounded vowels. The vowels you see written with umlaut were once front but are now retracted or something.

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Re: Please identify the language

Postby vijayjohn » 2016-11-19, 14:36

Yeah, that's true. Hmm...

All those aspirated consonants are bothering me for some reason and kind of pointing me towards Persian or Armenian or something, but neither of those have front rounded vowels, either...Maybe I'm wrong and it is some Turkic language after all? But then what kind of Turkic language has or sounds like it has a lot of aspirates?

Or maybe it's Chechen?

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Re: Please identify the language

Postby opipik » 2016-11-19, 17:54

Could be Tuvan or a dialect of Mongolian.

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Re: Please identify the language

Postby linguoboy » 2016-11-19, 18:46

vijayjohn wrote:All those aspirated consonants are bothering me for some reason and kind of pointing me towards Persian or Armenian or something, but neither of those have front rounded vowels, either...

There are absolutely varieties of Armenian with front rounded vowels. Standard WA has /y/ and there are varieties of it which acquired /ø/ under Turkish influence.

That said, nothing about this makes me think it Armenian of any sort.
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Re: Please identify the language

Postby vijayjohn » 2016-11-19, 18:59

opipik wrote:Could be Tuvan or a dialect of Mongolian.

This text has a lot of [kʰ] in it, though, which I'm not sure Tuvan could be perceived to have.

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Re: Please identify the language

Postby Vlürch » 2016-11-24, 22:51

vijayjohn wrote:
opipik wrote:Could be Tuvan or a dialect of Mongolian.

This text has a lot of [kʰ] in it, though, which I'm not sure Tuvan could be perceived to have.

Why couldn't Tuvan have [kʰ], though? It's had so much influence from Mongolian, the /k/ being aspirated would make sense given that the other phonemic voiced stops are apparently often realised as voiceless unaspirated ones; if the /g/ is [k] often enough, /k/ would pretty much have to be [kʰ] for them to remain distinct, right?
vijayjohn wrote:Or maybe it's Chechen?

But if it was Chechen or any other Caucasian language, there'd be at least a few ejectives, right? I'm still not 100% convinced it's not some weird Korean dialect, though, even if it doesn't really seem like Korean at all; just something about it makes me think of Korean, I'm not even sure what.

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Re: Please identify the language

Postby vijayjohn » 2016-11-25, 1:25

Vlürch wrote:
vijayjohn wrote:
opipik wrote:Could be Tuvan or a dialect of Mongolian.

This text has a lot of [kʰ] in it, though, which I'm not sure Tuvan could be perceived to have.

Why couldn't Tuvan have [kʰ], though?

Maybe it just doesn't?
But if it was Chechen or any other Caucasian language, there'd be at least a few ejectives, right?

Yeah, but that doesn't mean they'd necessarily be salient to a foreign ear. To give you an example, I've posted songs in all sorts of Caucasian languages and never once heard an ejective in any of them (granted, songs are not spoken language or whatever, and again, this does not mean the songs didn't have ejectives, only that I couldn't hear them).
I'm still not 100% convinced it's not some weird Korean dialect, though, even if it doesn't really seem like Korean at all; just something about it makes me think of Korean, I'm not even sure what.

[kʰørydɛʃ]? :P (Or perhaps the [ʃ]s and words ending with [m] and [ŋ]).
Last edited by vijayjohn on 2016-11-28, 7:39, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Please identify the language

Postby September » 2016-11-28, 7:32

Althor99 wrote:Hi all!Hope you can help me!
"Landi av leysa Landi av Hetja Landi at gaf oss hoppas ok minni..."Could anyone confirm if this is realy Old Norse/Norrønt? It says "Land that gave us hope and memories" Found it on a website, and i m not sure if it really is. I know the translation but i need confirmation because i cant find that this is Old Norse anywhere but on that website.
It s from a song called Song of Exile.
I would appreciate any help from Scandinavian folks :D or anyone who studies Scandinavian languages. Thanks! Cheers!

website: http://lyricstranslate.com/en/song-exile-we-will-go-home-song-exile-we-will-go-home.html

P.S. If anyone knows a Norwegian or Swedish translation they could put it in reply. I have grown not to trust Google Translate so i would apreciate a translation from a real person. :D

Definitely not Norse. It's a scramble of all the Northern Germanic languages with weird grammar.

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Re: Please identify the language

Postby Johanna » 2016-12-03, 12:06

September wrote:
Althor99 wrote:Hi all!Hope you can help me!
"Landi av leysa Landi av Hetja Landi at gaf oss hoppas ok minni..."Could anyone confirm if this is realy Old Norse/Norrønt? It says "Land that gave us hope and memories" Found it on a website, and i m not sure if it really is. I know the translation but i need confirmation because i cant find that this is Old Norse anywhere but on that website.
It s from a song called Song of Exile.
I would appreciate any help from Scandinavian folks :D or anyone who studies Scandinavian languages. Thanks! Cheers!

website: http://lyricstranslate.com/en/song-exile-we-will-go-home-song-exile-we-will-go-home.html

P.S. If anyone knows a Norwegian or Swedish translation they could put it in reply. I have grown not to trust Google Translate so i would apreciate a translation from a real person. :D

Definitely not Norse. It's a scramble of all the Northern Germanic languages with weird grammar.

Or a machine translation... Landi is dative, but it makes no sense since it's the subject. Also "hoppas" is Modern Swedish as far as I know, the -s was -st in Old Norse, and it's a verb where the English translation has a noun.

In Swedish "Land that gave us hope and memories" would be Land som gav oss hopp och minnen, although it would sound better with landet at the beginning ("the land"). In Bokmål it should be pretty much the same, barring some minor differences in spelling, and I think the same is true for Nynorsk.
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Re: Please identify the language

Postby Sasabasa » 2017-01-15, 16:31

Iron Man

I know the main villain spoke Urdu, but when he sends his henchman to capture the scientist and Stark, the guy speaks some language and the scientist says it's something like Hungarian. It just doesn't sound like it though. So what is it?
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Re: Please identify the language

Postby mōdgethanc » 2017-01-16, 2:29

http://thelousylinguist.blogspot.ca/2008/05/iron-man-linguistics.html

If you skip all the crap about how improbable it is that Afghan terrorists would know Hungarian and how Hungary is proud nation who would not ever be terrorist, it looks like it really is just (badly pronounced) Hungarian.

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Re: Please identify the language

Postby Vlürch » 2017-01-18, 11:06

mōdgethanc wrote:http://thelousylinguist.blogspot.ca/2008/05/iron-man-linguistics.html

If you skip all the crap about how improbable it is that Afghan terrorists would know Hungarian and how Hungary is proud nation who would not ever be terrorist, it looks like it really is just (badly pronounced) Hungarian.

The ability of Hungarians to be offended by everything never ceases to amaze me. :D

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Re: Please identify the language

Postby vijayjohn » 2017-01-21, 16:54

Vlürch wrote:The ability of Hungarians to be offended by everything never ceases to amaze me. :D

Is it that they're genuinely offended or that they just like acting like they are? I remember this lady of partial Hungarian descent who was learning Hungarian (and kind of self-identified as Magyar/Hungarian) and hung out with a lot of Hungarians online telling me that it's a thing among Hungarians to hold "extremely strong opinions even when" they have "absolutely no idea what the fuck" they're talking about. (She also said, "Put two Hungarians together, and you get five opinions, or something like that" :lol:).

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Re: Please identify the language

Postby linguoboy » 2017-01-21, 18:29

vijayjohn wrote:(She also said, "Put two Hungarians together, and you get five opinions, or something like that" :lol:).

"Two Jews, three opinions" is a well-worn Ashkenazi saying. I guess the Magyars are trying to outdo them.
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Re: Please identify the language

Postby mōdgethanc » 2017-01-21, 22:31

vijayjohn wrote:Is it that they're genuinely offended or that they just like acting like they are? I remember this lady of partial Hungarian descent who was learning Hungarian (and kind of self-identified as Magyar/Hungarian) and hung out with a lot of Hungarians online telling me that it's a thing among Hungarians to hold "extremely strong opinions even when" they have "absolutely no idea what the fuck" they're talking about. (She also said, "Put two Hungarians together, and you get five opinions, or something like that" :lol:).
Seems like they picked the wrong semi-obscure language for a throwaway joke in an action blockbuster.

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Re: Please identify the language

Postby Sasabasa » 2017-01-26, 10:29

If I was Hungarian, I'd be more upset about the Whole Ten Yards. Those gangsters are portrayed as if all the Hungarian people lived in the country. And is Strabo Gogolak even Hungarian name? :)

When it comes to Iron Man, the scientist said that Ten Rings was a multinational terrorist organization, so I don't find it weird that the guy spoke Hungarian.

What about the Beautician and the Beast? Fictional country Slovecia where Czech text is seen. Dictatorship worse than a communist regime (no union) etc. It's a friggin' movie goddammit!
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